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#765874 19/03/21 02:24 PM
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Please provide players with more Full Recovery zones/items rather than forcing people to Long Rest just before facing a Boss.

Example: Hag fight. Makes no sense to End Day, rest for practically 24 hours, before facing the hag, like she's just gonna wait for me to return and fight her. Instead, makes more sense to provide some sort of Full Recovery Potion you can find in her lair or a Full Recovery Zone (something similar to what is provided on the nautiloid) that you can find just before facing her. It could even be something you have to search for or you'll miss it. Just something so that I can be better equipped to face her without having to End Day.

The hag fight has always been hard for me to win without restoring all health and spell slots beforehand, but that goes against logic and reason from a roleplaying perspective. I'd rather have something I can find and use to fully recover all my heroes with full spells, etc. just before fighting her and other really tough bosses.

I'm actually think more along the lines of a Full Recovery Potion, so that instead of all characters fully recovering it would be maybe just 1 or 2, and if you don't need to fully recover you could save it for a different end boss fight that you might need it for. This way, players aren't always looking for a Full Recovery zone just before every Boss fight, which would not make sense. Instead, they could buy or find Full Recovery potions in places like the hag's home.

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I disagree. Isn't a big point of adding time constraints (something you're strongly in favor of) that now there is more risk-vs-reward? You can:
-be tactical, conserving resources to try to get through the Dungeon without long resting. In this situation, you arrive in time to save Mayrina.
-go all out in each fight, long resting 1+ times after entering the Dungeon. In this situation, you have taken too long and Mayrina is sent off.

With "Full Recovery Potions" added before boss fights, you're rewarding players who used up all their resources before the final boss and taunting players who have painstakingly gone through the fights trying to use as little resources as possible.

I'm especially against being able to simply buy these potions, unless they are prohibitively (>20k gp) expensive. If they can be bought cheaply, then any areas where you can't fast-travel lose a lot of their tension.

Finally, there's a realism argument. Why are incredibly powerful Full Recovery Potions (even worse if they are Zones) just lying around in areas before the boss fight? It makes sense in the tutorial level because it is the tutorial level. If these potions are found anywhere, they should be after a boss in that boss's treasure hoard.

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Well. You aren't wrong. Lol. I came up with this suggestion because right now there is no logical reasoning behind being able to do a long 8 hour rest prior to the hag's lair fight. This would give players the ability to fully recover just before fights like that without having to do something unbelievable like rest for 24 hours first.

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Now that we have Druids, don't you have to do Ethel solo?

One way of making different difficulty levels would be to vary the resources, so that those who use lots of resources could play easier levels and those that use fewer can chose a level more suited to their style. Swen's semi solo druid run at Ethel did show some helpful tips, as well as highlight lots of potions that were lying around to help. (Semi, in that it didn't quite go according to plan and he had to get one of the crew to drop him a speed potion.) I've cheesed that with a solo stealth ranger, but I've also messed it up royally. I have no idea how I'd deal with it with a cleric or fighter main.

But ultimately insta potions vs full rest is six of one half a dozen of the other. Using either means that you haven't found a way to use the crew to their best. Or possibly really bad luck. In the nautiloid you didn't have a rest option, and it is the first tutorial, so a little help is nice, you can try things, but I'm not convinced we need that level of support in the main game.

Different folks do things in different ways, and it might make sense to make it easier for some ways of getting through with options (like the loaded dice) or difficulty levels in the final product. Heck, it took me a few runs to understand what all the people talking about dream sequences were on about, which made the "who do you dream of" in the character creation seem reaaaaally confusing. Once you accept that bargain, lots of things get easier. smile

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Personally, I feel the difficulty settings should include an option for healing items and spells to provide max healing. That would help a lot.

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Please balance the game and help people to understand what action economy mean instead of adding other OP items.

