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So, I decided to create three of my characters in Tabletop D&D 5e that I created in BG3. When I did, I noticed some interesting differences. Why have ANY differences? How are the differences hurting the video game?

Here are the differences:

First, as many have noted, no differences in height/weight between any characters, and all characters have the same basic appearances with no variations between races.

Kaedyn - Half-Drow Cleric of Tyr with Acolyte Background
Charisma 12 in the Tabletop vs. 14 in BG3. Not sure why. All other Ability scores came out the same
History Proficiency and Investigation proficiency in Tabletop because of Half-Elf Skill Versatility trait. Kaedyn does not have these extra proficiencies in BG3 because no Skill Versatility trait.
Spells in Tabletop are: Guidance, Sacred Flame, Spare the Dying (Why doesn't this exist in BG3?), Bless, Cure Wounds, Guiding Bolt, Healing Word and Shield of Faith.
Spells in BG3 are: Guidance, Sacred Flame, Resistance, Dancing Lights (I'm assuming from the Drow Race Traits), Cure Wounds, Guiding Bolt, Healing Word and Shield of Faith.
So Spare the Dying was replaced by Resistance and Bless isn't even on my BG3 list. Why?
Equipment in Tabletop (this is the big one): Light Crossbow and 20 bolts, Chain mail, Priest Pack, Holy Symbol, Prayer Book, 5 Sticks of Incense, Vestment, Common Clothes, Belt Pouch and 15 GP.
Equipment in BG3: No ranged weapon, Chain Shirt (which isn't as good as Chain mail), 2 Revivify Scrolls and 2 Healing Potions. No GP.

So why not start Kaedyn in BG3 off with a Light Crossbow, Chain mail and maybe some GP? Why start him off with such weak gear? Now, one could argue that he was captured, so maybe he doesn't have all of his gear. That makes sense. Besides, in this game, what good is a Priest Pack, 5 Sticks of Incense, Vestment, etc.? They'd just be useless equipment unless Larian gave them purpose. A Holy Symbol, though, is supposed to be like a Cleric's spell focus, so why not include that in his inventory? They even have a slot to equip an amulet, so shouldn't the cleric begin with such an item?

As for the 2 Revivify Scrolls and 2 Healing Potions, why start characters with these items? Why not find them in the chambers they begin the game in? After all, no characters in D&D begin with such items at Level 1. Also, only a few classes can even use Revivify Scrolls, so why provide them to everyone? Yeah, I know what some will say. It's a video game, so there is a good chance of dying and needing SOMETHING to bring people back with. If you don't play a class that can use these scrolls then if you die right away there is no way to bring you back. But it's a video game. If you die, reload. Why break the 5e rules for that reason? Besides, once you meet Shadowheart, she can use them. Also, how many truly get to the point of dying in the Prologue before you meet Shadowheart? Even in my initial playthroughs, I never got close to dying in the Prologue.

AND...if you give them the right equipment, such as chain mail instead of a chain shirt, the characters will have a better chance of surviving in the Prologue too. So NOT giving them the right equipment seems pointless and giving everyone health potions and revivify scrolls seems out of place.

Vexir - Female Drow Fighter with Soldier Background
Sunlight Sensitivity in Tabletop and no Sunlight Sensitivity in BG3. This I can kinda understand. The game is mostly in broad daylight, at least throughout most of EA. Therefore, a Drow character would be seriously hindered except when in buildings or in the Underdark. However, that IS a huge part about being a Drow. They are hindered by the daylight. Ultimately, it seems to me that Larian did not want to include this because they didn't want to include Day/Night Cycles so players could adventure by night. If they did Day/Night Cycles, this would REALLY make more sense for the game and create a good deal of diversity between Drow and other elves. Without this racial trait, Drow really aren't much different from your standard elves.

Aside from this, there are ways around the whole Sunlight Sensitivity disadvantage that Drow have. You can use certain spells, potions, etc. to offset. So if they actually included this very important racial trait for Drow, it would just add to the overall strategy of the game. They could even have a special Drow tutorial about Sunlight Sensitivity to warn players that it exists and how they might be able to offset for it.

Superior Darkvision (120 feet) in Tabletop. In BG3, it appears as though they have the standard elven Darkvision of 60 feet. Again, this does not set them apart from the standard elves like it should. A Drow should be able to detect things twice as well in the Underdark or in dark dungeons, etc. than a standard elf.

