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Okay, I understand the irony of myself making this thread, considering how certain factions of this forum may feel about my highly critical posts and may have lumped me in with the 'doing nothing but doomposting' crowd in recent days. But I understand perception is different among each member of this forum, and ultimately the best choice for me is to simply choose not to care about said irony.

I think before the advent of D:OS2 and this game, cRPGs were largely a niche genre, restricted to isometric viewpoints that were seemingly lower budget in comparison. And BG3 *is* doing its job at attracting new attention to the genre in general, for a game series that had been dormant for the better part of two entire decades. (Okay, some people can argue about exactly how valid that is and that cRPGs were in a resurgence regardless of whatever impact Larian's recent games had, but I struggle to think of any other cRPGs that have sold as much as D:OS2 and BG3 did in a short amount of time. Pillars of Eternity didn't exactly light the world on fire, even if I've seen some arguments leading up to PoE2's release try to credit it for an earlier resurgence, usually in some weird ass RTwP VS turn-based spat to detract from D:OS2's impact on the gaming community at large.)

I have a friend from FFXIV with zero cRPG or DnD experience that I legitimately never expected to get into BG3 let alone any serious cRPG, only because one of his favorite streamers began playing it on a whim and the introduction sequence hooked him. Now he asks me questions about how the systems work, he's deep into the lore, and that his greatest wish is for Paladin to be implemented because he recognizes that the flavor of it is almost like his own Paladin in FFXIV (and also realizing that DnD is basically the progenitor of all modern RPGs in some way). Granted, adapting to something like this would have probably been too difficult for a newcomer like him and many others, if it weren't for some of the adjustments Larian made such as all of the bonus action healing sources, which is why I quite frankly consider that to be an acceptable concession rather than an actual balancing problem.

The game is also quite gorgeous. Most games of any genre would struggle to look this good, and it's probably one of the only games I've played where facial features didn't dip straight into uncanny valley territory no matter what. Though of course, the increased graphical fidelity makes it harder to program things in general, but that's something everyone should already know and understand in regards to feedback. The devs' commentary on the whole generic Tav stuff was pretty funny, though admittedly my own character kind of looked like that too, only because he was meant to emulate my Bard from FFXIV. (Zero guesses as to what class I want to be implemented the most.)

The companion writing is also quite good. I have grievances with some of them, but they are a matter of personal opinion on their viewpoints rather than being legitimately poorly written. I came into this game thinking I would hate Shadowheart because she seemed like some edgy evil big tiddy goth cleric, but it turns out she's just practical and has actual standards, and she's probably the only party member out of all the ones introduced so far that I would consider permanently keeping in my party once the full game is ready. (Honestly, I never understood why people thought she was initially too negative with her approval.)

Field effects *are* a rather novel tactical idea and I would argue that they do have a place in DnD-based gameplay in some way, though I would personally disagree on the specific ways it's currently implemented at the moment. Most other games would simply not try, and it means a lot to even make an attempt. I've noticed the recently announced Square-Enix game Triangle Strategy is actually incorporating elements of that, in a way that is clearly direct inspiration from D:OS2 and BG3, and it can only mean a good thing for the future of tactical RPGs at large.

Last edited by Saito Hikari; 21/02/21 09:28 PM.
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I agree.

The job they're doing with this wonderfull 3D is incredible. The game is absolutely beautifull.

I'm not a fan of a few visual effects and I really don't like the UI but the visual aspect in general is very impressive. The facial animations are incredible and Larian brings the genre to a new graphical level.

I'm also not a fan of cutscenes everywhere especially because I'm not playing in EN. I can't enjoy them because I have to look at the bottom of the screen reading subtitles but this is beautifull.

The verticality is also something very interresting. I can be very critical about how it works, but it has a huge potential. It was the same in DoS but I also really enjoy the concept of surfaces. I'm one of those thinking Larian is doing too much of everything but they obviously bring very interresting concept and mechanics in the genre.

I'm not a MP player but I also can imagine that this game will be way more enjoyable with friends than any other classic CRPGs.

That's all I can do smile

Last edited by Maximuuus; 21/02/21 09:03 AM.
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I agree with you OP. To be honest, I think that Larian is trying to attract new players to the genre, such as your friend, and not to please the old ones.
I've seen posts here that say, "I wish they'd spent this money on mechanics, not cinematic inserts" like if BG3 looked like a normal traditional CRPG u know.

I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but then they wouldn't be able to attract new people.

And you are absolutely right when you say that 'cRPGs were largely a niche genre'. I think Larian is trying to change that.


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I can only praise the 3d assets they have. Especially the hair is really well done considering its a iso-game that isn't focused on close ups - as someone working in this field I'm nothing short of impressed.

I like the voiceovers. I like the actors and they do a fine job.

The idea of having as many options to solve/approach things is commendable.



