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GM4Him #760930 28/02/21 01:56 PM
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Yeah, the new beginning cutscene at night looks really weird compared to very shiny beach start. There at least should be some short animation for a time change. Generally I hope there will be some missions taken during night. Act 1 is ok, but they must do some work in the city if they want to make it real.

GM4Him #761010 28/02/21 05:32 PM
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The lack of a day/night cycle is just one of the many ways that this game mistreats the passage of time. There's also the lack of a coherent rest system and the fact that nothing in the world changes unless you are actively looking at it.

On the story side, everything starts out saying "Rush rush rush! Time is critically important! Pay attention to time!" and then we get the whiplash of "Nope, it's in stasis. I guess time doesn't matter at all. Just do whatever you want." I find it deeply unsatisfying.

I'm not suggesting that a game absolutely has to have a realistic sense of time in order to be engaging. However, when you have a game that is ostensibly based on D&D (where time is a key component) and where your storyline suggests that time management is important, you really need to address it. The story needs to work, and the mechanics need to work, and both of them need to work together; right now, I'd say they're falling flat on all three counts with respect to time.

GM4Him #761015 28/02/21 05:50 PM
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New cinematic looks cool. Tiefling looking into telescope during the day, alweys felt wrong. Beach scene just needs to get rid of falling animation.

Game realy needs to communicate passage of time more clearly. The whole campaign hook is revolving around race with time. 5 minute walk is supposed to represent a couple of hours travaling. There are 2 ways of making this representation obvious. Dynamic day/night cycle, or jump cuts.

I remember them saying that dynamic day/night cycle is hard to impliment in current engine. And requires new schedule for NPC.

If they split the map in much smaller pieces and put them on the world map it'll solve a whole lot of problems with narrative, rest intervals, and day/night cycle. Having 3-4 illumination, and NPC behavior templates for small maps is much easyer than creating dynamic day night cycle.

GM4Him #761094 28/02/21 11:14 PM
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To add to the discussion Faerun HAS a calendar called the calendar o Harptos, including all the months and festivals. All the lore exists.
Inhabitants of Faerun also divided the day into ten segments (Godswake, Harbright, Elsun, Thulsun...), you have magically auspicious times (Foredawn, Mornbright, Midmorn, Highmorn...).

Years are referred to by names, each name consistent across the Realms. Each kingdom or city-state numbers years differently, usually to measure the reign of a dynasty or the current monarch, or since the founding of the country. <...The result is a hodgepodge of overlapping numbers that serve to confuse the ordinary person and frustrate the sage.> Dalereckoning(DR), Cormyr Reckoning (CR), Tethyreckoning (TR) etc...

I dont know...Larian not including this in a BALDURS GATE game is just a major oversight to world building for AGAIN the sake of <convenience>.
Whatsmore as already mentioned the game story actually suits itself to have time cycles, your in a rush and time is of the essence.

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Last edited by mr_planescapist; 28/02/21 11:28 PM.
GM4Him #761098 28/02/21 11:31 PM
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It is really hard to imagine a D&D campaign with no night quests. I could imagine many RPGs without d/n cycle, but not BG.

And I don't recall any major CRPG without D/N cycle.

The new cutscene at night give a completely different feel.

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Originally Posted by Innateagle
I feel like the easiest thing they could do, if they don't want to implement a full day/night cycle, is advancing time after certain actions are taken, or after certain quests are completed. For example, once reached the grove, or coming out of the ruins after exploring them, time could advance to night. It'd make things somewhat less jarring, at least.
It's honestly almost hilarious how many convoluted solutions are being considered as a workaround about the fact that they refused to take the simpler approach from the beginning and include proper passage of time and a day/night cycle.
Triggers to switch between day and night arbitrarily, a separated instanced camp where your characters will rest and talk, etc, etc.
All of which can do just partially the job while feeling way more artificial in the process.

We are not even talking about cutting edge features, I should stress. The entire genre had been sporting day/night cycle as the standard since the Ultima series 30-40 years ago.


Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. You too can join the good fight HERE
Tuco #761233 01/03/21 09:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Tuco
This sounds a pretty arbitrary thing to complain about, given that most games do day/night cycles at different ratios (i.e. a full cycle may last 2, 4, 6 hours or more...) and in some cases it's even a customizable option.
Also, NO, definitely not a fan of "make believe" mechanics where you decide in your head what matters and what not and there are hardly any real in-game consequences.

I mean, I find the desire to have a day/night cycle to be pretty arbitrary too. These are opinions. They're all arbitrary because they're based in our preferences and what we personally consider immersive or not.

GM4Him #761234 01/03/21 09:41 AM
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Yes its quite ironic that what made RPGs what they are in the past is just being cut out for sake of convenience.
Actually I cant really think of any RPGs (apart from Larian games) who doest have basic day/night cycles...Common in 2021?!? And the follow up to one of the greatest RPG ever created?!
Whats even MORE ironic is that one of the main NPC is a VAMPIRE LOL.

But food yea, FOOD is ok. Everywhere, whenever and replenishes HP on demand.