Military Rank in Tabletop because she is a soldier. Although this doesn't really make THAT much of a difference at first, it COULD be used in BG3 later. Allowing the Soldier Background to have a rank could make for different dialogue options depending on the character. A Human Soldier could meet the Flaming Fist, for example, and they could flash their insignia to gain some semblance of respect because they are interacting with other soldiers. If Vexir were to encounter another Drow, she could flash her insignia and determine where she falls within the Drow ranks in terms of command, etc.

Equipment: Chain mail in tabletop vs. the weaker scale mail in BG3. Why? Why not start with the proper chain mail that is better? I picked a greataxe for her and a longsword. BG3 starts all fighters with just a longsword. Again, why not make equipment selection part of Character Creation, like in the Tabletop? Why not let players choose some of their starter equipment? Light crossbow in tabletop versus a shortbow in BG3. Dungeoneer's pack, insignia of rank, a trophy from a previous kill, set of bone dice, common clothes and a belt pouch. All these things are missing from BG3. So same comments as with Kaedyn here. Why not include these starter items instead of 2 Revivify Scrolls and 2 Healing Potions? She should also start with 10 GP.

Ryth-Shan - Githyanki Ranger with Outlander Background
So maybe I'm not finding the rules around Keeper of the Veil or maybe this is something that Larian added to the game, but it really caused a number of character creation differences. For starters, Keeper of the Veil gave him proficiency in Arcana, which in Tabletop he has no proficiency. Somehow, I was also able to give him Nature as a proficiency in BG3, but in Tabletop he has no Nature proficiency.
Then there's Beast Tamer. Isn't that a class of its own? It's not really a Ranger subclass. Right? Well, this also threw off my Tabletop character creation. Some abilities for Ryth-Shan in BG3 don't exist in Tabletop because of this strange alteration to the Ranger Class.
In Tabletop, Ryth-Shan has proficiency with Thieves Tools because I chose that for his Decadent Mastery trait. He is also proficient with the Lute because he gets to be proficient in a musical instrument due to his Outlander background. In BG3, he has neither of these proficiencies.
He has a Favored Enemy: Aberrations, in Tabletop. He does not have this in BG3.
He cannot summon a Familiar in Tabletop nor can he cast Protection from Evil and Good in Tabletop while he can cast both of these in BG3.
Equipment: Scale mail in Tabletop versus Leather Armor in BG3? Again. Why? Scale mail is better and would help a new player get through the Prologue easier. Longbow in tabletop is superior to the shortbow in BG3. 2 shortswords in Tabletop versus 1 shortsword in BG3. Again. Why? Why not give the PC better gear to start especially if the Tabletop would? It helps with the overall balance. Then, of course, there's the other not-as-important equipment. Ryth-Shan in tabletop has a dungeoneer's pack, staff, hunting trap, trophy from a previous kill, traveler's clothes and a belt pouch. In BG3, he has a Grease Bottle (why?) and the standard 2 Revivify Scrolls and 2 Healing Potions.

So all this to say, I am suggesting that Larian implement the ACTUAL character creation rules from Tabletop D&D 5e. It would only make the game more balanced and it can and would work well with the overall game. It would make things easier for Larian, IMO, because they wouldn't have to try to reinvent the wheels for each character race and class. Just use the rules already established with the selections and items already in place in D&D. If my phone app can do these things for all these classes and races, why can't BG3? I mean, I literally use a D&D 5e Companion App on my phone for all character creation, and it has all these things in place very easily and nicely. It takes me maybe 10 minutes to create a character in my 5e Companion App, and ALL of these items could easily be implemented into a video game. There is not one thing that I've found that would break a video game or even cause imbalance issues. In fact, the app allows me to even create a party and it has the ability to track initiatives for all characters, PCs and NPcs alike.

Again, Larian, I think you're making more work for yourself. Just implement the 5e rules as already vetted out, and the game will be just fine. You may have to tweak a few things, like Ready Action, which might be hard to implement in a Multi-Player setting especially, but those are very few and far between tweaks that would be needed. Just take the easy road and make BG3 genuine 5e. Trust the rules, and let the tabletop game carry the video game. It'll work out. Just have faith in WotC.

