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Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Originally Posted by Pharaun159
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Lackluster. It's essentially just a weaker Wizard who can turn into a Familiar.


To your point..wizard is waaaay more powerful then its supposed to be. They are definitely NOT supposed to be learning cantrips and cleric spells from scrolls.

Other then that id say they are actually pretty equal if you go circle of the land. Just waaaay more survivability as the druid since you can essentially have something like 60hp to burn through

I did a Wizard playthrough without the omniscient scroll cheese and they were still extremely powerful.


For sure. Both wizards and druids excell in versatility, and both can really be what ever you build them to be. Honestly it seemed to me, though, that for blasting, the warlock could really pump out some consistent numbers.

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Originally Posted by Pharaun159
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Originally Posted by Pharaun159
Originally Posted by Tzelanit
Lackluster. It's essentially just a weaker Wizard who can turn into a Familiar.


To your point..wizard is waaaay more powerful then its supposed to be. They are definitely NOT supposed to be learning cantrips and cleric spells from scrolls.

Other then that id say they are actually pretty equal if you go circle of the land. Just waaaay more survivability as the druid since you can essentially have something like 60hp to burn through

I did a Wizard playthrough without the omniscient scroll cheese and they were still extremely powerful.


For sure. Both wizards and druids excell in versatility, and both can really be what ever you build them to be. Honestly it seemed to me, though, that for blasting, the warlock could really pump out some consistent numbers.

Getting off track a bit, but yeah, Warlocks have been my favorite class so far. They're not as diverse, but they consistently perform well. I was really hoping that the Druid was going to pack some serious magical punch, but the design ethos for them stayed true to 5e in this case, unfortunately, in that they have a lot more utility and a lot less raw firepower.


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Perpetuating the off-topic, do y'all run wizards optimized for combat? Mine's specced mostly for dialogue and, while still very versatile, i can't keep him alive for more than 2 rounds.

The druid i'm running alongside him feels way sturdier in comparison, what with shapeshifting, barkskin and heals, and can also serve decentely well as melee/ranged DPS or support depending on who else i have in the party.

And to go back on topic, kinda, this run has allowed me to use extensively speak to animals and i gotta say it's really cool. Who knew talking to a squirrel or a toad could be so fun.

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[/quote]Getting off track a bit, but yeah, Warlocks have been my favorite class so far. They're not as diverse, but they consistently perform well. I was really hoping that the Druid was going to pack some serious magical punch, but the design ethos for them stayed true to 5e in this case, unfortunately, in that they have a lot more utility and a lot less raw firepower.[/quote]


They have a few nice tactical effects that work well. Namly spike growth when defending a large area. Flaming sphere down a hallway. And moon beam for those pesky out of reach bastards. Partnered with a wizard you can reall keep a large group locked down. Throw down spije growth and grease. As the enemies advance they cluster. As the reach the end, drop spije growth and hit with moon beam or flaming sphere, and have wizard throw more grease on them to keep them in the radius. Team effort.

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Originally Posted by Innateagle
Perpetuating the off-topic, do y'all run wizards optimized for combat? Mine's specced mostly for dialogue and, while still very versatile, i can't keep him alive for more than 2 rounds.

The druid i'm running alongside him feels way sturdier in comparison, what with shapeshifting, barkskin and heals, and can also serve decentely well as melee/ranged DPS or support depending on who else i have in the party.

And to go back on topic, kinda, this run has allowed me to use extensively speak to animals and i gotta say it's really cool. Who knew talking to a squirrel or a toad could be so fun.


Well right now i suppose they would be awesome, since you could cheese scrolls and learn inflict wounds lol. They dont get great attack bonus, but i suppose it could be done.

As to the druid...oh yeah. Waaay sturdier. However wizard with mage armor and mirror image is pretty hard to hit. But you can get bark skin and mirror image on druid (though barkskin is concentration..so big loss there)

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Despite some bugs, and it isn't due to being druid, I am enjoying the class. I am not sure why barkskin is considered a concentration spell, but I guess it changed in 5E mechanics would be my guess. Not sure if Natural Armor is still a thing anymore for AC bonuses. It used to just give you like a set armor increase based on the caster level. I guess its just a straight up AC 17 now. So if that is the 5E rules for the spell now just don't be a druid caster fighting toe to toe with people. However, I have noticed that casters seem to be more sturdier when it comes to concentration checks. That just may be to me getting luckier on the RNG, but helps nonetheless. The class does give me hope though that if they spent this much time at getting the druid to work well I think Paladin and other caster classes are going to be great as well.

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I did the auntie Ethel fight and the spider matriarch today - so far, I don't see a difference in difficulty. I mean, the matriarch and auntie were always one of the harder enemies in the game (I only find the gith patrol harder, but they are easy to cheese with barrelmancy, if you don't want a long tedious fight).


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Originally Posted by Innateagle
Perpetuating the off-topic, do y'all run wizards optimized for combat? Mine's specced mostly for dialogue and, while still very versatile, i can't keep him alive for more than 2 rounds.

