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Originally Posted by Topgoon
I think the problem with Raphael is how he is introduced and inserted into the current narrative.

The entire scene just feels those random extra sequences that movies add in so they can add it to a trailer to say "and we've got devils too!"

He enters the narrative with little to no introduction or foreshadowing, and worst of all, completely abandons it immediately after. It feels totally random as there's no clear cause and effect for him showing up (i.e. if he had shown up due to the player tampering with the soul coin, etc, that would make more sense). There are also serious tonal issues with the scene, since it feels like the developers are genuinely trying to surprise the player. However, Raphael's disguise is wax-paper and the transition to the "reveal" happens only seconds later. It's utterly predictable in a hilarious way, but the story seems to want to frame it as serious.

Overall, at this point Raphael feels disconnected to everything else this point - his scene contributes nothing - no new obstacles, no new characters motivations, and no consequences.

This is coming from someone who does not feel like every D&D adventure needs to start slow, mundane, and within a Tavern. I'm perfectly okay with the more high-stakes, cinematic premise that Larian has chosen. HOWEVER, even within that context, Raphael's introduction feels like a DM randomly yelling "If you thought hell, dragon, giths, and mindflayers weren't enough, and now a devil shows up!"


Compare Raphael to a certain character from the Witcher 3 (Spoilers):


Gaunter O'Dimm is a fantastic example of how to properly introduce a Faustian bargain with the devil into the narrative.

Witcher 3 takes the time to introduce both the character and the legend separately in bite size pieces, seeding them both into the player's mind until it all converges into a reveal when it was ready for the narrative spotlight. It serves a purpose in the story because it pays off a series of hints and promises made to the player along the way.

Note, it's not a matter of whether the reveal is surprising or not that makes it good - it's the fact that it feels earned and meaningful.

The delight a player feels with the Gaunter reveal doesn't solely comes from the fact that "I knew it all along", but the fact that "I can't believe these little clues/foreshadowing actually have so much meaning."
+1 very well said regarding how raph and the devil plot is currently introduced and implemented - tbh i feel similarly about a number of other features feeling disconnected too. there are a lot of neat ideas and cool moments in bg3, but all told the mix and delivery needs reworking.
Originally Posted by teclis23
Literally.

Like wtf this game is seriously groundbreaking i have never seen anything like it. There is literally nothing like it available on the market and i would associate it with the equivalent of GTA5 but for a RPG. BG3 is the GTA5 for RPGS.

The combat is unreal, the writing is unbelievable, the graphics are the best. It is immersive like no other game before it. It is far better then both BG2 and DOS2 easily, no contest.

To back up my claims BG3 is currently outselling cyberpunk on steam and cyberpunk is in full release and BG3 is in EA.

Due to BG3 apparent success i am hoping to see more from larian involving forgotten realms and D&D.

WOW so impressed

Edit

PS Larian you need to tone done the wokeness in BG3, we dont need all this diversity and equality BS in our faces. In my opinion i generally tune into games like this to tune out from the world and relax i dont want to see political issues thrust in my face. Apart from this well done 100%.
glad the game is blowing fam away after four hours to the point where we are saying an unfinished ea build is the equivalent of gta5 - it does make the whole thread seem somewhat click baity as others have pointed out but maybe thats the intention wink . i think you also dilute and weaken your position editing your post to include a rant about 'wokeness, which reinforces this threads clickbaity nature

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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Honestly, it's because there's a man in his backstory and that's it.


Originally Posted by JoB
Originally Posted by spectralhunter
But it seems a lot of players want to be able to romance anyone.

I'm not sure that's true. I suspect that if you actually polled players, you'd find most of them would prefer the companions were, as you put it, hard coded.

I don't agree with you.

For example, Gale and Astarion are popular as romance characters, Wyll is not so popular. So, make Astarion or Gale gay, and you'll see the crowd come out with torches, figuratively speaking. The same thing will happen if you close Gale or Astarion for LGBT, the hype will be incredible. In a bad way ofc. I've already seen this on Mass Effect forum. Believe me. Anyway I believe that all characters can be traced to their true tastes. But give possibility of romance to everyone, and at least no one will complain.

