if you weren't on the hype train thinking it was going to be gta and skyrim combined, it's not a bad game at all. It feels very much like a Deus Ex style of game to me.
Actually, games like GTA don't appeal to me at all, and I did not care for Skyrim. But I loved TW3, and the only reason I didn't buy CP2077 right away is that I tend to like only RPGs in fantasy settings and generally have a hard time with immersion in other settings, especially ones involving guns/directed energy weapons because the consequences of getting hit by those kinds of weapons don't seem to be realistically represented. Any thoughts (from anyone) on how to get past this?
You don't like GTA and you expect it to be like TW3? LOL You're in for a big surprise then because this is GTA minus many GTA features. The story is totally on rails like in GTA, nothing you say matters in any dialogue, it's just fluff, could have been substituted by non-interactive cut scenes. Chase scenes are fake: you can relax, close your eyes, no point to shoot at enemies because it doesn't matter... you win. No choices and consequences system, you can choose only the first 20 min beginning that doesn't matter and the ending you like. And your favorite bullet sponges are everywhere. Have fun.
Solasta is a purist game? Its a mechanically detailed MODERN game that pushes the boundary on pen and paper gameplay!
Did I say that it is a purist game? Did you actually read the line you quoted? Having comprehension issues? I don't care about Solasta at all whether it is close or far from D&D 5e. BG3 is not Solasta and will never be. You like some features from Solasta? Suggest them to Larian via feedback.
Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
Are your shitting me?
Why should I? You're already full of it.
Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
Id say BG3 is the total opposite, staying to its DOS2 roots and not BUDGING much. Literately copy and pasting many elements. Id say its even DOWNGRADING or REMOVING the gameplay and all aspect previous RPGs have been doing (day/night cycles, Time and urgency, random encounters, party controls and UI, itemization, spell choices, class choices, NPC companion count etc.....) Not exactly progress. I mean if you DONT LIKE cRPGs I guess you could call it progress???
First of all DOS2 is a very good game, there's nothing wrong to borrow some features from it that worked. That being said, BG3 is quite different from DOS2, it's quite moronic to say they are the same. And it's good to use features that worked well in the past and discard ones that didn't, it's called progress. So, let's go over the list you pointed as "downgrades": - Day/night cycles. BG2 didn't have meaningful day/night cycle and it was a good game. It would have been great to have it in BG3, I'm all for it, but you cannot argue that it is a downgrade. - Time and urgency. Very few games have it and usually it's a most HATED feature even if the time limit is very generous. Not sure where the downgrade is. - Random encounters. I personally never liked combat random encounters. Good random encounters were in original Fallouts, but they were based on Luck stat and good ones were when luck was high all about jokes and easter eggs, low luck encounters were combat encounters. BG2 didn't have good random encounters and random combat is bad. Where is a downgrade? - Party controls and UI. What was downgraded? BG2 UI was pretty bad. Can the current one be improved? Sure. Have you submitted your feedback with ingenious UI tips to Larian? - Class choices... Eh? Was something downgraded? They haven't added everything yet. It's EA. I don't think it's fair to criticize them yet, considering their game will be in development at least a year. - NPC companion count. How can you call the companion count downgrade? The game can be optimized to a certain amount of companions. More companions means harder to optimize. It's their choice regarding amount. More companions doesn't mean better.
Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
DOS2 gameplay is faster, more dynamic and fun in a crazy sort of way; which fits the game. People are blinded by the pretty faces, graphics and cinematics. Remove/downgrade all those in BG3 and you have a game that still needs tons of work in the gameplay, UI and atmosphere department.
Who's blinded? You? I suggest you replay Solasta then since it has so much replayability options in comparison to BG3. You definitely won't be blinded by ugly 3D models and horrific voice over.
What do you think about the musical part of the Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous? OST is great The voice actors are pretty nice too.
What about Owlcat sense of humor? Not only on the Trickster's way, the scientist Kitsune is very funny. Her personal quest is the most brutal thing in the game, and worthy of separate discussion and hatred, but it was intended that way.
When you try to leave that location without solving the riddle, Kitsune becomes sad. The player says "we'll come back here sometime", and she breaks the fourth wall saying that you need to be realistic and no one will come back here.
How do you like that cute quest when you need to collect dreams for Arushalai?
How do you like the evil but lawful knight gnome? Comic or serious? In passing as a demon, he tried to kill me along with his knights.
