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Local long rest spots, Random encounters - This just has to be in. I really dislike the teleport to camp jump, it's so immersion breaking.

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It is odd that if you're in the Underdark , for example, you would walk all the way back outside to camp then walk all the way back to where you were.

Last edited by Veilburner; 04/12/20 05:47 PM. Reason: Typo
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Originally Posted by Veilburner
If is odd that if you're in the Underdark , for example, you would walk all the way back outside to camp then walk all the way back to where you were.

When I first jumped into the Underdark I had *no idea* where I was or how to get back to the surface.

It was thrilling.

Then I realized I could just click a button to teleport back to camp. Immersion and excitement... *poof*

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I really hate the camping method, its the thing I dislike most and even makes me not want to play. I played many hours pre patch messing around and having fun, but now I will wait til the game is finished and its either changed or someone makes mod to fix it.

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Originally Posted by RumRunner151
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
I'm just confused as to how endless feedback poured in about the rest system in general, and how short rests are pointless when you can endlessly abuse long rests, and the ultimate solution after months of complaints were to give us two short rests. That decision very much feels like a massive corporation cracking open their dusty employee suggestion box twice a year, and it's packed to the brim with legitimate concerns and suggestions that are easy to implement, and corporate's response to all of it is to add another K-Cup flavor into the rotation. Like having the option for a "Sumatra Breakfast Blend" really addresses the fact that Todd from IT is repeatedly caught in the women's bathroom.


I love your example in spite of disagreeing with you.
1) You can use the system however you want. You can choose how often to rest. Others can choose differently. When I play, I have certain rules I follow like no barrelmancy even though I could. Think the rest system is too permissible? Clamp it down in your rules.
2) Keep in mind combat in CRPG is different from PnP. In PnP, Wizards have way more utility and creative choices. Limit their rest too much in CRPGs and they become ineffective. It's not apples to apples.


I feel like there's a middle ground here that other games have found. Camping Supplies. Short rests are free, camping requires supplies. Hold a max of 4 at a time or something, don't spread them too thin out in the world and make them available in shops. Now there's this other tiny layer of management and mindfulness that isn't obtrusive, and it trains you to be just slightly more conservative with long rest abuse.


I don't want to fall to bits 'cos of excess existential thought.

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Originally Posted by Veilburner
It is odd that if you're in the Underdark , for example, you would walk all the way back outside to camp then walk all the way back to where you were.


Totally, like the Fellowship of the Ring heading back to Rivendell to sleep each night.

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I feel like one minor tweak could help this issue quite a bit: when you finish sleeping at the camp don't teleport the party back to exactly where it was. Have the party choose a nearby waypoint. That would discourage camping during a dungeon dive a bit, but you'd still be free to do so if you were ok to then go back to the nearest waypoint.

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Originally Posted by Dark_Ansem
I believe this is an issue related to the lack of a proper day-night cycle, and related consequences.


I concur with this. I think it was Larian's way of making sure you are technically getting 1 long rest a day. Since using it "ends the day" you are always camping at night. So even though a player can spam this as much as they want, apparently in game logic is they lounged around for most of the day after having one fight and retired to camp for the evening.

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Originally Posted by wtrboy
Camping is simply too easy; I can be walking through the underdark and with a mouse click be magically transported to camp... and back to the underdark...really breaks the immersion and makes the game too easy. Please find a way to make camping more realistic and integrated with the gameplay.

Thank you,


YES!!!!!!

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As someone who dates from the original 1970s era D&D game system and who has played most every decent RPG based around that system, I quite agree that Larian needs to do away with infinite-camping whenever you-want.

It makes the game much too easy. It is nothing like pen and paper D&D in any of it's incarnations, and the original thread poster is of course, completely wrong about other games not having limitations on camping/travel. Most games do, because, the passage of time becomes completely meaningless, and the whole world becomes silly and abstract and distance irrelevant, if you can just instantly zap to camp to totally recharge at will so that you basically fight each big fight at full strength. That's just stupid and counter to what D&D is even about. The rules/spells are designed so that one has to husband one's spells, to use their head, to play wisely and strategically with future fights in mind.

It is the single most immersion crippling artifice in the game currently, and I do imagine it is temporary, since it really wrecks any pretense at calling this a D&D based game, and the game is of course, far from finished.

I actually enjoy the simple "it's day until you decide to camp" practice. After all, we are beings who are active in the day and sleep at night. It's natural, and a clever design idea. If the maps were a lot larger, this would not work. But, seeing as the distances traveled are fairly minimal, the "camping at end of day" idea actually works pretty well, in my opinion.

What needs to change, I think, are the following.

1. Fast travel should be limited some, either to a MUCH longer range away from enemy owned areas, or, (this would be my choice), having to travel on foot back to the nearest teleport gimmick. A forced march hardcore version for purists like me would actually be fine as an option.

2. Overnight camping should have a TIMER, to keep people from recharging after each fight, or, why even pretend it's a D&D based game? Leave the ability to teleport to camp in for crafting chores, but base the actual full rest on when the sleeping bags were last used.