I am hundred percent agree with Nyloth and ready to sign by each word)

By my impression, BG3 characters have absolutely no problems with "watering down" based on romantic preferences.

Their availability just gives players more freedom to get fun their own way, built up their own perception on the canon, and relieves from focus on the LGBTQ matter, which has no input into the plot, and rather keeps this place for plenty of the other story to uncover.

This way, I can finally take a rest from the real-world social agenda, and I am immensely happy that I don't have to think deeply through the reasons a character doesn't want to sleep with me based on what's between my legs. Can't tell for others, but for me "hard-coded" characters are no fun, and that's not a part of character's identity I would be happily explore in RPG.

So, I am quite pleased with the way Larian make the game so far. This approach allows me to see characters my way, not theirs, or anybody's else.


P.S.: also seemed to me that Astarion is bisexual, and a bit more into women. He's flirted with Shadowheart in party banters after all:)


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I hate Raphael, he doesn't work at all for me. I'm always being as unfriendly as the game lets me to him.
Who is Korilla? Never have met her.


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If you get captured and imprisoned by Gut she shows up to get you out of the shackles before Gut has a chance to take a closer look at your guts.


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Originally Posted by nation
Originally Posted by Topgoon
I think the problem with Raphael is how he is introduced and inserted into the current narrative.

The entire scene just feels those random extra sequences that movies add in so they can add it to a trailer to say "and we've got devils too!"

He enters the narrative with little to no introduction or foreshadowing, and worst of all, completely abandons it immediately after. It feels totally random as there's no clear cause and effect for him showing up (i.e. if he had shown up due to the player tampering with the soul coin, etc, that would make more sense). There are also serious tonal issues with the scene, since it feels like the developers are genuinely trying to surprise the player. However, Raphael's disguise is wax-paper and the transition to the "reveal" happens only seconds later. It's utterly predictable in a hilarious way, but the story seems to want to frame it as serious.

Overall, at this point Raphael feels disconnected to everything else this point - his scene contributes nothing - no new obstacles, no new characters motivations, and no consequences.

This is coming from someone who does not feel like every D&D adventure needs to start slow, mundane, and within a Tavern. I'm perfectly okay with the more high-stakes, cinematic premise that Larian has chosen. HOWEVER, even within that context, Raphael's introduction feels like a DM randomly yelling "If you thought hell, dragon, giths, and mindflayers weren't enough, and now a devil shows up!"


Compare Raphael to a certain character from the Witcher 3 (Spoilers):


Gaunter O'Dimm is a fantastic example of how to properly introduce a Faustian bargain with the devil into the narrative.

Witcher 3 takes the time to introduce both the character and the legend separately in bite size pieces, seeding them both into the player's mind until it all converges into a reveal when it was ready for the narrative spotlight. It serves a purpose in the story because it pays off a series of hints and promises made to the player along the way.

Note, it's not a matter of whether the reveal is surprising or not that makes it good - it's the fact that it feels earned and meaningful.

The delight a player feels with the Gaunter reveal doesn't solely comes from the fact that "I knew it all along", but the fact that "I can't believe these little clues/foreshadowing actually have so much meaning."
+1 very well said regarding how raph and the devil plot is currently introduced and implemented - tbh i feel similarly about a number of other features feeling disconnected too. there are a lot of neat ideas and cool moments in bg3, but all told the mix and delivery needs reworking.
Originally Posted by teclis23
Literally.

Like wtf this game is seriously groundbreaking i have never seen anything like it. There is literally nothing like it available on the market and i would associate it with the equivalent of GTA5 but for a RPG. BG3 is the GTA5 for RPGS.

The combat is unreal, the writing is unbelievable, the graphics are the best. It is immersive like no other game before it. It is far better then both BG2 and DOS2 easily, no contest.

To back up my claims BG3 is currently outselling cyberpunk on steam and cyberpunk is in full release and BG3 is in EA.