How much can Camellia surprise you? This is a natural maniac, but you can become her real friend or beloved, and the game does not condemn us for questions of morality - it only gives an opportunity, and this opportunity is well developed. Although, the ability to persuade her to a lesser evil like Viconia in BG would be nice so that she does not go away in the epilogue, but perhaps there is such an opportunity, I'm not sure, I need to go through the game again.
And the charismatic Deiran and his secret?
pathfinder wrath of righteous musical scores were truly epic!.. it's 10/10 for me. there's one gripe i have though there's only 1 funny musical score which kind of overused a little like the kitsune conversation, the circus troupe? and some scripted events.
the main theme spot right on being just righteous and heroic.
oof, that's rough. If you don't like the setting, you're going to automatically start off on the wrong food. I LOVE anything Science Fiction and Fantasy, but Science Fiction is probably my favorite genre period, so it's easy for me to get into it. Putting the difficulty to maximum would definitely make the stakes seem higher could work maybe? I used to have to use mods for Skyrim to make combat deadly for everyone, me and npcs. one or two hits was all it took if you weren't paying attention. That would make the game more tactical, but I'm not sure if that's what would help you enjoy it though.
Yeah I don't think raising the difficulty level would be the answer. Essentially, the problem is that I know physics and engineering well enough (too well actually) that having people take kinetic or directed energy weapon hits to the body and still be walking around, regardless of any armor they have on, is extremely emmersion-breaking. In a fantasy setting, however, where ytou still have the issue of how does a person take a greatsword hit across their face and still live, is easily handled with one simple word: magic. Magic explains anything and everything. There is no equivalent to magic in other settings (that I'm aware of), and that's my problem.
if you weren't on the hype train thinking it was going to be gta and skyrim combined, it's not a bad game at all. It feels very much like a Deus Ex style of game to me.
Actually, games like GTA don't appeal to me at all, and I did not care for Skyrim. But I loved TW3, and the only reason I didn't buy CP2077 right away is that I tend to like only RPGs in fantasy settings and generally have a hard time with immersion in other settings, especially ones involving guns/directed energy weapons because the consequences of getting hit by those kinds of weapons don't seem to be realistically represented. Any thoughts (from anyone) on how to get past this?
You don't like GTA and you expect it to be like TW3? LOL You're in for a big surprise then because this is GTA minus many GTA features. The story is totally on rails like in GTA, nothing you say matters in any dialogue, it's just fluff, could have been substituted by non-interactive cut scenes. Chase scenes are fake: you can relax, close your eyes, no point to shoot at enemies because it doesn't matter... you win. No choices and consequences system, you can choose only the first 20 min beginning that doesn't matter and the ending you like. And your favorite bullet sponges are everywhere. Have fun.
Yes I already said the fundamentally different type of setting for CP2077 is exactly why I have been hesitant thus far to get the game. I've watched a lot of Youtube gameplay of CP2077 and yes, I do not like the driving mini-game (which makes zero sense to me) or the gunplay aspects of it. But I don't at all agree with your characterizations about the game's story, dialogue, choices, etc. Heck many of the combat encounters in that game can actually successfully be circumvented through noncombat means, with results and rewards comparable to what you'd get from combat. So in all those ways it's a fantastic game. I just need to figure out whether I can live with the parts that I don't like in order to enjoy the parts that I like, which is exactly what I will have to face with BG3 too.
I play the game for the second time as a Trickster, and it's really fun. This myth is not designed for the first playthrough, as it seems to me - there is too much trash and the epic of the game decreases. Azata's path for a good passage is also look interesting. The Angel is boring, the Dragon is also boring.
Aeon is too tragic as far as I read, and also Lich, it's interesting from the point of view of unique gameplay, but not for me. They are fun to play, but there will be no moral satisfaction from their endings. (Although, maybe Aeon apostate is interesting, I haven't spoilered myself the devil's way yet). But I like that there are such opportunities! Walking swarm - must be tried purely for fun, just for it must be fast.
So my favorite myths are Demon, and then they go Trickster and Azata. What about you?
How do you like Areelu Vorlesh? She evokes sympathy at the end of the game, and it's even a little touching, doesn't she?
Last edited by OneManArmy; 13/12/2112:54 AM.
Minthara is the best character and she NEEDS to be recruitable if you side with the grove!
