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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
And that is exactly what i dont understand ...
You say you dont want to do that ... yet you would do that ... but why would you, if you dont want to?
And dont try to tell me you need to, since if you need to, that would mean that everyone need to, and since i have 324h played on this game, and i never needed to "constantly moving slots around" ... its clearly not needed. O_o

And one more think i dont quite understand ...
If this sugestion will be included, and we get "button" that will allow us acess to all our spells at once ...
I dare to presume it would work the same as curent popup menus, we allready have ... meaning we will not be able to rearange our spells.
Where is difference between having "all spells in the row" on hotbar ... and having "all spells in the row" in popup menu after you push the button? How is that suppose to be anyhow clearer? laugh

What is there not to understand? I don’t want to micromanage. Having a giant hotbar forces me to micromanage to properly play the game. I move stuff around because I HAVE to not because I want to.

Solasta works like a flow chart. It provides me with a list of all my options and then guides me. It’s incredibly simple but elegant. Honestly at this point all I can tell you is try it yourself if you are willing to spend the money. I think plenty of people have explained in this thread why BG3 can improve their UI in a significant way.

And I never understood why people post how many hours they played as if playing a ton of hours makes them an expert. All it tells me is they are more tolerant of accepting mediocrity.

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Originally Posted by spectralhunter
What is there not to understand?
It might be a surprise ...
But since i specificly told you that i dont understand that you do something you dont want to do ... that is there not to understand.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Having a giant hotbar forces me to micromanage to properly play the game. I move stuff around because I HAVE to not because I want to.
Yeah, that much you claimed before ...

And that is reason i asked: How is that possible that you HAVE (because it looks like caps lock increases the veracity of your arguments) to do something that i never seen in 300 hours, all clases, some of them multiple times?
Don't you feel that if you HAVE to do something, others HAVE to do it too? So how is it possible that I didn't HAVE to? O_o

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Solasta works like a flow chart. It provides me with a list of all my options and then guides me. It’s incredibly simple but elegant.
This is a question of purely personal taste, this is how the BG interface seem to me for example ...
Although there is room for improvement, for example, the already mentioned enlargement of the bar would help a lot.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Honestly at this point all I can tell you is try it yourself if you are willing to spend the money.
Im not, and i would say its pretty obvious. wink

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
And I never understood why people post how many hours they played as if playing a ton of hours makes them an expert.
Well ... me neither, that is one of reasons i didnt do it ...

But even so, the information has a certain value if one wants to look for it, instead of perceiving everything as an effort by others to pull on it. : P
For example, in this context, if I were a person who has played 1.5 hours, it would make perfect sense that I never came across the need to rearrange the icons in the hotbar. But I'm not.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
All it tells me is they are more tolerant of accepting mediocrity.
A little too condemning for my taste ...
I dont quite understand why so many people around this forum have feeling that their opinion and taste for stuff is the only proper and right one, and everyone else are just wrong.

I like this, you like that ... its not matter of some "quality", just taste. wink
In my opinion, best way for Larian to work is at least try to satisfy us both.


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Yeah, that much you claimed before ...

And that is reason i asked: How is that possible that you HAVE (because it looks like caps lock increases the veracity of your arguments) to do something that i never seen in 300 hours, all clases, some of them multiple times?
Don't you feel that if you HAVE to do something, others HAVE to do it too? So how is it possible that I didn't HAVE to? O_o

And this is why I said you are more tolerant to mediocrity. You don’t fully understand how another system works so it’s hard for you to compare. You said yourself you don’t play Solasta or plan to play it in the future. Your information is strictly based on BG3 and previous games. I and others are trying to tell you there’s a better system. Just because you are okay with 300+ hours of mediocrity doesn’t mean we should stick with it.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
And I never understood why people post how many hours they played as if playing a ton of hours makes them an expert.

Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Well ... me neither, that is one of reasons i didnt do it ...

But even so, the information has a certain value if one wants to look for it, instead of perceiving everything as an effort by others to pull on it. : P
For example, in this context, if I were a person who has played 1.5 hours, it would make perfect sense that I never came across the need to rearrange the icons in the hotbar. But I'm not.

What do you mean you didn’t do it. You specifically stated you played 324 hours. People only state hours for a few reasons.

To let everyone know how much they love the game.
To imply they have some intimate knowledge of the game to tout some form of expertise or experience.

Why did you mention it other than to suggest your assertion is correct and that other people need to play more to understand nothing is wrong? Or is your experience the only one to consider?

Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
A little too condemning for my taste ...
I dont quite understand why so many people around this forum have feeling that their opinion and taste for stuff is the only proper and right one, and everyone else are just wrong.

I like this, you like that ... its not matter of some "quality", just taste. wink
In my opinion, best way for Larian to work is at least try to satisfy us both.

Dude. You are doing the same thing. People are suggesting another method that might be better (I will admit I think it is objectively better) but you are saying they are wrong.

You didn’t have to mess with the hotbar so anyone else who does is clearly wrong? Right? I mean you did spend 300+ hours and didn’t need to change it so everyone else is playing the game wrong?

The good news for you is Larian agrees with you. Not because Larian thinks hotbars are better. They are just not focused on making the game mechanics efficient. They have other priorities.

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Originally Posted by fallenj
Cool, keybinds are related to the ui and making it functional. Did you know if you hit V it opens up the spell section of your ui? There is no 1-9 spell slots, all your spells are hidden behind a pop up. You get it now?

Comparing the ui to a jump feature...is this a thing now? We are talking about the ui btw.