Sadly, everything else I can't praise. We will see how cinematics end up, right now I'm quite certain they are still doing incremental changes to them so they might turn out great. Though story, writing,... I don't judge these before I see the end result, but the companions have only managed to annoy me so far - its the first game of this kind where I'm hoping for a complete custom party.

Larian gameplay to me is one of the worst in the business since DOS2. Individual ideas like surfaces sound fun, but the way they implement them is atrocious for me. Overall its just ideas thrown into a pot with far too little attention to detail how they interact. So yeah, no praise from me for anything gameplay related.

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Many good aspects to BG3 no doubt. If I didn't see the potential, I wouldn't bother criticizing the aspects I feel are not so good or downright detrimental.

I rather enjoyed DOS2 and much of the gameplay. But seems to me Larian is making BG3 more "DOS" than even DOS2. More cheesy silliness than ever before. When there is so much D&D material I would love to see added, dubious and wasteful design decisions are harder to accept. Throwing boots is good for a laugh once if that. Throwing enemies onto other enemies far away like they were spears. Shove becoming a bonus I-win-button even against towering huge enemies who seemingly are light as feathers yet fall as rocks. Dipping weapons in everburning candles stored in your magically shared backpack freely accessible in combat. Moar and bigger barrelmancy shenanigans. Bulls climbing ladders. As critical as I am of this "fun", I actually like much of it. It's the implementations and scale that are too often poorly conceived. Even for early access. It could have been done with more regard towards balance and immersion just by not making these things a core mechanic, but rather a situational tactical option.

Otherwise, a mostly great game sure smile

Last edited by Seraphael; 21/02/21 12:06 PM.
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I love the story and the atmosphere of the game. I like darker storylines.
The game does look really good.

And op:I don't think, it is strange if someone makes a critical and a positive thread. Your post show, that you are passionate about the game.


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Agreed, it does look great. Perhaps a little too sunny though? laugh

There were also some lovely instances in-game, I forget what exactly but I know they happened! Probably finding little unexpected things, stuff like that.

It makes me sad that currently there is little else I can praise about the game from a personal point of view.

Originally Posted by Nyloth
I agree with you OP. To be honest, I think that Larian is trying to attract new players to the genre, such as your friend, and not to please the old ones.
I've seen posts here that say, "I wish they'd spent this money on mechanics, not cinematic inserts" like if BG3 looked like a normal traditional CRPG u know.

I'm not saying it's a bad thing, but then they wouldn't be able to attract new people.

And you are absolutely right when you say that 'cRPGs were largely a niche genre'. I think Larian is trying to change that.

It's always good to bring in new players, that is a given, but if all it takes to attract them is fancy cinematics then I can only assume that they will, for the most part, have their head turned by the next pretty thing that comes along (obviously there will be exceptions here, such as Saito's friend, who has clearly fallen for the lore, etc.).

It just feels like a fine line between trying too hard to attract a wider audience and neglecting what created a game people are playing 20 years later. Cinematics can be great but alone a great game they do not make.

I don't think cRPGs have been a niche genre for many, many years now so there's no need for Larian to try and reinvent the wheel.

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If there weren’t things that the game “does right, too” we wouldn’t be here to begin with.

No one would pay attention to a trash-tier production with not redeeming qualities.


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I never got invested in... I can't even remember the name, Sword Coast something, regardless, I never even got invested in it in the first place because it was obvious what shit show that game was from the start. I just let it pass by without notice.

I didn't have much hope for BG3 because I didn't like either DOS or DOS2 and was worried Larian would make BG3 the same. I got the EA out of curiosity anyway because of the Baldur's Gate brand. I joined the forums here because of how positively I was surprised by the game when I played it. Like others have already said, I don't criticise the game here because I dislike it. I criticise it because I like it and want it to be better.


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I agree. While I dislike some of BG3's features (especially party control, or rather lack of it), the game does some things better than the original series. From the recent update that would be the druids. I think it's great that Larian devs don't focus only on combat abilitites, but also gave the animal shapes the ability to talk to animals. Something that was missing from BG1 and 2, which had not reactivity towards shapeshifting.

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I don't disagree smile It's good to see a positive thread that isn't just fanfiction-esk or a reaction post.

the character models are very beautiful, the voice acting is very good and if they do indeed release a modding kit then this could be the modern NWN with player created content.

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Absolutely agree. I like that larian is not afraid of trying out new things (for example like the idea how they want to implement social magic and I enjoy the sandbox part Of their games if balanced right). I like the visuals and how everything looks and the already quite a lot of dialogue options and permutations happening during ea, which will probably go further. I can just repeat the others, if we would not like the foundation of the game we would not invest time to brainstorm on how it could be even better. Im in the camp who is looking for some options at least in full release to be able to change some of their homebrew rules I dont like (i wont list them here there are many threads about the common combat and resting complains), if they add options for those I feel this can be easily one of (If not the best) the best rpgs out there, for me and for many others.