A full recovery potion would really suck according to me. That's exactly why rests exists.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 19/03/21 04:49 PM.
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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Well. You aren't wrong. Lol. I came up with this suggestion because right now there is no logical reasoning behind being able to do a long 8 hour rest prior to the hag's lair fight. This would give players the ability to fully recover just before fights like that without having to do something unbelievable like rest for 24 hours first.

Then I suggest you do what I do and just go in without resting.

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The idea was because fighting hag without End Day is hard at best. I've struggled many times to fight the Red Caps, then the brain washed heroes and finally the hag.

So either provide me a way to more easily defeat the hag, dumbing her down a bit (as well as other boss monsters) or give me another way to full recover beforehand. That's the idea anyway.

My biggest issue with this game right now is that it is constantly encouraging you to End Day in one form or another. Either characters are saying, "Gosh I'm tired. Let's end day," or the boss fights are so hard to beat unless you Long Rest beforehand. This is why many think the game is too hard.

Now. One could argue. Get good. Learn to better plan your spell usage, etc. There's something to that, of course, but who likes to save scum all the time because they didn't realize that they weren't in an epic boss fight when they thought they were.

The hag is the perfect example. When she first summons her Red Caps, I'm thinking. Boss fight! Use all your spells to kill her and her Red Caps. So I waste all my spells right away only to discover she retreats, heals up and fights you much later.

This is fine except for the fact that if I use up all my spells then, because I think I'm in a boss fight, I'm doomed later unless I Long Rest.

So, perhaps the better solution is to say, "Larian. Don't mess with me. Have Ethel immediately retreat and vanish to her lair so I don't assume this is a boss fight and waste all my good magic before I reach her lair." I think most of the other bosses, now that I think about it, aren't like this. Most you can pretty much tell you aren't in a boss fight until you actually fight the boss.

So maybe it's just a hag fight thing, especially since her fight should be time sensitive because she's not going to wait around forever until you show up 24 hours later to fight her.

So okay. No recovery items. Let's instead make it so that players don't get messed over by the hag, tricked into thinking they need to use all their spells right away.

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I know the game presents it as longer, but technically a long rest is only 8 hours. It's not actually crazy if she's hiding in her lair that you might have 8 hours.

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I see no reason to put a full recovery zone in a dungeon.
Why would an evil boss put such a thing between himself and the entrance to make sure people who attack him are fully rested?

There should be a good in game reason to put something in the game.


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Oh, I suppose this is a hag lair and hags love both bargains and curses. Perhaps it's a trap.
You use the full recovery spa and get fully recovered, but by doing so you've accepted hidden (perception, insight, or some type of intelligence check?) terms and conditions to allow the hag to sap your life force. During the combat with the hag, she can do [something bad idk] to any characters that benefited from the recovery area.

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Please balance the game and help people to understand what action economy mean instead of adding other OP items.

A full recovery potion would really suck according to me. That's exactly why rests exists.
Hey I think you misunderstood me, though that's on me for not being clearer.
I meant, if a potion recovers 1d6 HP, I'd like the option of automatic 6 HP instead of rolling for it. Not fully healing my character.

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Correcting a potentially problematic mechanic with an equally problematic mechanic (overpowered) is never a good choice.

No vote for Full Recovery items here.

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Yeah. Upon hearing your thoughts, all of you, I agree. For the most part, it's not needed.

Ultimately, the hag is my issue. She's whooped me more times than not. In my mind, she's a save scum boss fight. Not sure of they made it,easier in Patch 4 yet, but last time I fought her I tried sneaking. Nope. Game won't let you. Even though you know she's there, she gets surprise round. When you don't long rest beforehand its really hard.

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I think you are absolutely right about this.

Force long resting on players is just really lame for a video game, maybe the potion wasnt the best solution but it needs to change.

The BIGGEST problem is that there is a part of the playerbase (the majority of users of this forum) that thinks that we have to follow the rules of dnd by the letter in every aspect, which limits SO MUCH what Larian can do about this.