That last part is just you making stuff up

How is the last part making stuff up when literally everything is pointing to this being fact at this point? The very first preview they showed a whole year ago at this point made it extremely clear that BG3 is using a refurbished DOS2 engine, and I was one of those people who remained optimistic because it was obviously a work in progress and that everything was just using placeholder assets to have something to show that BG3 even exists. I cannot say the same anymore a whole year later, and lack of any specific word indicating that they're going to even try to distance themselves further away from that. EA launched with you having to manually make all party members jump across, and it took a patch 2 months later to get that partially fixed by having party members automatically follow you across (but the first character still has to manually do it themselves). Spells had different icons for different spell levels until a later patch too. The point I am saying is that actual functionality seems like an afterthought when you think about how everything has progressed thus far.

It really is top down design rather than ground up design. They whipped up the EA to wow people with the visual design, but the actual gameplay design and the UI functionality are still lacking in so many ways. Major things such as not having proper reactions which are integral to how DnD works to begin with does not inspire confidence. If the engine actually COULD handle them, it should not take upwards of 6+ months and counting, and their total silence on this matter is worrying to a lot of the gameplay-minded people in these parts. Which is why at this point, people like I are starting to have doubts whether it is even possible for BG3's engine to handle them (and ready actions) at all. Believe it or not, I actually want BG3 to be better from a gameplay standpoint. As it currently is, BG3's combat is a hybrid of DnD/DOS2, with the latter focus overpowering the former, and a 40/60 split to half of the community if recent polls are any indication are not pleased with the current direction, which should be alarming - especially since one such poll was in the Reddit echo chamber. Either because it's not actually faithful to DnD, but the other less considered standpoint that it's watered down DOS at the same time. Both systems were really not a good fit for each other, with DnD encouraging proactivity while DOS at its core forces reactivity.

Your criticism of Solasta not having keybinds for spells is valid. But you are being highly disingenuous and posting just to be contrarian if that's really your worst issue with Solasta's UI and seemingly presenting it as something anywhere near the same level as BG3's current catch-all hotbar, because the former is a far easier thing to program after the fact compared to redesigning the UI for the latter entirely (if they even have any plans to do that). Hence, ground up design instead of top down. BG3 cannot use a lack of budget as an excuse either, and that's another thing lingering on the back of everyone's minds.

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Total get what OP is saying and agree with most of it, but you're forgetting Larian's limitations. Larian is building this game on a modified engine of their previous engine.

For Larian's platform, some things are just not possible. A lot of things that are being requested in this thread and otherwise are, quite frankly, never going to happen with this release because of the constriction of the engine.

And I don't think Larian quite realized that either until they started making the game and trying to implement things. Patches are slower than advertised, full of bugs, and lots of modifications are taken on implementing things because they have to conform to their engine.

Reactions like Solasta isn't possible with Larian unless they re-designed an entire platform meant for DnD 5e and not their previous games, which would set development back years. They are going to move forward with what they have and make it work.

The masses will love it, the fanatics that are on the forum and/or Reddit will not. It's just time to face reality and stop wishing for things that aren't going to happen.

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Originally Posted by Saito Hikari
Originally Posted by fallenj
Cool, keybinds are related to the ui and making it functional. Did you know if you hit V it opens up the spell section of your ui? There is no 1-9 spell slots, all your spells are hidden behind a pop up. You get it now?

Comparing the ui to a jump feature...is this a thing now? We are talking about the ui btw.

That last part is just you making stuff up

How is the last part making stuff up when literally everything is pointing to this being fact at this point? The very first preview they showed a whole year ago at this point made it extremely clear that BG3 is using a refurbished DOS2 engine, and I was one of those people who remained optimistic because it was obviously a work in progress and that everything was just using placeholder assets to have something to show that BG3 even exists. I cannot say the same anymore a whole year later, and lack of any specific word indicating that they're going to even try to distance themselves further away from that. EA launched with you having to manually make all party members jump across, and it took a patch 2 months later to get that partially fixed by having party members automatically follow you across (but the first character still has to manually do it themselves). Spells had different icons for different spell levels until a later patch too. The point I am saying is that actual functionality seems like an afterthought when you think about how everything has progressed thus far.

It really is top down design rather than ground up design. They whipped up the EA to wow people with the visual design, but the actual gameplay design and the UI functionality are still lacking in so many ways. Major things such as not having proper reactions which are integral to how DnD works to begin with does not inspire confidence. If the engine actually COULD handle them, it should not take upwards of 6+ months and counting, and their total silence on this matter is worrying to a lot of the gameplay-minded people in these parts. Which is why at this point, people like I are starting to have doubts whether it is even possible for BG3's engine to handle them (and ready actions) at all. Believe it or not, I actually want BG3 to be better from a gameplay standpoint. As it currently is, BG3's combat is a hybrid of DnD/DOS2, with the latter focus overpowering the former, and a 40/60 split to half of the community if recent polls are any indication are not pleased with the current direction, which should be alarming - especially since one such poll was in the Reddit echo chamber. Either because it's not actually faithful to DnD, but the other less considered standpoint that it's watered down DOS at the same time. Both systems were really not a good fit for each other, with DnD encouraging proactivity while DOS at its core forces reactivity.

Your criticism of Solasta not having keybinds for spells is valid. But you are being highly disingenuous and posting just to be contrarian if that's really your worst issue with Solasta's UI and seemingly presenting it as something anywhere near the same level as BG3's current catch-all hotbar, because the former is a far easier thing to program after the fact compared to redesigning the UI for the latter entirely (if they even have any plans to do that). Hence, ground up design instead of top down. BG3 cannot use a lack of budget as an excuse either, and that's another thing lingering on the back of everyone's minds.