Not even close. Wrath is a completely immersive DND (or Pathfinder, to be specific) experience and DOS3 (oh yeah, BG3) is a flashy cartoon in comparison. I have about the same hours of playtime in both games. Larian never should have called this game Baldur's Gate. My daughter, a huge gamer, laughs at me when she sees I have BG3 booted up because she says I paid to beta test a game. She is right.
Not even close. Wrath is a completely immersive DND (or Pathfinder, to be specific) experience and DOS3 (oh yeah, BG3) is a flashy cartoon in comparison. I have about the same hours of playtime in both games. Larian never should have called this game Baldur's Gate. My daughter, a huge gamer, laughs at me when she sees I have BG3 booted up because she says I paid to beta test a game. She is right.
Yeah, thats exactly what u did. And Larian especially warned you, and people like you who expect a done product, not to buy into early access...
Not even close. Wrath is a completely immersive DND (or Pathfinder, to be specific) experience and DOS3 (oh yeah, BG3) is a flashy cartoon in comparison. I have about the same hours of playtime in both games. Larian never should have called this game Baldur's Gate. My daughter, a huge gamer, laughs at me when she sees I have BG3 booted up because she says I paid to beta test a game. She is right.
Yeah, thats exactly what u did. And Larian especially warned you, and people like you who expect a done product, not to buy into early access...
early access or not.. i believe larian shown a big chunk of game in first act. i would expect nothing major will change visually, aesthetically or art design direction. it probably more of less the same but expanded chapters, higher level cap and obviously more classes upon release. at it's core it will still be a d&d game but i don't get any feeling of it being baldur's gate at all. it's really like a DOS2 dnd5e. i'll probably still spend alot of time in bg3 due to it being d&d. however, larian screw up the whole thing. at least for me. i'm hopeful that there will be major changes.. but i know that's a fool's hope.
@OneManArmy on topic.. i'm now on 2nd playthrough trickster hard difficulty. for me personally, angel is most heroic and glorious for me. but i had hope some stuff in trickster would be appeared in angel but i can understand they have to give something unique for each path. i'm not sure how lich will end though.
[quote=spacehamster95][quote=Rabbitman] @OneManArmy on topic.. i'm now on 2nd playthrough trickster hard difficulty. for me personally, angel is most heroic and glorious for me. but i had hope some stuff in trickster would be appeared in angel but i can understand they have to give something unique for each path. i'm not sure how lich will end though.
Lich is for lovers of necromancy, we will play as a living skeleton after a mythical transformation, our companions will mostly be silent undead, romances are cut off - which is not so cool. But on the other hand, there are quite a few unique dead companions, and this is an interesting experience for those who like necromancy.
In the demonic journey, we have a unique and enjoyable experience of gaining prestige and position in society in the Midnight Islands, because we get there earlier at the invitation of Nocticula.
And how is the angel's way? The angel also has a lot of content, but I do not quite understand what is interesting there that could force the to choose this paladin path. Didn't go into details. What are your favorite scenes for an angel?
Azata is attracted by the opportunity to make enemies our friends, I think Amber is an ideal companion for passing Azata. It would be cool if the developers gave the opportunity to ascend Nocticula as a chaotically neutral Redeemer Queen in one of the good passing: https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Nocticula
In general, the game shows that Nocticula is not an easy character, and she does not look super evil. More selfish, insidious, hot, striving for power, but she has principles and positive qualities, which cannot be said about other demon lords. At the very least, she values her loyal followers unlike Baphomet, as shown in the demon's path. In the passage of the Aeon, Nocticula has an aura that shows that she is unnatural to the abyss. I also heard that Ember has a lot of content related to the preaching of the good to Nocticula, to which she reacts ambiguously. So I really like the ending of the demon, consort of Nocticula and the leader of her army, whom she rewarded and saved from the court of Pharasmus.
And what about the Absolute BG3? Absolute evil illithids illusion which betrays us at the earliest opportunity, not a charming Goddess with huge and ambiguous ambitions, which can reward us for loyalty and even give the feeling that we did everything right? Like Pathfinder.
Why should we worship her? If the Absolute were someone like Nocticula and the player could learn more about it, most players would have a serious choice, which would not depend on the presence of Minthara in the game.