My Gale is a damage wizard and I don't have much trouble keeping him alive, now or in the earlier version. Mage armor stays active at all times if I remember to use it. Misty Step is good for teleporting out of danger if he gets rushed.

I'm also running with Shadowheart and usually have her throw a Bless at the start of combat that includes the Wiz. That +4 to save throws really helps.

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Originally Posted by Frumpkis
Originally Posted by Innateagle
Perpetuating the off-topic, do y'all run wizards optimized for combat? Mine's specced mostly for dialogue and, while still very versatile, i can't keep him alive for more than 2 rounds.

My Gale is a damage wizard and I don't have much trouble keeping him alive, now or in the earlier version. Mage armor stays active at all times if I remember to use it. Misty Step is good for teleporting out of danger if he gets rushed.

I'm also running with Shadowheart and usually have her throw a Bless at the start of combat that includes the Wiz. That +4 to save throws really helps.

I'm an old soul, i believe in never using any resource available to me because i may need it later. But yeah, i should probably star buffing my 10 con/10 dex guy.

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haha yeah I haven't used barkskin much. If I see concentration in the spell description I'm always second guessing whether its even worth the ready slot for a buff, when mirror image seems to be more useful lol. I know its a 5e type deal now where you better be concentrating on everything at all times but still. Spell casting types are my usual class in D&D, but the spellbar hotbar all-in one is kinda maddening here, the way the gameplay is set up doing direct damage type stuff seems to pan out better. The rest scheme is also kinda overwrought for a BG1 playstyle of switching everything on the fly constantly. BG1/2 didn't have much in the way of a rest economy, anywhere you could rest you could rest and be back at it in like 2 seconds as a conceit of the gameplay design. But in BG3 each trek to camp is like a minute long affair with a 4 click minimum so much more involved I find. Maybe if the game autosaved at the start of each encounter that would help a bit? I wish there were more isolated lower level low pressure combats on the Nautiloid and the areas immediately around the beach to prime the player, esp for casting type players. There's basically nothing in the tutorial portion of the game about it. I think there should be an opportunity to run into a trainer type NPC for each class archetype, to run through the basics for everything in more detail. Tailored combats or exercises for whatever we're being given to work with initially. If I had never played a wizard or druid in 2e or 3e, I don't know that I'd have much clue what to be doing in 5e BG3. The game doesn't really teach that and assumes a pretty high level of familiarity with D&D systems.

In my current playthrough another thing I noted, was that if you follow the story beats and the advice you're given by your companions, it seems to encourage the player to skip out on the druid camp pretty quickly and head towards the Goblins or the Gith or otherwise to dive in over their heads pretty quickly. I wish there were a few minor league combat situations leading up to that stuff. The game goes from throwing 2 or 3 enemies at you on the Nautiloid and the Beach, then into a pretty large engagement that we are meant to win with the aid of a bunch of friendlies in a set piece fight at the gate... But then pretty quickly escalates that to complex battles vs enemy groups that match the party in terms of abilities and equipment and consumable type items. They need a couple more hack and slash zones for the early grunt fest, where the monster types are rather simpler (not dealing with monsters that use consumables and spells) so the novice player has more opportunities to learn what they're doing before TPK scenarios. People gripe about trash mobs in other games, but this one I think needs some more, especially in the the lvl 1-2 range areas. Goblin's might work like that in other campaigns (like BG1/2 kobolds), but here they are clearly designed more like the Party vs Enemy Party battles in BG1/2 (when you'd fight other Humans/Elves/Dwarves etc). You know where that game used PC models rather than monster models and gear visuals to let you know you where about to fight another party of adventurers with similar skills to your own. Our goblins in BG3 are more like that than standard trash mob goblins. Even the mini gobbo fights include warrior priest wizard and rogue versions of the monster. The imps and intellect devourers work better as trash mob types probably, but there are only a couple encounters on the nautiloid and the beach that qualify. I think the Druid grove needs a dungeon clearing type sub-quest that sends the lvl2 PCs to kill something slightly more mundane and predictable, just as a way to learn their more basic abilities. Sticking with Act 1 for EA probably has had most clamoring for more difficulty, but I think the first areas of this game would be pretty hard for the neophyte

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Help me out here...

New to DnD lore, but I am trying to think of a good reason that my Druid would even enter the Owlbear cave. I get that the one guy was killed, but it seems like an affront to nature to go into the Owlbear's home...kill it in cold blood all while it's cub watches.

I get the Owlbears aren't beasts, they're a monstrosity so I don't know if that helps

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How do you use barrelmancy against foes with Misty Step?

If you mean going down invisible, dumping a load of barrels and blowing them to kingdom come *before you even initiate dialogue*, that's too cheesy for me to contemplate!

Positioning your party and placing barrels/crates tactically before initiating a combat feels acceptable. It's a precaution every good adventurer would take. You can always opt not to pull the trigger. Wiping out the opposition before they can even act (and before you technically know they are enemies) seems like an exploit.