Due to BG3 apparent success i am hoping to see more from larian involving forgotten realms and D&D.

WOW so impressed

Edit

PS Larian you need to tone done the wokeness in BG3, we dont need all this diversity and equality BS in our faces. In my opinion i generally tune into games like this to tune out from the world and relax i dont want to see political issues thrust in my face. Apart from this well done 100%.
glad the game is blowing fam away after four hours to the point where we are saying an unfinished ea build is the equivalent of gta5 - it does make the whole thread seem somewhat click baity as others have pointed out but maybe thats the intention wink . i think you also dilute and weaken your position editing your post to include a rant about 'wokeness, which reinforces this threads clickbaity nature


And I'm glad you saw fit to highlight the op's comparison while ignoring the many others who compared the game to Disco Elysium, Planescape and Baldur's Gate trilogy. At least this dude followed his statement through with reasons for making it, including a fact, rather than baldly stating his opinion under the mistaken impression that it is a fact (which I note you do). It is unreasonable to compare an unfinished first chapter of a game to a full one favourably or unfavourably to be honest. That doesn't seem to stop people doing it.

I personally hope the game reflects Larian's and DnD's progressive outlook in case anyone is interested.

Second if anyone expects the depiction of a cambion - a 5e half devil - to be anything like the literation depiction of Judaeo-Christian evil incarnate - in collection mode no less- especially when one is basically a whole dlc dedicated to this story... well that is down to them not this game. Even a pit fiend wouldn't come close. The closest would be an arch devil, maybe even Asmodeus himself. Which would be ridiculous in this context.

Devil's m.o., which the witcher gets right, is to offer a deal where the person taking it thinks they'll never have to fulfil the conditions. Or something they think will fulfil the conditions, but at the time don't realise will actually cost them something dear. Like the cultists after Karlach. The devil then manipulates fulfilment to get what he wants. All about the fine print with them.

Raphael *is* a used car salesman. What he's saying is the equivalent of 'sale ends Friday', he's reminding you of urgency when at that time in the story the lack of urgency has become part of the mystery itself. What he's offering on the surface is without a doubt a million times worse than the alternative. Seven days of excruciating agony then your soul gets snuffed out. No afterlife with your god. Versus an eternity of indescribable suffering. No contest. Your companion's give you what to take out of this. Wyl: don't trust him he'll take everything. Shadowheart: there's no right answer here, he's testing you. Gale: what if it's not our souls he's after but the tadpoles. In short he's clearly introduced as another player in the game.

And, no, he's not there to say 'we have devils too'. If you look at the books around, you can see they are foreshadowing hells and devils as an important part of the story later.

And you do in fact know there's something different about your tadpoles: you override the mindflayer's control of the fishermen which clearly shouldn't be possible. This is pointed out by one of your companions. Your tadpole overwhelmed a fully developed , albeit injured, mindflayer.

No-one's claiming that the writing is stellar, but it absolutely is solid - feel free to have your own opinion, but if you want to be convincing about it back it up with an argument at least.

Here is act one condensed:

We have to escape the ship is under attack. We need to get these mindflayers out asap. There's no time to rest we have a timebomb in our heads. Huh, that's funny we should be changing by now, but we're not. This drow seems to be like us but doesn't know about tadpoles and mentions the Absolute. This dying man calls himself a True Soul and think the tadpole makes him special. Says the Absolute is power. This priestess is talking to the tadpole and believes it is a god, something's behind this. The goblin chieftain is infected but doesn't seem to be allied with the mindflayers, or at least he doesn't realise it. The mindflayer calls the Absolute absolute unity. Moonrise towers seem to have something to do with it, maybe dark Justiciars too?

That's act 1's core, but there's also story reasons to explore east and west (Ethel and githyanki). All of your companions have a compelling reason to be with you (they're all using you to some degree or another). There is a strong driving force moving the plot along the whole chapter. When you stop chasing the main story to focus on helping someone you lose approval from the more self centred companions (a fact which annoyed a lot of players btw)

In short the story deepens the more you explore geographically, further you're given good reasons to do this. Writing 101: Act One is the set up. Please stop expecting resolutions in act 1, they won't happen.