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ARE WE EVER GETTING AN ANSWER TO THE CHARACTER IMPORT/EXPORT? I hate re-explaining this, but im talking about this game only not previous versions. CAN WE PLEASE TRANSFER OUR CHARACTER FROM OUR OWN SAVE POINT TO A FRIENDS SAVE. I HATE THE AWFUL COMPANIONS AND THE THOUGHT OF PLAYING THEM RUINS THIS GAME FOR ME!!

I want to build my own party, transfer gear from one game state to another, play in my friends games with my character with gear and levels. Maybe they are stuck and need higher level help. Maybe their wizard wants to start the game with a crown of intellect. Who cares, its something RPG games of this sort did for years and years and the thought of jumping into a friends game as one of the poorly written companions just makes me sick. This game seems like it could be fun, if they follow the request of players. For the "thats cheating" group, please add some invite modifiers so they can block people on their fourth or fifth playthrough if they are so offended by a video game.

I dont need this for the EA, but its coming up on a year and this hasnt even been addressed. I DO NOT want D:OS3! There are already enough things to be annoyed with in this game, I just want to know if this will be a feature???

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I don't care that it's not 100% faithfull to D&D but I don't really understand some changes, I'd like to be able to choose my starting equipment and the character creation looks way too much like DoS / really lack of GOOD explanations and UI to teach the basic rules.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 21/05/21 04:25 PM.
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Originally Posted by Vekkares
ARE WE EVER GETTING AN ANSWER TO THE CHARACTER IMPORT/EXPORT? ?
We never got any straight answer (or anything resembling explicit direct communication, really) in almost 8 months of Early Access, so I'm not sure why you seem to think that spamming this angry question everywhere is going to get YOU, in particular out of all the people here, one.


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About Bless: it is clearly in the BG3 priest spell list - you must have overlooked it.


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Originally Posted by fylimar
About Bless: it is clearly in the BG3 priest spell list - you must have overlooked it.

Oh no. My point is that I should have receives Bless because I am a Cleric of Life Domain. It should be an auto prepared spell.

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
I don't care that it's not 100% faithfull to D&D but I don't really understand some changes, I'd like to be able to choose my starting equipment and the character creation looks way too much like DoS / really lack of GOOD explanations and UI to teach the basic rules.
Obligatory "Armor progression in BG3 is wack" post.

Characters should start with bad armor in one of the 3 tiers: leather armor (light armor), chain shirt/scale mail (medium), or chain mail (heavy).
Level 2-3 characters should acquire the next level of armor (e.g., studded leather or leather +1, breastplate, and splint mail)
Level 4-6 characters should acquire the next level of armor (e.g., studded +1, half plate, and full plate)
Levels 6+ characters should get more magical versions of ^

Characters should not start out with only light or medium armors, and then find magical versions of those before even finding decent mid-tier Heavy Armor. Last time I played (patch 2), the only heavy armor I found was Ring Mail, which is worse than what level 1 characters are supposed to start out with. My level 4 fighter with 8 dex should have access to splint mail AT LEAST.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Vexir - Female Drow Fighter with Soldier Background
Sunlight Sensitivity in Tabletop and no Sunlight Sensitivity in BG3. This I can kinda understand. The game is mostly in broad daylight, at least throughout most of EA. Therefore, a Drow character would be seriously hindered except when in buildings or in the Underdark. However, that IS a huge part about being a Drow. They are hindered by the daylight. Ultimately, it seems to me that Larian did not want to include this because they didn't want to include Day/Night Cycles so players could adventure by night. If they did Day/Night Cycles, this would REALLY make more sense for the game and create a good deal of diversity between Drow and other elves. Without this racial trait, Drow really aren't much different from your standard elves.

Aside from this, there are ways around the whole Sunlight Sensitivity disadvantage that Drow have. You can use certain spells, potions, etc. to offset. So if they actually included this very important racial trait for Drow, it would just add to the overall strategy of the game. They could even have a special Drow tutorial about Sunlight Sensitivity to warn players that it exists and how they might be able to offset for it.

Keep in mind that due to the parasites there are no disadvantages.... *cough* Astarian *cough*

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Yeah, I figured someone would say that. The parasites change them all. Wait. Nope. Not really. They just change a select few like Drow sensitivity to sun. Hmm...