I love that the option is there for those who want it. But I'll be finding another way. I hope.

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Started over again as another Druid yesterday because romancingas a hobbit is just too weird. I quite like their flow. Completely stole Wyll's thunder at the goblin-at-the-gates fight by launching myself into battle as the polar bear and roaringly making everyone face me, saving the day and lives of everyone involved (well, except the goblins). I really like the transformation animations. I've always had a bit of a hard time picturing wildchanges happening in my head because of how fast they need to change. The "sculpt out of clay" was a great interpretation of it. The transformation back into human form looks especially great.

I also had a lot of fun with the lash cantrip on my first run (didn't take it on the second because I wanted to try throwing fire), but I never managed to use it for what I really wanted to use it for -- whipping assholes off of ledges. Has anyone else managed to do that? I hope it was only a matter of bad positioning lack from my side.

I also like the new dialogue with Kagha. It makes her seem a little less cartoonish and more reasonable. More like somebody who is currently raging because a certain thief stole one of their most holy symbols and less somebody who just enjoys being cruel to children because she is evil. Oh and I finally realised where the snake goes at the end of the cinematic -- I don't think that's new though that might just be me being thick before.


Originally Posted by Blackmagicgirl
Help me out here...

New to DnD lore, but I am trying to think of a good reason that my Druid would even enter the Owlbear cave. I get that the one guy was killed, but it seems like an affront to nature to go into the Owlbear's home...kill it in cold blood all while it's cub watches.

I get the Owlbears aren't beasts, they're a monstrosity so I don't know if that helps

I'm just about to head in there myself and there's a few reasons or rationalisations I can think of
1, The Owlbear is, as you say, not really natural themselves. They are quite ravenous beasts, and upsets the natural balance of any environment they settle in. In modern terms, they're an invasive species with no natural enemies.
2, You can surmise that the Owlbear is injured from Edowin's broken spear, so you need to go inside and see if it is in need of aid so you can go all mouse and lion on it and WAIT STOP WHY ARE YOU ATTACKING ME
3, While many Druids would probably consider a predator attacking people to be just how nature be, you don't have to play a Druid who doesn't value human(oid) life over other. Such a mighty beast that attacks people could easily be considered something that needs to be put down -- Druids are not just about protecting nature but also about protecting people from nature. Granted, this reasoning does not have as much hold since you're so far away from civilization... But having a human-hunting monstrosity right on top of the main trade route between to cities would still be a great worry to this mindset.
4, The enemy of my enemy is my friend! Let's go join up to kill more Absolutists! Hey Owlga, I like the cut of your gib! How about you and HEY WAIT STOP WHY ARE YOU ATTACKING ME AAAaaaaargh


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Originally Posted by Blackmagicgirl
Help me out here...

New to DnD lore, but I am trying to think of a good reason that my Druid would even enter the Owlbear cave. I get that the one guy was killed, but it seems like an affront to nature to go into the Owlbear's home...kill it in cold blood all while it's cub watches.

I get the Owlbears aren't beasts, they're a monstrosity so I don't know if that helps

Owlbears are not natural creatures. Monstrosities in general don't tend to be creatures of natural origin. Mostly magically created by crazy wizards or a product of curses. Owlbears specifically were created through magical experimentation.

They are also ravenously hungry and may deplete an entire forest's natural population if left unchecked for too long.

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Originally Posted by Dexai
I also had a lot of fun with the lash cantrip on my first run (didn't take it on the second because I wanted to try throwing fire), but I never managed to use it for what I really wanted to use it for -- whipping assholes off of ledges. Has anyone else managed to do that? I hope it was only a matter of bad positioning lack from my side.

I've used it to pull people off ledges multiple times already. It is VERY satisfying. Especially on those darn harpies who keep flying to higher ground to throw rocks at you. It was also very useful in pulling goblins off roofs.

It can also be quite mean to enemies below you too. I took the high ground against those intellect devourers you fight after meeting Shadowheart. They had to run passed me to get to the stairs so I kept yanking them back and away from the stairs to slow them down.

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Hah! That's exactly what what I wanted. I never got to the harpies or any of the more vertical battles like the gobbo town ambush on that playthrough. The one combat I tries it the most was against the tomb raiders outside the temple where it kept saying they were too far away (or high up or whatever) whenever I tried, so I'm glad to hear it actually works. Makes me want to start over again just so I can use it in the Harpy scene xD


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I have a question about throwing the fire? How do you do that? I managed to conjure the flames, but was not able to throw them. They are in my hand, but that's it.


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You get a special action slot on the action tab to throw it.


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Originally Posted by Dexai
You get a special action slot on the action tab to throw it.
Really? I looked for something like that, but never found it.


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Originally Posted by fylimar
Originally Posted by Dexai
You get a special action slot on the action tab to throw it.
Really? I looked for something like that, but never found it.

Indeed it's a bit difficult to find, it is similar to the icon of the flame but orange, it should be near the icon of the ordinary spell.

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