Overall though I do agree that maybe more could be made of Raphael, maybe as has been suggested incorporate his agent more or foreshadow him earlier? If you're an elf or half elf you won't even get that scene with her. (btw if you think nothing comes of the scene in Act 1, get the artefact scene with Gale then don't feed him any. You'll be surprised). The devil you know is a bit cheesy too I agree.

On a level of presentation, I think it's a mistake to have him keep the same clothes he wears in human form. That does look a bit silly in my eyes. Maybe an outfit that gives him some more menace in devil form would be better.

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lol wut? - kinda rambling here ^ fam wink
Originally Posted by crashdaddy
Overall though I do agree that maybe more could be made of Raphael, maybe as has been suggested incorporate his agent more or foreshadow him earlier? If you're an elf or half elf you won't even get that scene with her. (btw if you think nothing comes of the scene in Act 1, get the artefact scene with Gale then don't feed him any. You'll be surprised). The devil you know is a bit cheesy too I agree.

On a level of presentation, I think it's a mistake to have him keep the same clothes he wears in human form. That does look a bit silly in my eyes. Maybe an outfit that gives him some more menace in devil form would be better.
but im glad we got to this agreement eventually smile

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Originally Posted by nation
lol wut? - kinda rambling here ^ fam wink
Originally Posted by crashdaddy
Overall though I do agree that maybe more could be made of Raphael, maybe as has been suggested incorporate his agent more or foreshadow him earlier? If you're an elf or half elf you won't even get that scene with her. (btw if you think nothing comes of the scene in Act 1, get the artefact scene with Gale then don't feed him any. You'll be surprised). The devil you know is a bit cheesy too I agree.

On a level of presentation, I think it's a mistake to have him keep the same clothes he wears in human form. That does look a bit silly in my eyes. Maybe an outfit that gives him some more menace in devil form would be better.
but im glad we got to this agreement eventually smile

Kinda. Yeah.


Was replying to about four people at once, probably should have snip quoted, couldn't be arsed. I'll know next time

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Originally Posted by DuskHorseman
I think one of the ways that Raphael could be introduced better and have more of an effect on the story as a major player is if Korilla Hearthflame was better used.
Korilla should definitely get more screen time. At least have her visit the player character in the camp, or better join as a follower. smile

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Originally Posted by Dexai
If you get captured and imprisoned by Gut she shows up to get you out of the shackles before Gut has a chance to take a closer look at your guts.
Thanks, I haven't had that situation yet.


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Originally Posted by fylimar
Originally Posted by Dexai
If you get captured and imprisoned by Gut she shows up to get you out of the shackles before Gut has a chance to take a closer look at your guts.
Thanks, I haven't had that situation yet.

Further offtopic Korilla observations
Gut actually notices the tadpole in your head (that's why she captures you), but it's not entirely made clear whether she's aware it's a special tadpole or not. She claims the Absolute wants to know all about it, but it's not made clear whether that is just her own interest phrased through her role as a cleric or actual orders. She also sees herself being tadpoled when you mind-link (or at least you see her being tadpoled) but she doesn't seem to take notice or believe that that happened afterwards.

Anyway, my point is that Gut starts to get on the trail of a pretty big secret in that encounter. And just after that a devil's assassin shows up and murders her. Sure, she also saves you. But is she there just because you need help or because Gut coincidentally needs killing?


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Originally Posted by fylimar
I hate Raphael, he doesn't work at all for me. I'm always being as unfriendly as the game lets me to him.
Who is Korilla? Never have met her.

Perhaps I'm confused here, you guys all seem to be trashing on Raphael as if his entire plot arc is already in the game. As far as I've seen, he shows up one time, dangles the possibility of helping, and then vanishes regardless of how you talk to him and never comes back. This is clearly not fully implemented.