Exactly. People just need to stop posting about a wishlist of things that are outside of Larian's capability.

Swen basically said himself in their last Twitch reveal for druid that they are having issues coding and programming. Patches take forever and then when they are released we are already on NINE hotfixes for Patch 4 which supposedly went through QA (LOLOLOLOLOL)

By the way, because they are and STILL working on more hotfixes for Patch 4, Patch 5 updates have been very few. Essentially we are still in Patch 4 and each patch just breaks things from previous patches whenever they try to introduce something new.

I don't even expect Patch 5 for another 3 months, maybe longer if a new class is involved.

It's been apparent for a LONG time that Larian bit off WAAAAAAAAAAAY more than they could chew with this game and they're intentionally bluffing and withholding information so most people don't catch on.

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Originally Posted by gaymer
Total get what OP is saying and agree with most of it, but you're forgetting Larian's limitations. Larian is building this game on a modified engine of their previous engine.

For Larian's platform, some things are just not possible. A lot of things that are being requested in this thread and otherwise are, quite frankly, never going to happen with this release because of the constriction of the engine.

And I don't think Larian quite realized that either until they started making the game and trying to implement things. Patches are slower than advertised, full of bugs, and lots of modifications are taken on implementing things because they have to conform to their engine.

Reactions like Solasta isn't possible with Larian unless they re-designed an entire platform meant for DnD 5e and not their previous games, which would set development back years. They are going to move forward with what they have and make it work.

The masses will love it, the fanatics that are on the forum and/or Reddit will not. It's just time to face reality and stop wishing for things that aren't going to happen.

I have no idea what the DOS engine is or isn’t capable of implementing. Larian hasn’t officially stated anything of the sort. But I’m not holding my breath and in general agree with you.

What I won’t be is an apologist for Larian for their lack of foresight or incompetence.

You are correct. This game is for the masses and will be an outstanding story and dating simulator. But as someone who paid for the game hoping for something else (that Larian implied they were going to do their best), I will vent my dissatisfaction and still offer suggestions which like you said will most likely not happen.

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Does anyone have actual evidence on what the DOS engine can or can't handle? I see a lot of posts claiming that the DOS engine can't handle this or that as explanations for why BG3 doesn't have certain features, but the fact that Larian hasn't yet implemented X doesn't prove that the DOS engine can't handle X.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

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Originally Posted by gaymer
Total get what OP is saying and agree with most of it, but you're forgetting Larian's limitations. Larian is building this game on a modified engine of their previous engine.

For Larian's platform, some things are just not possible. A lot of things that are being requested in this thread and otherwise are, quite frankly, never going to happen with this release because of the constriction of the engine.

And I don't think Larian quite realized that either until they started making the game and trying to implement things. Patches are slower than advertised, full of bugs, and lots of modifications are taken on implementing things because they have to conform to their engine.

Reactions like Solasta isn't possible with Larian unless they re-designed an entire platform meant for DnD 5e and not their previous games, which would set development back years. They are going to move forward with what they have and make it work.

The masses will love it, the fanatics that are on the forum and/or Reddit will not. It's just time to face reality and stop wishing for things that aren't going to happen.

Pretty much. Hindsight is 2020.

I still choose to have some hope that Larian may surprise us, but after hearing about how DOS2 EA went, I’m not expecting it.

I think my litmus test that shows me what direction the game will ultimately take is seeing how Paladin is designed. People say Druid was complicated, but transformations are a great deal easier to handle and had prior precedence in DOS2 compared to stuff like reactions. The most complicated thing about Druid was probably their immediate story relevance.

It’s also for this reason that Paladin or Monk being released earlier or later would probably be a sign on how they’ll be implemented. The later they’re released, the more people are going to expect proper reactions. That said, I don’t think they’ll release a patch without another accompanying class to go along with it again, so we’ll probably see an easier to design class next. My bet is on Bard, because Bardic Inspiration is the only complicated thing about it, and we need a second CHA focused class.

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This thread is taking a distinct turn towards both bad tempered arguments between posters (as opposed to reasonable discussion and debate), and a lot of wild speculation which is bordering on, if not crossing the line into, defamation and misrepresentation.

Given that none of you have a hotline to Larian's design team, and none of you are psychic, I suggest that you restrain yourselves in trying to second-guess either their motives or ethics.

Criticise with constructive feedback by all means, but just remember who hosts this forum and step away from uninformed abuse.

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Originally Posted by Saito Hikari
Originally Posted by gaymer
Total get what OP is saying and agree with most of it, but you're forgetting Larian's limitations. Larian is building this game on a modified engine of their previous engine.

For Larian's platform, some things are just not possible. A lot of things that are being requested in this thread and otherwise are, quite frankly, never going to happen with this release because of the constriction of the engine.

And I don't think Larian quite realized that either until they started making the game and trying to implement things. Patches are slower than advertised, full of bugs, and lots of modifications are taken on implementing things because they have to conform to their engine.

Reactions like Solasta isn't possible with Larian unless they re-designed an entire platform meant for DnD 5e and not their previous games, which would set development back years. They are going to move forward with what they have and make it work.

The masses will love it, the fanatics that are on the forum and/or Reddit will not. It's just time to face reality and stop wishing for things that aren't going to happen.

Pretty much. Hindsight is 2020.

I still choose to have some hope that Larian may surprise us, but after hearing about how DOS2 EA went, I’m not expecting it.

I think my litmus test that shows me what direction the game will ultimately take is seeing how Paladin is designed. People say Druid was complicated, but transformations are a great deal easier to handle and had prior precedence in DOS2 compared to stuff like reactions. The most complicated thing about Druid was probably their immediate story relevance.