And they never state this. So if my Drow suddenly doesn't have sensitivity to sun, why doesn't she say, "Wait. Somethings off. I am standing in full sunlight and it doesn't effect me."

Nah. Not buying it.

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Mechanically I would prefer to roll 4d6 for each stat (dropping lowest).

Visually I would like the character creation screens to look more D&D and less DoS.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Yeah, I figured someone would say that. The parasites change them all. Wait. Nope. Not really. They just change a select few like Drow sensitivity to sun. Hmm...

And they never state this. So if my Drow suddenly doesn't have sensitivity to sun, why doesn't she say, "Wait. Somethings off. I am standing in full sunlight and it doesn't effect me."

Nah. Not buying it.

Maybe the line is not implemented yet?
Astarion does have a line saying something extremely similar, it's not in game yet either but will probably be when the companions become playable characters. No reason why they couldn't add a similar line for the PC Drow characters?

You are right though! Not knowing much about DnD, I started a Drow character and had no idea Drow were supposed to be sensitive to sunlight until other NPCs started making surprised comments such as "a Drow? in the sun?" and I went to google it...

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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Characters should not start out with only light or medium armors, and then find magical versions of those before even finding decent mid-tier Heavy Armor. Last time I played (patch 2), the only heavy armor I found was Ring Mail, which is worse than what level 1 characters are supposed to start out with. My level 4 fighter with 8 dex should have access to splint mail AT LEAST.

The only heavy armour better than the Ring Mail is the Chain Mail sold by the Zhentarim trader in the Selune temple. So a fighter with 8 Dex has to limp along with Chain Shirt till he gets to the ruins to find his Ring Mail, which is slightly better, but not good at all. And then he'd still have to drag himself all the way to the temple in order to buy the Chainmail that should have been with him at character creation in the first place. And there are no enchanted heavy armour in the game, so the Chainmail that should have been in his starter kit is actually the end game gear in EA.

This has skewed Fighter builds in EA away from heavy armoured builds towards medium armoured ones.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Yeah, I figured someone would say that. The parasites change them all. Wait. Nope. Not really. They just change a select few like Drow sensitivity to sun. Hmm...

And they never state this. So if my Drow suddenly doesn't have sensitivity to sun, why doesn't she say, "Wait. Somethings off. I am standing in full sunlight and it doesn't effect me."

Nah. Not buying it.
This could cause a lot of problems ...
Just look over this forum , how many people are complaining about "not being able to land hit" bcs they are too lazy to run around the target to get advantage. Yes, i know its not "by the book" ... but curently the fight is working this way, and therefore we are logicaly expected to do that. laugh

Now just imagine that those who would pick Drow will get automatic disadvantage anytime they would be in sun. -_- ... And when you do that, imagine all those new topics about "not being able to land strike". laugh

Originally Posted by Riandor
Mechanically I would prefer to roll 4d6 for each stat (dropping lowest).
I believe rolling for stats was confrimmed back in the past as "planned for full release, not implemented yet". wink


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Yeah, I get it. I said so when first bringing up sun sensitivity. Drow would have serious disadvantage since most of EA is bathed in sunlight. Of course, if they did Day/Night cycle, letting players choose night playthroughs...

But whatever. The Drow sun sensitivity is only one part of this post. The point is that there are a number of things wrong with Character Creation. By not following the already play tested and established 5e rules even for character creation, they throw the balance of the gane off. So it all snowballs. Of course they need to work hard to figure out how to better balance the game when they tweak even character creation so that characters start with less than they should - less equipment, less spells. So then, standard enemy challenge ratings don't work because enemies are tougher to beat because PCs are less well equipped in various ways. So then they have to nerf the system so players aren't frustrated by going up against enemies that are too tough, and so forth.

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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
I believe rolling for stats was confrimmed back in the past as "planned for full release, not implemented yet". wink
It was, but it's on a list of things that were "confirmed in development" at some point when EA started and never talked ever again since then. Which makes me wonder if plans could have changed along the road.

Last edited by Tuco; 22/05/21 02:24 PM.

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Based on this:
Time 8:00 - deleted race tags
Im almost certain that plans have changed ...
Question is how much. O_o


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Drows for sure have more dark vision in the game. Been a long time since I tested it though.

Last edited by fallenj; 22/05/21 02:33 PM.

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