I admit it's kind of weird he doesn't acknowledge the soul coin that could be in your inventory which should be able to be used as contractual tender, and he won't let you just sign away your soul immediately. That said, there's only one encounter in what is clearly going to be a series of repeating encounters. It's real hard to be too judge-y about him.

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Originally Posted by Dexai
Originally Posted by fylimar
Originally Posted by Dexai
If you get captured and imprisoned by Gut she shows up to get you out of the shackles before Gut has a chance to take a closer look at your guts.
Thanks, I haven't had that situation yet.

Further offtopic Korilla observations
Gut actually notices the tadpole in your head (that's why she captures you), but it's not entirely made clear whether she's aware it's a special tadpole or not. She claims the Absolute wants to know all about it, but it's not made clear whether that is just her own interest phrased through her role as a cleric or actual orders. She also sees herself being tadpoled when you mind-link (or at least you see her being tadpoled) but she doesn't seem to take notice or believe that that happened afterwards.

Anyway, my point is that Gut starts to get on the trail of a pretty big secret in that encounter. And just after that a devil's assassin shows up and murders her. Sure, she also saves you. But is she there just because you need help or because Gut coincidentally needs killing?

What do you have to do to get captured by Gut?


As about Raphael (to the poster above me) : Of course you can judge, if you find a character interesting or not based on one conversation. The one with Raphael wasn't that short. Maybe I change my opinion about him later on, but I doubt it. I don't like his voice acting that much either.


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Originally Posted by BROttorney
I admit it's kind of weird he doesn't acknowledge the soul coin that could be in your inventory which should be able to be used as contractual tender, and he won't let you just sign away your soul immediately. That said, there's only one encounter in what is clearly going to be a series of repeating encounters. It's real hard to be too judge-y about him.
He might be after something else than simply a soul. In the harpy nest there is
a letter from a warlock who made a deal with a cambion and was sent on some quest. This cambion apparently likes to show up during the night for a chat. There is also a journal, but I've found the descriptions there confusing. I guess you need to know the D&D lore to decipher that.

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I was also completely blown away FROM this game. It feels so incredibly NOT like Baldurs gate game.
But Its ok. I have accepted the fact that this is <DOS3: a D&D wannabe adventure in Faerun>. And its great!

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Originally Posted by BROttorney
Originally Posted by fylimar
I hate Raphael, he doesn't work at all for me. I'm always being as unfriendly as the game lets me to him.
Who is Korilla? Never have met her.

Perhaps I'm confused here, you guys all seem to be trashing on Raphael as if his entire plot arc is already in the game. As far as I've seen, he shows up one time, dangles the possibility of helping, and then vanishes regardless of how you talk to him and never comes back. This is clearly not fully implemented.

I personally thought it was pretty clear that they were criticising him as he appears in-game right now.


Originally Posted by fylimar
Originally Posted by Dexai
Originally Posted by fylimar
Originally Posted by Dexai
If you get captured and imprisoned by Gut she shows up to get you out of the shackles before Gut has a chance to take a closer look at your guts.
Thanks, I haven't had that situation yet.

Further offtopic Korilla observations
Gut actually notices the tadpole in your head (that's why she captures you), but it's not entirely made clear whether she's aware it's a special tadpole or not. She claims the Absolute wants to know all about it, but it's not made clear whether that is just her own interest phrased through her role as a cleric or actual orders. She also sees herself being tadpoled when you mind-link (or at least you see her being tadpoled) but she doesn't seem to take notice or believe that that happened afterwards.

Anyway, my point is that Gut starts to get on the trail of a pretty big secret in that encounter. And just after that a devil's assassin shows up and murders her. Sure, she also saves you. But is she there just because you need help or because Gut coincidentally needs killing?

What do you have to do to get captured by Gut?

When you get to her in the Goblin base you have to ask her to help you with your condition, and she'll invite you back to her... "office" wink . When you get there, she separates you from the party, sees the tadpole, and gives you a "cure" which is actually a sleeping potion. Then she shackles you in one of the jail cells in her private little sanctum (you know where her body guard ogre hangs out).