It’s also for this reason that Paladin or Monk being released earlier or later would probably be a sign on how they’ll be implemented. The later they’re released, the more people are going to expect proper reactions. That said, I don’t think they’ll release a patch without another accompanying class to go along with it again, so we’ll probably see an easier to design class next. My bet is on Bard, because Bardic Inspiration is the only complicated thing about it, and we need a second CHA focused class.

Before the official druid patch, the only controllable wild shape character (Halsin) was able to cast spells while in bear form. Also, his elven form died when the bear reached 0 HP and did not change back into himself.

And as people noted, you still can't continue to use Moonbeam and other repeatable concentration spells in Wild Shape as you should in DnD rules and tabletop.

Not to mention that Flaming Sphere being treated as an actual summon that can be buffed, rolls for initiative, etc. means that it can be used to exploit certain encounters in the game (there are numerous clips and vids of people abusing Flaming Sphere to kill things without engaging the enemy).

I am most curious about how Larian will be able to implement Metamagic without adding to the already problematic hotkey bloat on the UI or without it being extremely cumbersome to use, e.g. having to press 4+ keys for it to work.

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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Does anyone have actual evidence on what the DOS engine can or can't handle? I see a lot of posts claiming that the DOS engine can't handle this or that as explanations for why BG3 doesn't have certain features, but the fact that Larian hasn't yet implemented X doesn't prove that the DOS engine can't handle X.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

If Larian wants to prove otherwise, that’s really on their messaging, not on us observers. The recent panel from hell was the perfect opportunity to shut everyone up, but they completely dodged all mention of such things. Despite the same topics being all over these forums from the very start of EA. Not even a simple ‘we’re working on it, even if it’s not the same as tabletop’. Speculation then would have turned into positive possibilities about how it’s going to be implemented, instead of the current negativity about whether it’ll make it in at all. People just want any answer at this point.

That said, anyone who has played both games has found it easy to observe how everything that originated from DOS2 happens to be working perfectly in BG3 already, and how certain things like Flaming Sphere that work differently in tabletop got completely twisted to work as a DOS2 summon does, and how jump/disengage got paired together to work as a DOS2 escape skill does, and so on. But that is the expected nature of development using a modified engine. Beyond that, realistically the only thing BG3 has done so far that wasn’t in DOS2 is the cutscenes.

I will repeat that Paladin (or Monk) is my personal litmus test for the gameplay, but it’s probably the same for a lot of other people in terms of gameplay criticism too. It’d make certain things abundantly clear. If there are no reactions, people will likely stop posting about such things because it’d be rather definitive at that point. Before that, this forum will realistically just get louder because there is still a chance.

People have the right not to care about such criticism, but that doesn’t mean one can deny they exist either. In the absence of any answer, the forum’s general mood has admittedly taken a turn for the sensational and desperate, as expected to be.

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Originally Posted by gaymer
Total get what OP is saying and agree with most of it, but you're forgetting Larian's limitations. Larian is building this game on a modified engine of their previous engine.

What they probably thought was their biggest strength, has become their biggest stumbling block, and seems to changed the intention from "adapting 5th edition rules to best suit a computer game" to "adapting a few 5th edition rules, but just falling back on DOS mechanics if those rules are too difficult to understand/implement".

The end result is some nerfed 5E characters running around a DOS world, doing DOS things.

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I feel like there are some people who defend BG3 any time someone puts out a suggestion and they don't agree on anything other than "Don't change BG3 at all." Therefore, it's hard to not feel like I also need to defend myself and my opinions.

But this is not a BG3 vs. Solasta post, as much as it might seem like it. This is not a "I hate BG3 and Solasta rocks," post either. I feel like I always have to reiterate that I really love BG3. I think it's a great game.

All this post is saying is that Solasta did some things really well, and BG3 would benefit from doing something similar.

All I'm asking for is:

1. Character Portraits register when I click on them. Single Click.
2. I can Group all members of the party into a party with a Party Button Mode. I can Ungroup all members of the party by simply clicking on their portrait. One click to Group. One click to Ungroup.
3. I can select a party leader by simply clicking on the portrait and dragging it to the Party Leader position.
4. Actions on the UI are all grouped together. So if I have an Action available in combat, I know right where to go on the UI to select one of my Actions.
5. Bonus Actions on the UI are all grouped together. So if I have a Bonus Action available in combat, I know right where to go on the UI to select one of my Bonus Actions.
6. Cast Spell Button pops up a separate window with a listing of all spells prepared by the caster. There is a Cast Spell button for Actions and a Cast Spell button for Bonus Actions.
7. Powers/Special Abilities Button pops up a separate window with a listing of all special abilities and powers a character can use that aren't spells, etc. 1 Powers/Special Abilities button for Actions and 1 for Bonus Actions. (Special Abilities like Surge, Menacing Attack Melee, Menacing Attack Ranged, Cleave, etc. would fall into this category.)
8. Reduce the number of buttons for Melee and Ranged. I only need 1 Melee button and 1 Ranged button. I don't need a toggle or a Single to Dual toggle plus 4 buttons, 2 for melee and 2 for ranged.
9. Shove has a button on the Action portion of the UI. It is an attack. Therefore, it should be an Action, not a Bonus Action. Shove should also give you the option to either push away or push down. Basically, I either want to shove someone away from me and/or off ledges or knock them prone.
10. Disengage should have a button in Actions portion of the UI. It is an Action, not a Bonus Action, which is really important to AOO rules. If you make it a Bonus Action then AOO's lose their value almost entirely. After all, unless you are needing your Bonus Action to do a second attack or something, you can Disengage after attacking an enemy and not trigger their AOO. Thus, AOO becomes almost pointless to even have in the game. Disengage should also not be linked to Jump because it causes issues where enemies attack when you when try to Disengage jump away.
11. Use Item button pops up a separate window with a listing of all items you can use such as potions, throwing objects, etc. Use Item should be an Action and thus in the Action portion of the UI and not a Bonus Action because you can throw an item, which is an attack. Also, having Drink Potion as a Bonus Action makes it so that Rogue's lose their advantage with the Fast Hands class trait. Fast Hands was meant to allow Rogues to drink potions and such with Bonus Action.
12. Jumping and climbing should be automatic. I select my destination, if my character can go there, they just go there. If an Athletics or Acrobatics roll is required, the game auto-rolls it for me. If my character fails, they fall prone. If they succeed, they continue on as normal. If they can't make the jump, the game tells you, "Your destination is unable to be reached." You don't even need climbing and jumping on the UI at all.
13. Fix BG3's Initiative order. No skipping around and bouncing back and forth between characters in initiative order. Keep the Group Initiative feature, but when I click on End Turn don't end the turn of everyone in the Initiative Group.
14. Stealth Button. If you are in Party Mode, you click a single Stealth button and everyone sneaks. If in Party Mode, you click a single the button again and everyone returns to normal.
13. Fix Stealth so that if you enter a certain sound perimeter around a character that a Stealth Roll must be made against the character's Perception so that unstealthy fighters can't just solo the entire game by stealthing up and assassinating all the enemies. Also make it so that the game only rolls once when you enter a character's Line of Sight/Perception fields. Normal Disadvantage and Advantage rules should apply.
14. Backpacks have meaning. Give them some sort of carrying capacity weight modifiers so that if you put things in bags they weigh less or something.
15. Make crafting simple and easy. You read a recipe, your characters learn it. Crafting screen tells you exactly what you need and if you already have it. If you have everything you need, you click a Craft button and done. No dragging items to some window and trying to figure out if you put the right ones in the window and so forth. The game just tells me if I've met the necessary requirements and lets me click Craft.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
I feel like there are some people who defend BG3 any time someone puts out a suggestion and they don't agree on anything other than "Don't change BG3 at all." Therefore, it's hard to not feel like I also need to defend myself and my opinions.

But this is not a BG3 vs. Solasta post, as much as it might seem like it. This is not a "I hate BG3 and Solasta rocks," post either. I feel like I always have to reiterate that I really love BG3. I think it's a great game.

All this post is saying is that Solasta did some things really well, and BG3 would benefit from doing something similar.

All I'm asking for is:

1. Character Portraits register when I click on them. Single Click.
2. I can Group all members of the party into a party with a Party Button Mode. I can Ungroup all members of the party by simply clicking on their portrait. One click to Group. One click to Ungroup.
3. I can select a party leader by simply clicking on the portrait and dragging it to the Party Leader position.
4. Actions on the UI are all grouped together. So if I have an Action available in combat, I know right where to go on the UI to select one of my Actions.
5. Bonus Actions on the UI are all grouped together. So if I have a Bonus Action available in combat, I know right where to go on the UI to select one of my Bonus Actions.
6. Cast Spell Button pops up a separate window with a listing of all spells prepared by the caster. There is a Cast Spell button for Actions and a Cast Spell button for Bonus Actions.
7. Powers/Special Abilities Button pops up a separate window with a listing of all special abilities and powers a character can use that aren't spells, etc. 1 Powers/Special Abilities button for Actions and 1 for Bonus Actions. (Special Abilities like Surge, Menacing Attack Melee, Menacing Attack Ranged, Cleave, etc. would fall into this category.)
8. Reduce the number of buttons for Melee and Ranged. I only need 1 Melee button and 1 Ranged button. I don't need a toggle or a Single to Dual toggle plus 4 buttons, 2 for melee and 2 for ranged.
9. Shove has a button on the Action portion of the UI. It is an attack. Therefore, it should be an Action, not a Bonus Action. Shove should also give you the option to either push away or push down. Basically, I either want to shove someone away from me and/or off ledges or knock them prone.
10. Disengage should have a button in Actions portion of the UI. It is an Action, not a Bonus Action, which is really important to AOO rules. If you make it a Bonus Action then AOO's lose their value almost entirely. After all, unless you are needing your Bonus Action to do a second attack or something, you can Disengage after attacking an enemy and not trigger their AOO. Thus, AOO becomes almost pointless to even have in the game. Disengage should also not be linked to Jump because it causes issues where enemies attack when you when try to Disengage jump away.
11. Use Item button pops up a separate window with a listing of all items you can use such as potions, throwing objects, etc. Use Item should be an Action and thus in the Action portion of the UI and not a Bonus Action because you can throw an item, which is an attack. Also, having Drink Potion as a Bonus Action makes it so that Rogue's lose their advantage with the Fast Hands class trait. Fast Hands was meant to allow Rogues to drink potions and such with Bonus Action.
12. Jumping and climbing should be automatic. I select my destination, if my character can go there, they just go there. If an Athletics or Acrobatics roll is required, the game auto-rolls it for me. If my character fails, they fall prone. If they succeed, they continue on as normal. If they can't make the jump, the game tells you, "Your destination is unable to be reached." You don't even need climbing and jumping on the UI at all.
13. Fix BG3's Initiative order. No skipping around and bouncing back and forth between characters in initiative order. Keep the Group Initiative feature, but when I click on End Turn don't end the turn of everyone in the Initiative Group.
14. Stealth Button. If you are in Party Mode, you click a single Stealth button and everyone sneaks. If in Party Mode, you click a single the button again and everyone returns to normal.
13. Fix Stealth so that if you enter a certain sound perimeter around a character that a Stealth Roll must be made against the character's Perception so that unstealthy fighters can't just solo the entire game by stealthing up and assassinating all the enemies. Also make it so that the game only rolls once when you enter a character's Line of Sight/Perception fields. Normal Disadvantage and Advantage rules should apply.
14. Backpacks have meaning. Give them some sort of carrying capacity weight modifiers so that if you put things in bags they weigh less or something.
15. Make crafting simple and easy. You read a recipe, your characters learn it. Crafting screen tells you exactly what you need and if you already have it. If you have everything you need, you click a Craft button and done. No dragging items to some window and trying to figure out if you put the right ones in the window and so forth. The game just tells me if I've met the necessary requirements and lets me click Craft.