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Originally Posted by Seraphael
Many good aspects to BG3 no doubt. If I didn't see the potential, I wouldn't bother criticizing the aspects I feel are not so good or downright detrimental.
Same

Originally Posted by Tuco
If there weren’t things that the game “does right, too” we wouldn’t be here to begin with.
Exactly

I really like the visuals and the environments here especially. Having multiple story paths is great as well, I don't feel forced into a particular path like most other games. I obviously have criticisms as well, but if I didn't care about this game being awesome I wouldn't bother posting them. The fact Larian was able to keep my interest in a TB game enough to play many hours also says a lot I think. smile I prefer fully real time combat.

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Yeah, it's turning out to be a wonderful interactive visual novel, right up there with the likes of Persona 5 and other terrible JRPGs.
I prefer to play my games, not watch them.


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The soundtrack is phenomenal. The visuals and voice acting are superb. The story premise is solid.

In terms of technology, I have no complaints for BG3.

That being said, when gameplay or gameplay mechanics are not up to par, it really shows. The remaining 10% of "RPG hall of fame" they are claiming the game will be is not that hard to achieve, but they need to be open to feedback, which seems they are not.

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The 3d world, the art design, the model/armour design, and voice work (that narrator... <3 ) are all quite good, without a doubt.

Which is why its important to discuss the rest of the things which do not meet that standard. smile

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Originally Posted by IrenicusBG3
The soundtrack is phenomenal. The visuals and voice acting are superb. The story premise is solid.

In terms of technology, I have no complaints for BG3.

That being said, when gameplay or gameplay mechanics are not up to par, it really shows. The remaining 10% of "RPG hall of fame" they are claiming the game will be is not that hard to achieve, but they need to be open to feedback, which seems they are not.
I feel the same.

The soundtrack is refreshing and miscellaneous sound effects don't get tiring as the game goes on. (Over 100 hours in)

The voice acting is great, whoever made the casting calls did an amazing job. I would literally have no patience for a vampire who tried to kill me and then tried to suck my blood, if it wasn't for the voice actor conveying who Astarion is as a character.

The visuals are a joy to look at. Similar to other recent games (BotW which was part real, part cartoon and D:OS2's blend), it's a blend of photoreal and tabletop set pieces. Some things aren't fully polished in patch 3 and they're still pleasing to the eye. Even when the wonky camera shoots off to a random section of the map, I'll find something pleasing to the eye.

The narrative is interesting and I love all the micro plot divergence that can be done with NPCs. Divergent NPC dialogue is not something I look for in a cRPG, but when something is executed this well I'm going to enjoy it.

Once combat is improved this game is going to be amazing. The whole reason I started writing in Larian's forums is I would like combat to be on the same level as the other aspects of Baldur's Gate 3.

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I always said BG3 is like a Michael Bay movie. I know, I know this seems like another critique but not all MB stuff is trash. Bay makes wonderful popcorn summer fare. His movies didn’t make billions for nothing. He does a bit too much camera rotations but his action sequences are usually well done.

BG3 visuals are outstanding. It’s flashy and even though I personally don’t like all the explosions, but when they do go off, it’s fun to watch.

The character art is great and generally avoids the uncanny valley feel. I think it’s because instead of going full blown realism, the character style and colors lean more cartoonish or animation style. I think it was a brilliant decision because all the character models look great (except humans, they need work) without making the audience feel uneasy. And I think it will stand the test of time better.

And the video game adaptation of ranger is well done. I don’t know the changes in favored enemy and natural explorer will work in tabletop but it works well in BG3. Way better than PHB.

The villains are done well. Stories ultimately rise and fall depending upon the villains and so far they’ve been decent. Ethel is awesome. Minthara is good. The mind flayers and the devil appear to be diabolical.

I also like the banter between companions. I wish there was more of it.

There’s more but that’s just what I think off the top of my head.

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Originally Posted by spectralhunter
I always said BG3 is like a Michael Bay movie. I know, I know this seems like another critique but not all MB stuff is trash. Bay makes wonderful popcorn summer fare. His movies didn’t make billions for nothing. He does a bit too much camera rotations but his action sequences are usually well done.
He really doesn't, and BG3 is much better than that. Just because it is AAA doesn't mean it is Michael Bay.

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Originally Posted by Icelyn
Originally Posted by spectralhunter
I always said BG3 is like a Michael Bay movie. I know, I know this seems like another critique but not all MB stuff is trash. Bay makes wonderful popcorn summer fare. His movies didn’t make billions for nothing. He does a bit too much camera rotations but his action sequences are usually well done.
He really doesn't, and BG3 is much better than that. Just because it is AAA doesn't mean it is Michael Bay.

Most barely have any semblance to a cohesive plot and lately he’s getting worse. But I liked The Rock and Bad Boys 1 was fun.

Armageddon was cheesy but I still enjoyed the visuals.

Summer movies are all about big budgets and big explosions. It’s silly fun, but fun nonetheless.

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