So you need to go to her for a cure, accept her "cure", and also not be an elf or a half-elf (because elves are immune to sleeping magic and the option will fail if you drink it -- a nice touch that they remembered that I think -- at least so I read here on the forums).


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Originally Posted by BROttorney
Perhaps I'm confused here, you guys all seem to be trashing on Raphael as if his entire plot arc is already in the game. As far as I've seen, he shows up one time, dangles the possibility of helping, and then vanishes regardless of how you talk to him and never comes back. This is clearly not fully implemented.
Sure, any criticism needs to be taken with "it's not finished yet". Still, to me it seemed like one of the most polished encounters, and one that was advertised heavily, so it not working, and not intruiging me at least, is worrying.

Something that came to my mind while writing - just rewatched the cutscene. "Direction" is rather unexistant. Just set of boring shots with stiff animations - at best showing objects talked about (like food or wider shot of the room) but not communicating anything. Having cinematic look can make things better or worse. Having a scary devil talk to us fully lighter from a generic medium closeup does make him rather unintimidating. What's more, through visual language we are presented as equals.

For now, I feel, BG3 cinematics detract from the experience - it's better to imagine conversation, than watch a dull one. It's Dragon Age: Origins bad. Are they going to revise major encounters? Are they just building technology? It could be, but considering the sheer size of the game, I can't imagine it getting Witcher3 treatment. That use of cinematic language (shot composition, framing, lighting etc) is what elevates Mass Effect 1&2 (ME3 visibly stumbles in that regards) and WItcher3, and lack of it makes other RPGs looks like dolls awkwardly muppeting at each other.

EDIT: See O'Dim's reintroduction in HoS (timestamps 38 minute mark in case the timestamp doesn't work). Geralt sitting in dark selling his situation, O'Dim literally appearing from shadows, throughout the whole encounter he is shot from underneath and Geralt is from above. And yes, it is because he is standing and Geralt is sitting and having viewpoints and camera shots allign is critical, but they are shot there way to communicate the towering presence of O'Dim. He kneels when he offers help, gets back up when mentioning his capabilities (he doesn't need to say much as his VO and shot compositions reinforces his power). They come back to the same level as they "negotiate", Geralt in a clear "prisoner pose" and Master Mirror still being somewhat taller then Geralt is.

That's basic choreography but actually enhances the conversation.

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Originally Posted by Wormerine
Originally Posted by BROttorney
Perhaps I'm confused here, you guys all seem to be trashing on Raphael as if his entire plot arc is already in the game. As far as I've seen, he shows up one time, dangles the possibility of helping, and then vanishes regardless of how you talk to him and never comes back. This is clearly not fully implemented.
Sure, any criticism needs to be taken with "it's not finished yet". Still, to me it seemed like one of the most polished encounters, and one that was advertised heavily, so it not working, and not intruiging me at least, is worrying.

Something that came to my mind while writing - just rewatched the cutscene. "Direction" is rather unexistant. Just set of boring shots with stiff animations - at best showing objects talked about (like food or wider shot of the room) but not communicating anything. Having cinematic look can make things better or worse. Having a scary devil talk to us fully lighter from a generic medium closeup does make him rather unintimidating. What's more, through visual language we are presented as equals.

For now, I feel, BG3 cinematics detract from the experience - it's better to imagine conversation, than watch a dull one. It's Dragon Age: Origins bad. Are they going to revise major encounters? Are they just building technology? It could be, but considering the sheer size of the game, I can't imagine it getting Witcher3 treatment. That use of cinematic language (shot composition, framing, lighting etc) is what elevates Mass Effect 1&2 (ME3 visibly stumbles in that regards) and WItcher3, and lack of it makes other RPGs looks like dolls awkwardly muppeting at each other.