Yeeess..... also please remove "backstab" advantage, height advantage/disadvantage, give us a real reaction system where we can choose, and please implement classes and enemies as they should be.

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Originally Posted by spectralhunter
And this is why I said you are more tolerant to mediocrity.
And that is why i told you, you are judging too fast.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
You don’t fully understand how another system works so it’s hard for you to compare. You said yourself you don’t play Solasta or plan to play it in the future.
That is where you are wrong. Since i do understand how that UI works, and fully i would dare to say ...
Since to know how UI works, you only need to watch it enough ... that UI will react just the same if i see someone click on icon as if i personaly will hold the mouse that will click on the same icon.
Therefore i dont need to play Solasta.
I have my reasons why i dont want to play that game and they are not part of this conversation.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Your information is strictly based on BG3 and previous games.
This is actualy pretty funy, bcs everyone on this forum (actualy everyone in the world, who played BG3 and at least one another game) have information "strictly based on BG3 and previous games" including youreself . wink

I presume to know what you wanted to say ...
You concider your list of games to be better, since they are fitting your idea of "better UI" whatever that means.
And my list of games, no matter what list it is (since you dont know it) is worse, since it dont include those games that you decided to be the only relevant.
Do you see the irony?

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
I and others are trying to tell you there’s a better system.
Another things where you are wrong ...
All you are telling me is that you like those systems more ... i like this system more.
And as i told you multiple times, this is just matter of taste, or personal prefferences if you like ... none system is "just better" that is litteraly impossible.
One fits to someone, another fits to another one ... simple as that.

The sad part about this is me trying to find a way to satisfy your demands, yet keep my system as intact as possible ... as i said multiple times allready: Fiding solution to satisfy everyone (or as much as possible) ... in shorten called compromise.
Yet you are only trying to persuate me to submit and accept your system as the only right one. :-/

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Just because you are okay with 300+ hours of mediocrity doesn’t mean we should stick with it.
As i said abowe, and multiple times before ...
I dont really care what system would you use, as long as mine will keep intact ... so, another thing where you are wrong. wink

Sadly, there is little chances that Larian will develop two entirely different UI simultaneously ... so, the best way for me to hope that my preferences will be met is try to find (again) multiple times mentioned compromise.

So far closest sugestion to that compromise seem to be button pleaceable anywhere in hotbar named "spells" that allows people to simply open all spells in popup menu ... another button for "scrolls", "consumables", "arrows" etc.
Sadly, most people here seem to me too focused on "OMG SOLASTA IS BEST GIVE ME SOLASTA" to even try to think about it. frown

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
What do you mean you didn’t do it.
I believed that sentence is self-explanatory.

But if you insist ...
You accused me from stating my gameplay just to show, if i may quote "as if playing a ton of hours makes me an expert" ... even despite the fact that I explicitly told (twice ... thrice now), that I had given this information only so that in my question: "how is it possible that I never came across the need to constantly reorganize the hotbar" it was not assumed that I did not play the game long enough, to need to reorganize the hotbar at all.

I believe there is no more reason to stick with this sentence anymore, so i skip rest of your comentary in this matter.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
A little too condemning for my taste ...
I dont quite understand why so many people around this forum have feeling that their opinion and taste for stuff is the only proper and right one, and everyone else are just wrong.

I like this, you like that ... its not matter of some "quality", just taste. wink
In my opinion, best way for Larian to work is at least try to satisfy us both.
Dude. You are doing the same thing. People are suggesting another method that might be better (I will admit I think it is objectively better) but you are saying they are wrong.
Even in that quoted post i pointed out our differences ...

I reapeated them in this post two quotes above, but i can say it once more in case that anyone will skip that previous part:

Solasta UI demanders (read as: you) are demanding complete change of UI, wich would destroy my style of gameplay.
Hotbar supporter (read as: me) try to find the way to satisfy Solasta UI demanders (read as: you) while kepp my style of gameplay still possible.

Aka. to quote from your quoted post: "Satisfy us both". wink
That is difference, therefore im not doing the same thing. wink

Also, as far as i know, i never said that they "are wrong", unless they claim that their way is ultimately better and everyone should obey. Im usualy only poiting out the fact that there are people who simply like the game as it is and find hotbar to be usefull. wink

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
You didn’t have to mess with the hotbar so anyone else who does is clearly wrong? Right? I mean you did spend 300+ hours and didn’t need to change it so everyone else is playing the game wrong?
Well ... yes, but actualy no.
I believe that when anyone is using some mechanic in the way that he have troubles to use it, and he need to re-set everything often and start over and in the end he is still not satisfied with outcome, so sooner or later he need to once more re-set and start over ... he is clearly not using it well.
(Unless he WANT to re-set it often, not sure why anyone would, but not my place to judge.)
Then, when i never had such problem, i dare to say that i use that mechanic efectively enough ... therefore its not fault of mechanic.