Day/night cycle = TONS OF OPPORTUNITY for quests and interesting storylines, and huge atmosphere boost to your RPG. I just dont get why people think its of no value. Have you played Baldurs gate 2???
Its like saying, well, 4 playable npc is a bit much, don't see the value. ARBITRARY. ONE is plenty. More character development and better storyline. Or why even have more that 3 classes??? Magic, thief, and fighter is plenty. More focused skills!
Give me a break.

Last edited by mr_planescapist; 01/03/21 10:00 AM.
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Originally Posted by SaurianDruid
I mean, I find the desire to have a day/night cycle to be pretty arbitrary too. .
No, I meant it literally.
You said that days in games with a day /night cycle are too short, but that's simply not true if you make them longer, isn't it?

That said, not sure what' strikes you as so "arbitrary" about having a preference for consistency and verisimilitude over highly abstracted and convoluted subsystems like "We'll swap between day and night whenever we'll feel like".


Party control in Baldur's Gate 3 is a complete mess that begs to be addressed. You too can join the good fight HERE
Tuco #761242 01/03/21 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by Tuco
Originally Posted by Innateagle
I feel like the easiest thing they could do, if they don't want to implement a full day/night cycle, is advancing time after certain actions are taken, or after certain quests are completed. For example, once reached the grove, or coming out of the ruins after exploring them, time could advance to night. It'd make things somewhat less jarring, at least.
It's honestly almost hilarious how many convoluted solutions are being considered as a workaround about the fact that they refused to take the simpler approach from the beginning and include proper passage of time and a day/night cycle.
Triggers to switch between day and night arbitrarily, a separated instanced camp where your characters will rest and talk, etc, etc.
All of which can do just partially the job while feeling way more artificial in the process.

We are not even talking about cutting edge features, I should stress. The entire genre had been sporting day/night cycle as the standard since the Ultima series 30-40 years ago.

Yeah, i don't know. Like i said in another topic, i gotta wonder how Baldur's Gate itself will turn out without a proper day/night cycle.

GM4Him #761249 01/03/21 10:46 AM
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They should have just set the whole game in the Feywild, that way they'd have a 1 word response for every conceivable issue anyone might have. And we could all just assume its the sprites messing with our heads, or a quirk of the planes whenever time didn't pass or it never stopped raining in one spot or whatever hehe.

But yeah, I mean they've demonstrated they can reset the clock on the outside cutscene pretty effectively. I'd like the game to have a sky that I can look up at and see stars or the moon, or sunsets or clouds or anything really to look up at. If we could look up

GM4Him #761256 01/03/21 11:33 AM
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When Red Redemption 2 has more immersive features than your D&D based RPG, you know you are in trouble.

GM4Him #761292 01/03/21 02:04 PM
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But, again, this is more than just about day/night. Story is taking place only when ending day, which sucks.

Don't make me and day all the time in order to not miss out one story.

Tuco #761502 02/03/21 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Tuco
No, I meant it literally.
You said that days in games with a day /night cycle are too short, but that's simply not true if you make them longer, isn't it?

I've literally never played a game with accurate to real life day/night cycles. Probably because making them accurate to real life can easily make the cycle itself either largely irrelevant or disruptive of the gameplay, so that isn't necessarily good to have either.

That isn't to say a day/night cycle is never worth it. Depending on the game it can add quite a lot to the experience. But it is equally true that not all games necessarily benefit from a day/night cycle, and I am not sure BG3 is one of those games.

Originally Posted by Tuco
That said, not sure what' strikes you as so "arbitrary" about having a preference for consistency and verisimilitude over highly abstracted and convoluted subsystems like "We'll swap between day and night whenever we'll feel like".

The arbitrary part is because at the end of the day these are your preferences. Preferences are largely arbitrary by their nature. I am sure you have your personal reasons for having those preferences but that doesn't make your preferences founded in fact. So calling out my opinions as being arbitrary makes very little sense to me.

All gameplay is an abstraction. Even your proposed day/night cycle would most likely be an abstraction unless the duration of day and night sync up with the lengths of a day in Faerun, which I highly doubt it would.

So when my characters run around in the daytime of Faerun for 20-30 minutes and get tired and need to rest and it suddenly becomes night I am not perturbed by it because I understand it to be a gameplay abstraction to represent the passing of time.

Just like a day/night cycle in which daytime comes and goes in the span of 20-30 minutes.

They're both gameplay abstractions. It just comes down to which one you personally like more.

Last edited by SaurianDruid; 02/03/21 12:38 AM.
GM4Him #761503 02/03/21 12:38 AM
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I don’t mind not having a day/night cycle, as long as we do get to do some shenanigans at night. It would really suck if the whole game was in daylight when you’re outdoors. In DOS there were regions where the weather and time of day changed when you walked into them, and back again when you walked out. It was a bit strange at first but I got used it to quickly.

GM4Him #761505 02/03/21 12:43 AM
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It's pretty amazing just how much more immersed I get when there is weather and day/night.