EDIT: See O'Dim's reintroduction in HoS (timestamps 38 minute mark in case the timestamp doesn't work). Geralt sitting in dark selling his situation, O'Dim literally appearing from shadows, throughout the whole encounter he is shot from underneath and Geralt is from above. And yes, it is because he is standing and Geralt is sitting and having viewpoints and camera shots allign is critical, but they are shot there way to communicate the towering presence of O'Dim. He kneels when he offers help, gets back up when mentioning his capabilities (he doesn't need to say much as his VO and shot compositions reinforces his power). They come back to the same level as they "negotiate", Geralt in a clear "prisoner pose" and Master Mirror still being somewhat taller then Geralt is.

That's basic choreography but actually enhances the conversation.

Hmm, interesting argument with some good points thanks.

I had another look at the scene. I would disagree that his introduction necessarily hints at malice, that sense grows throughout the scene. It's not so much as he appears from the shadows, rather the devs use the shadows to gradually bring him into focus to be visible just as Geralt says 'someone to talk to'. They could have achieved the same by blurring and focusing on him as Geralt says these words. But yes, definitely he's introduced with a visual clue that there is something supernatural about the timing. He appears just when Geralt is at his lowest.

The shot composition would be the same if say he was a jailer who was offering Geralt's freedom in return for a favour. So it doesn't especially say he is a being of great power, not yet anyway. It's not so much that this guy is uber powerful, though, more than Geralt here is screwed and in a bad spot. But you are right, it absolutely highlights the imbalance of power in the scene.

Here is the Raphael scene:
This is a patch 1 version, a lot clunkier than later versions which are smoother.

You can see they do in fact play with angles and shot composition. But nowhere near the level of the Witcher scene. The camera is a bit flat. This is especially true for the MC shots. They should definitely change some angles for these, tilt the camera a little. A shot from behind Raphael's back pointing downwards to the MC would definitely add a bit of menace too. I think they do this once or twice quickly, but most of the time when the MC has dialogue it is a flat close up.

Like. your core choice in this scene - how to reply to Raphael - in this version they seem to focus on a painting of him, while you make that choice. This seems a bizarre artistic decision. For that dialogue, he should definitely be in focus looming over you as you ponder this lose/lose proposal. (As a side note why even include the option to accept his deal if he's going to reject it? This shouldn't be an option)

There are a few capstone scenes in act 1, this being one of them. Your post has definitely convinced me if they are going for cinematic with this game, they should use the tools of cinema a little more. But they are definitely doing it and also refining as they release more patches. Hopefully they also take note of interesting observations such as yours.

Watching the scene as a youtube video, rather than actually playing it myself, I did however feel Raphael is perhaps the teeniest bit over campy. They could dial that down a little without losing whatever it is they are trying to get across.
(I personally think they could dial Volo down a notch too).

Joined: Dec 2020
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Originally Posted by Dexai
When you get to her in the Goblin base you have to ask her to help you with your condition, and she'll invite you back to her... "office" wink . When you get there, she separates you from the party, sees the tadpole, and gives you a "cure" which is actually a sleeping potion. Then she shackles you in one of the jail cells in her private little sanctum (you know where her body guard ogre hangs out).

So you need to go to her for a cure, accept her "cure", and also not be an elf or a half-elf (because elves are immune to sleeping magic and the option will fail if you drink it -- a nice touch that they remembered that I think -- at least so I read here on the forums).


Have to try that with my next non-elven or non-halfelven character.


"We are all stories in the end. Just make it a good one."

Doctor Who
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How did we even got to the Raphael scene? But I agree, it is one of possibel more encounters, so maybe it gets better. Still, as Wormerine said, Raphael was featured heavily in trailers and stuff, but I found this encounter ... lacking. There are a lot of minor encounters, even with characters, I don't like, that are much more meorable - on the top of my head I would say Alfira, Gut, Abdirak, Kagha (but she is a bit more than a minor encounter), the tiefling couple, the three tiefling adventuerers, the artist in the Zhentarim hideout, Mol, Arabella and her parents, Volos goblin caretaker, the deep gnome at the windmill (love that guy)...


"We are all stories in the end. Just make it a good one."

Doctor Who
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