To put it simply ... if you try to hammer a nail with screwdriver, its not fault of screwdriver.

You know it kinda reminds me UI discusions on WoW ...
Many people uses tons of addons to change the UI as they see fit ... personaly i simply use default settings (and i mean really default, old style you could say ... not that monstrosity they created in BFA).
Some people cant understand how im i even able to kill anything without having this or that ...
Same as i cant understand how can they even see anything in that game, when there is litteraly TONS of additional bars, coutdowns, cooldown counters, damage/threat/resource/dunno-what-metters and stuff ...

And i have no problem with them.
They like it, they use it, they are effective with it ...
But for me? Such UI would be hammering a nail with screwdriver.
And as long as i can keep my oldscool UI, we are all quite happy. :P

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
The good news for you is Larian agrees with you. Not because Larian thinks hotbars are better. They are just not focused on making the game mechanics efficient. They have other priorities.
That is what i believed with that horrible sugestion to include all spell levels into one pop-up menu ...
And how did that end? :-/
You know what is most funny about it? I actualy did find solution back there.
All i wanted was them simply leave the curent system alone, and simply add either modifier for popup, or another set of spells that would contain all spell levels under one icon.

Everyone could be happy ... now some certainly are, others at least not so much. frown

Last edited by RagnarokCzD; 29/03/21 11:53 PM.

I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Originally Posted by gaymer
Reactions like Solasta isn't possible with Larian unless they re-designed an entire platform meant for DnD 5e and not their previous games, which would set development back years. They are going to move forward with what they have and make it work.

The masses will love it, the fanatics that are on the forum and/or Reddit will not. It's just time to face reality and stop wishing for things that aren't going to happen.
Im not quite sure about Larian's possibilites, or limitations ...
But i would dare to presume that adding certain ("spells" for example) icons, dragable anywhere on hotbar , that would open all (spells in that example) related things at once in popup menu.

That seem perfectly doable even without scraping any so-far development. :-/


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Originally Posted by spectralhunter
And this is why I said you are more tolerant to mediocrity.
And that is why i told you, you are judging too fast.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
You don’t fully understand how another system works so it’s hard for you to compare. You said yourself you don’t play Solasta or plan to play it in the future.
That is where you are wrong. Since i do understand how that UI works, and fully i would dare to say ...
Since to know how UI works, you only need to watch it enough ... that UI will react just the same if i see someone click on icon as if i personaly will hold the mouse that will click on the same icon.
Therefore i dont need to play Solasta.
I have my reasons why i dont want to play that game and they are not part of this conversation.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Your information is strictly based on BG3 and previous games.
This is actualy pretty funy, bcs everyone on this forum (actualy everyone in the world, who played BG3 and at least one another game) have information "strictly based on BG3 and previous games" including youreself . wink

I presume to know what you wanted to say ...
You concider your list of games to be better, since they are fitting your idea of "better UI" whatever that means.
And my list of games, no matter what list it is (since you dont know it) is worse, since it dont include those games that you decided to be the only relevant.
Do you see the irony?

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
I and others are trying to tell you there’s a better system.
Another things where you are wrong ...
All you are telling me is that you like those systems more ... i like this system more.
And as i told you multiple times, this is just matter of taste, or personal prefferences if you like ... none system is "just better" that is litteraly impossible.
One fits to someone, another fits to another one ... simple as that.

The sad part about this is me trying to find a way to satisfy your demands, yet keep my system as intact as possible ... as i said multiple times allready: Fiding solution to satisfy everyone (or as much as possible) ... in shorten called compromise.
Yet you are only trying to persuate me to submit and accept your system as the only right one. :-/

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Just because you are okay with 300+ hours of mediocrity doesn’t mean we should stick with it.
As i said abowe, and multiple times before ...
I dont really care what system would you use, as long as mine will keep intact ... so, another thing where you are wrong. wink

Sadly, there is little chances that Larian will develop two entirely different UI simultaneously ... so, the best way for me to hope that my preferences will be met is try to find (again) multiple times mentioned compromise.

So far closest sugestion to that compromise seem to be button pleaceable anywhere in hotbar named "spells" that allows people to simply open all spells in popup menu ... another button for "scrolls", "consumables", "arrows" etc.
Sadly, most people here seem to me too focused on "OMG SOLASTA IS BEST GIVE ME SOLASTA" to even try to think about it. frown

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
What do you mean you didn’t do it.
I believed that sentence is self-explanatory.

But if you insist ...
You accused me from stating ma gameplay just to show, if i may quote "as if playing a ton of hours makes them an expert" ... even despite the fact that I explicitly told (twice ... thrice now) you that I had given this information only so that in my question: "how is it possible that I never came across the need to constantly reorganize the hotbar" it was not assumed that I did not play the game long enough for it, to need to reorganize the hotbar at all.

I believe there is no more reason to stick with this sentence anymore, so i skip rest of your comentary in this matter.

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
A little too condemning for my taste ...
I dont quite understand why so many people around this forum have feeling that their opinion and taste for stuff is the only proper and right one, and everyone else are just wrong.

I like this, you like that ... its not matter of some "quality", just taste. wink
In my opinion, best way for Larian to work is at least try to satisfy us both.
Dude. You are doing the same thing. People are suggesting another method that might be better (I will admit I think it is objectively better) but you are saying they are wrong.
Even in that quoted post i pointed out our differences ...