People will say, "oh, get good, fight with limit resouces" Like acutally not using my cool spells??? Like using the weak ones and be in most fight for + 5 min bcz of all of the misses?? (Sacred flame yes im talking to you)


I mean, fine, if Larian is gonna cope with this more active part of the community that demands dnd dnd dnd, I wanna see Larian going the extra mile for it, making a mechanic that is not just lazy as this one, and dont get me wrong, I love the game, but the resting system is just lazy.

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Originally Posted by SystemRPG
I think you are absolutely right about this.

Force long resting on players is just really lame for a video game, maybe the potion wasnt the best solution but it needs to change.

The BIGGEST problem is that there is a part of the playerbase (the majority of users of this forum) that thinks that we have to follow the rules of dnd by the letter in every aspect, which limits SO MUCH what Larian can do about this.

People will say, "oh, get good, fight with limit resouces" Like acutally not using my cool spells??? Like using the weak ones and be in most fight for + 5 min bcz of all of the misses?? (Sacred flame yes im talking to you)


I mean, fine, if Larian is gonna cope with this more active part of the community that demands dnd dnd dnd, I wanna see Larian going the extra mile for it, making a mechanic that is not just lazy as this one, and dont get me wrong, I love the game, but the resting system is just lazy.

I want them to do more DnD. Lol. But the resting has no limits and Larian might need to tweak certain fights so they are doable without long resting or being a DnD pro. The hag fight is the most difficult for me, and I am a DnD person.

The game gives tons of potions and jazz for healing, but they are pointless because I can long rest any time I want, even when it makes no sense.

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Corect me if im wrong ...
But i believe this feature is allready in game. O_o

True, you are unable to Long Rest directly at some places, like Hag's lair ...
But as far as i know, you are able to fast travel from there ... also as far as i know, you are allways able to fast travel to your camp (and back) ... and as far as i know, once you are in your camp, you are allways able to long rest. O_o

I never used that myself tho, since i find it interesting to distribue my resources so i survive dungeons in one long rest ... but i believe it should be possible.

Last edited by RagnarokCzD; 23/03/21 10:28 AM.

I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Oh ok, this is finally another thread about the broken rest mechanic.

Originally Posted by SystemRPG
I think you are absolutely right about this.

Force long resting on players is just really lame for a video game, maybe the potion wasnt the best solution but it needs to change.

The BIGGEST problem is that there is a part of the playerbase (the majority of users of this forum) that thinks that we have to follow the rules of dnd by the letter in every aspect, which limits SO MUCH what Larian can do about this.

People will say, "oh, get good, fight with limit resouces" Like acutally not using my cool spells??? Like using the weak ones and be in most fight for + 5 min bcz of all of the misses?? (Sacred flame yes im talking to you)


I mean, fine, if Larian is gonna cope with this more active part of the community that demands dnd dnd dnd, I wanna see Larian going the extra mile for it, making a mechanic that is not just lazy as this one, and dont get me wrong, I love the game, but the resting system is just lazy.

You should probably try to understand WHY people are asking the game to be more D&D.

I'm not a D&D player but if you understand how D&D work (or is supposed to), it's easy to understand that BG3 could be better on many things with more D&D.

Still waiting the CONS on many threads.
Our DM have decided that we should use all spellslots on every encounters. Not D&D.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 23/03/21 11:15 AM.
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This one was supposed to be about trying to offer a solution so maybe they'd limit long rests. The point is that fights like the hag are too tough without long rest, but it makes no sense to long rest during the entire scenario.

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Or more similar to Deadfire? Health is auto restored at the end of combat HOWEVER max health is lowered a certain percentage if you got knocked unconscious (HP0-1), or some other xxx effect ...until you rest. Food provides NOT health but minor bonuses to stats, and spoils after a few days depending of the food..(ooops, thats right no TIME in BG3...) I kind of like all of this, balances fun and <realistic> RPG gameplay.
At this point who gives a rats about D&D gameplay. Larian wants to do it their way.

Last edited by mr_planescapist; 23/03/21 11:26 AM.
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