3. For added "realism", add one full-rest on site option using portable sleeping bags and campfires anywhere you want to try it, with variable chances for encounters while asleep. Add the ability to set one character as a "guard" to avoid surprise. THIS will add a huge amount of a feeling of a D&D session, as well as much, much more immersion. If the campers are dumb enough to camp inside the gobbie village, good luck on that.

This would make the idea of keeping slogging along viable, add a lot of realism to the notion of adventuring and terrain actually existing, without running out of spells entirely deep in places like the Underdark.

4. Let the dog come along with his own cute little backpack as an extra bearer of goods. At higher levels, add a tiny cart for him, and perhaps a mate, to pull with more goods. We did this all the time in my pen and paper campaigns. It would allow for longer excursions.

5. The whole growing camp as an organic, natural and expanding place is a wonderful idea. It will be great have "buyable" crafting stations in game, merchants you can host there at the camp, and an influx of visitors- adventurers needing supplies, more party/holiday events, placeable unique trophy items to personalize one's camp. There really needs to be things to spend money on, and expensive crafting stations will help that problem.

My two coppers on this subject.

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Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Originally Posted by RumRunner151
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
I'm just confused as to how endless feedback poured in about the rest system in general, and how short rests are pointless when you can endlessly abuse long rests, and the ultimate solution after months of complaints were to give us two short rests. That decision very much feels like a massive corporation cracking open their dusty employee suggestion box twice a year, and it's packed to the brim with legitimate concerns and suggestions that are easy to implement, and corporate's response to all of it is to add another K-Cup flavor into the rotation. Like having the option for a "Sumatra Breakfast Blend" really addresses the fact that Todd from IT is repeatedly caught in the women's bathroom.


I love your example in spite of disagreeing with you.
1) You can use the system however you want. You can choose how often to rest. Others can choose differently. When I play, I have certain rules I follow like no barrelmancy even though I could. Think the rest system is too permissible? Clamp it down in your rules.
2) Keep in mind combat in CRPG is different from PnP. In PnP, Wizards have way more utility and creative choices. Limit their rest too much in CRPGs and they become ineffective. It's not apples to apples.


I feel like there's a middle ground here that other games have found. Camping Supplies. Short rests are free, camping requires supplies. Hold a max of 4 at a time or something, don't spread them too thin out in the world and make them available in shops. Now there's this other tiny layer of management and mindfulness that isn't obtrusive, and it trains you to be just slightly more conservative with long rest abuse.


This system was PoE but it didn't work. Nothing was true limiting, the only thing it did was force players to come back frequently for supplies.
System itself wasn't well received by players and it was removed in sequel.



Last edited by Rhobar121; 04/12/20 09:06 PM.
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Originally Posted by Rhobar121

This system was PoE but it didn't work. Nothing was true limiting, the only thing it did was force players to come back frequently for supplies.
System itself wasn't well received by players and it was removed in sequel.

It is good though to mention how camping/resting worked in PoE2.

a) Characters could receive injuries in combat (generally from falling at zero HP or less). This was the main reason for resting (spells were recovered after every fight).

b) Many areas disallowed camping/resting, notably when hostile creatures remained on your local map/area.

c) You needed food/drink when resting, which was very common and it was mostly about choosing what long buff you would gain from resting (in addition to removing injuries).

Note : there is a visible concept of date/time in Pillars of Eternity 1-2. Whereas Larian's engine does not have an overt time system: it is event-triggered or situational.

In BG3, food could also be used for resting and other limits. Short rests could be temporary local campfires that could trigger some companion dialogues.

Last edited by Baraz; 04/12/20 11:31 PM.
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Camping is just too sleezy.

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I feel like camping in the outdoors works well enough, although should require some resources as noted by several folk, to avoid spamming. Perhaps the only time food allows you to heal is at camp. However I’d like to see other options as well, which I’m sure will happen as the game progresses – staying in inns, perhaps being guests at other camps or keeps etc.

However, I really think the underdark and other large dungeons or caverns should be more about survival. You can short rest but not long rest within, that’s when you need to manage your resources (potions etc) to get through. Sure, you could walk your way back out and long rest, but not just teleport in and out willy-nilly.

Last edited by LukasPrism; 04/12/20 11:45 PM.
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If camping gets more limitations they better buff spells. Increasing HP to deal with the AC issues will mean if you have limited spell slots you will NEVER use a spell that requires the target to roll, say, wisdom since that hasn't been adjusted and is still as hard to hit with without doing more damage.

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If they are going to keep the current camp system as it is, then the camp background should change to at least look like whatever area/zone you're currently in.

The camp always looking the same is really weird, but I think it should be restricted outside of certain safe zones. But then that is an issue because you can just fast travel to a safe zone and camp and then go back, like how it is restricted with Ethel's house.

You can still travel away and then use the fast travel back outside her house and go back in. It takes a few more minutes, but you can get around the restriction. Fast travel should also be eliminated unless you get back to one of those rune spots.

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I wish there was a limited amount of camping we can do just to add a little more tension.

We got tadpoles that will kill us otherwise so we shouldn't be able to spam camping after every fight.

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