I reapeated them in this post two quotes above, but i can say it once more in case that anyone will skip that previous part:

Solasta UI demanders (read as: you) are demanding complete change of UI, wich would destroy my style of gameplay.
Hotbar supporter (read as: me) try to find the way to satisfy Solasta UI demanders (read as: you) while kepp my style of gameplay still possible.

Aka. to quote from your quoted post: "Satisfy us both". wink
That is difference, therefore im not doing the same thing. wink

Also, as far as i know, i never said that they "are wrong", unless they claim that their way is ultimately better and everyone should obey. Im usualy only poiting out the fact that there are people who simply like the game as it is and find hotbar to be usefull. wink

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
You didn’t have to mess with the hotbar so anyone else who does is clearly wrong? Right? I mean you did spend 300+ hours and didn’t need to change it so everyone else is playing the game wrong?
Well ... yes, but actualy no.
I believe that when anyone is using some mechanic in the way that he have troubles to use it, and he need to re-set everything often and start over and in the end he is still not satisfied with outcome, so sooner or later he need to once more re-set and start over ... he is clearly not using it well.
(Unless he WANT to re-set it often, not sure why anyone would, but not my place to judge.)
Then, when i never had such problem, i dare to say that i use that mechanic efectively enough ... therefore its not fault of mechanic.

To put it simply ... if you try to hammer a nail with screwdriver, its not fault of screwdriver.

You know it kinda reminds me UI discusions on WoW ...
Many people uses tons of addons to change the UI as they see fit ... personaly i simply use default settings (and i mean really default, old style you could say ... not that monstrosity they created in BFA).
Some people cant understand how im i even able to kill anything without having this or that ...
Same as i cant understand how can they even see anything in that game, when there is litteraly TONS of additional bars, coutdowns, cooldown counters, damage/threat/resource/dunno-what-metters and stuff ...

And i have no problem with them.
They like it, they use it, they are effective with it ...
But for me? Such UI would be hammering a nail with screwdriver.
And as long as i can keep my oldscool UI, we are all quite happy. :P

Originally Posted by spectralhunter
The good news for you is Larian agrees with you. Not because Larian thinks hotbars are better. They are just not focused on making the game mechanics efficient. They have other priorities.
That is what i believed with that horrible sugestion to include all spell levels into one pop-up menu ...
And how did that end? :-/
You know what is most funny about it? I actualy did find solution back there.
All i wanted was them simply leave the curent system alone, and simply add either modifier for popup, or another set of spells that would contain all spell levels under one icon.

Everyone could be happy ... now some certainly are, others at least not so much. frown

We get it Ragnarok, you love analyzing sentences to their baseline structure and reconstructing them to whatever opinion suits your current mastery of the English language.
Spectralhunter had a very clear point, but I just don't understand what you trying to say.

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Originally Posted by Saito Hikari
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Does anyone have actual evidence on what the DOS engine can or can't handle? I see a lot of posts claiming that the DOS engine can't handle this or that as explanations for why BG3 doesn't have certain features, but the fact that Larian hasn't yet implemented X doesn't prove that the DOS engine can't handle X.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

If Larian wants to prove otherwise, that’s really on their messaging, not on us observers. The recent panel from hell was the perfect opportunity to shut everyone up, but they completely dodged all mention of such things. Despite the same topics being all over these forums from the very start of EA. Not even a simple ‘we’re working on it, even if it’s not the same as tabletop’. Speculation then would have turned into positive possibilities about how it’s going to be implemented, instead of the current negativity about whether it’ll make it in at all. People just want any answer at this point.

That said, anyone who has played both games has found it easy to observe how everything that originated from DOS2 happens to be working perfectly in BG3 already, and how certain things like Flaming Sphere that work differently in tabletop got completely twisted to work as a DOS2 summon does, and how jump/disengage got paired together to work as a DOS2 escape skill does, and so on. But that is the expected nature of development using a modified engine. Beyond that, realistically the only thing BG3 has done so far that wasn’t in DOS2 is the cutscenes.

I will repeat that Paladin (or Monk) is my personal litmus test for the gameplay, but it’s probably the same for a lot of other people in terms of gameplay criticism too. It’d make certain things abundantly clear. If there are no reactions, people will likely stop posting about such things because it’d be rather definitive at that point. Before that, this forum will realistically just get louder because there is still a chance.

People have the right not to care about such criticism, but that doesn’t mean one can deny they exist either. In the absence of any answer, the forum’s general mood has admittedly taken a turn for the sensational and desperate, as expected to be.

Exactly. Instead of having arbiters send out soft threats and attempt to censor and corral the conversation around clear deficiencies, it would be great if that energy were re-directed into putting together some communication on the issues that everyone involved in EA is questioning or concerned with.

We can't deny, based on the presence of Larian employees in this very thread and the influx of feedback, that they aren't aware of what these issues are.

In my opinion, the time and resources dedicated to the technical fail that was the Panel From Hell could have been better used for other pursuits. Everything that was done in that presentation, that took over an hour and had AV issues so bad that less than half of it was actually inaudible, could have been pre-recorded and edited into a 20-minute YouTube video and official patch notes listed.

Similar to the actual game, wherein the amazing cutscenes and visuals have carried, the PFH was distracting from the clear issues with fluff.

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I'm curious, RagnarokCzD. I've seen a lot of your comments shooting down everyone's suggestions. What do you think Larian should change? I really want to know. What would you make better?

Last edited by GM4Him; 30/03/21 12:45 AM.
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