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I'm still trying to understand what people actually mean when they say they want a day/night cycle...

What do you actually want the game to do? Have a dimmer switch that cycles between light and dark after an arbitrary period of time passes? (This is basically all it was in The Witcher 3.) I don't see how purely cosmetic day/night cycle is that immersive really.

What is the practical implication of "night" as you imagine it?

Originally Posted by IrenicusBG3
When Red Redemption 2 has more immersive features than your D&D based RPG, you know you are in trouble.
Complaining about Red Dead Redemption 2 being "more of an RPG" than Baldur's Gate 3. lol. So your complaint is that you want a different game entirely.

If immersion & simulation are the criteria you're using for your definition of an RPG, then Red Dead Redemption 2 is absolutely a hardcore roleplaying game from what I've seen of it. It's so hardcore when it comes to immersion that skinning animals and many other interactions take a painfully long amount of time so that they can be "realistic".

Some people don't like that. Some people like these things to be gamified. If I wanted a true-to-life simulation, I'd go outside and camp for real. lol.

Meanwhile, the Baldur's Gate series is not and never has been a "medieval life simulator" or RPG (by my interpretation of how you're using the term). If that's what you're looking for, I suggest you dust off your copy of RDR2, or maybe check out Kingdom Come: Deliverance or Mount & Blade 2 if you're looking for something more medieval.

Baldur's Gate 3 is more of a narrative game with a focus on Choice & Consequence. It has more in common with Bioware titles (such as Dragon Age, and... uh... Baldur's Gate) and Telltale titles (such as The Walking Dead), and other C&C games (eg Expeditions: Viking, Disco Elysium) than immersive games like Red Dead Redemption, Assassins Creed, Kingdom Come: Deliverance... or you know, Euro Truck Simulator.

Last edited by Ayvah; 02/03/21 01:18 AM.
Ayvah #761516 02/03/21 01:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Ayvah
I'm still trying to understand what people actually mean when they say they want a day/night cycle...

What do you actually want the game to do? Have a dimmer switch that cycles between light and dark after an arbitrary period of time passes? (This is basically all it was in The Witcher 3.) I don't see how purely cosmetic day/night cycle is that immersive really.

What is the practical implication of "night" as you imagine it?

Originally Posted by IrenicusBG3
When Red Redemption 2 has more immersive features than your D&D based RPG, you know you are in trouble.
Complaining about Red Dead Redemption 2 being "more of an RPG" than Baldur's Gate 3. lol. So your complaint is that you want a different game entirely.

If immersion & simulation are the criteria you're using for your definition of an RPG, then Red Dead Redemption 2 is absolutely a hardcore roleplaying game from what I've seen of it. It's so hardcore when it comes to immersion that skinning animals and many other interactions take a painfully long amount of time so that they can be "realistic".

Some people don't like that. Some people like these things to be gamified. If I wanted a true-to-life simulation, I'd go outside and camp for real. lol.

Meanwhile, the Baldur's Gate series is not and never has been a "medieval life simulator" or RPG (by my interpretation of how you're using the term). If that's what you're looking for, I suggest you dust off your copy of RDR2, or maybe check out Kingdom Come: Deliverance or Mount & Blade 2 if you're looking for something more medieval.

Baldur's Gate 3 is more of a narrative game with a focus on Choice & Consequence. It has more in common with Bioware titles (such as Dragon Age, and... uh... Baldur's Gate) and Telltale titles (such as The Walking Dead), and other C&C games (eg Expeditions: Viking, Disco Elysium) than immersive games like Red Dead Redemption, Assassins Creed, Kingdom Come: Deliverance... or you know, Euro Truck Simulator.

What people want is that we have the same degree of mechanics and immersion as ....uh... Baldur's Gate.

Not less.

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Originally Posted by IrenicusBG3
What people want is that we have the same degree of mechanics and immersion as ....uh... Baldur's Gate.

Not less.
Again, what does a day/night cycle mean to you?

In Baldur's Gate, what was it except cosmetic? The dimmer switch is really all it would take for you to feel "immersed"? If that's really all it would take, then both I and Larian both seem to struggle with understanding this. A cosmetic day/night cycle is not at all hard to implement in a game, but I guess we just kind of struggle with understanding the point.

I really don't care for a cosmetic day/night cycle. If it's implemented, it should matter.

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Originally Posted by Ayvah
Originally Posted by IrenicusBG3
What people want is that we have the same degree of mechanics and immersion as ....uh... Baldur's Gate.

Not less.
Again, what does a day/night cycle mean to you?

In Baldur's Gate, what was it except cosmetic? The dimmer switch is really all it would take for you to feel "immersed"? If that's really all it would take, then both I and Larian both seem to struggle with understanding this. A cosmetic day/night cycle is not at all hard to implement in a game, but I guess we just kind of struggle with understanding the point.

I really don't care for a cosmetic day/night cycle. If it's implemented, it should matter.

But a day/night cycle is already implemented, arbitrarily and as a purely cosmetic mechanic that doesn't matter in the slightest. Probably why the people here don't like it.

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