Pathfinder showed that alignment can be ambiguous. Areelu Vorlesh is also not super evil at all with her chaotically evil alignment, she even evokes good player sympathy in the ending because her motivation is ambiguous, she just has her own answer to the Trolley problem.
and she is a loving mother and fights against the injustice of the gods
And also, for example, the law good characters in Chapter 1 (the paladin inquisitor) are going to kill the Azata priest just like that. Lawful-evil gnome is also ambiguous. It is easy to imagine him both on the side of good (crusaders), and on the side of demons with such an outlook, if he initially took an oath not to knights, but to a demon lord. But he fights for good, very principled, with evil methods. Arushalai, a succubus who wants to become kind, is also... something
The Swarm-That-Walk is an absolute evil that 1% of the players have chosen (although its presence in the game is certainly fun). I would not want the experience of playing for evil in BG3 to be like this - kill everything that moves, tifflings, slaves that could not free True Soul Nere, and everything like that.
Camellia deserves a separate discussion, but even she leaves if you choose the path of Swarm. And her rating in the game seems to me pretty good, despite the lack of statistics. At least she surprised / shocked many people, many players liked it and she became a crush, even more players hated her, but all definitely remember and OwlCat's decision to add her to the game was very successful.
I cannot imagine that something like this happened with Shadow Heart for example. She is all so "mystical", but we already understood that she was a priest of Selune before Shar. Or, what else can she surprise? Larian could hide the fact that SH is Shar's priest, just as the amulet hides Camellia's alignment in Pathfinder. The surprise where SH admits that she is Shar's priest looks very weak against the background of Camellia's surprise.
As for Deiran, he is very similar to Astarion. But here rather the OwlCat copied it from Larian, or at least were inspired by him
For all the gloom of the game, there is the Azatha path of friendship and magic, and also a local Jesus in my party, which made me do a replay for a good character. It's too cute and too good that even lovers of evil ways will want to beat the game as a Good Hero at least once. Khalsin and a bunch of tieflings don't really motivate me to want to play as a good hero in BG3.
However, I hope that Larian will make a masterpiece in the release version of the BG3, and will not hesitate to use some of the experience and feedback about Pathfinder.
Last edited by OneManArmy; 14/12/2108:05 AM.
Minthara is the best character and she NEEDS to be recruitable if you side with the grove!
And how is the angel's way? The angel also has a lot of content, but I do not quite understand what is interesting there that could force the to choose this paladin path. Didn't go into details. What are your favorite scenes for an angel?
You are not forced into a paladin's path. In fact, I'd say due to the wonky alignment wheel mechanics the easiest angel path is a neutral good oracle. It's also very easy combat-wise, because angel offensive spells are "ignore spell resistance, save and deal large amounts of holy damage". Similar to lich, really, except you get proper defensive buffs (and the high level buffs are ridiculous) vs. bugged (at least when I've played) undead immunities.
As for why it's so popular, well, my impression is the main plot was written with the angel path in mind. You learn more of the background at what was happening at Pulura's Fall, you learn what really happened to Lariel, and you get to kill the big bad demon once and for all. By comparison even though you can go early as a trickster to Pulura's Fall, you won't be able to learn anything interesting there.
Dunno ...but Im double clicking WAY more Wratch.exe than BG3.exe... I hate my main character in BG3, nothing special no urgency. Its all about your Telltale companions.
if you weren't on the hype train thinking it was going to be gta and skyrim combined, it's not a bad game at all. It feels very much like a Deus Ex style of game to me.
Actually, games like GTA don't appeal to me at all, and I did not care for Skyrim. But I loved TW3, and the only reason I didn't buy CP2077 right away is that I tend to like only RPGs in fantasy settings and generally have a hard time with immersion in other settings, especially ones involving guns/directed energy weapons because the consequences of getting hit by those kinds of weapons don't seem to be realistically represented. Any thoughts (from anyone) on how to get past this?
Interesting. So you find fantastical creatures and magic immersive, but hi-tech not. If anything, the hp bloat is generally *MUCH* worse in fantasy RPGs. Did you consider what dictates your preference maybe simply the setting and that you subconsciously attempt to rationalize your feelings?
Anyway, the solution is mods (Nexus is great). There are plenty of them that address game balance. Headshot Damage simply increases the headshot multiplier significantly. While Realistic Combat Overhaul largely eliminate the bullet-spronginess in a more holistic manner.
And how is the angel's way? The angel also has a lot of content, but I do not quite understand what is interesting there that could force the to choose this paladin path. Didn't go into details. What are your favorite scenes for an angel?
You are not forced into a paladin's path. In fact, I'd say due to the wonky alignment wheel mechanics the easiest angel path is a neutral good oracle. It's also very easy combat-wise, because angel offensive spells are "ignore spell resistance, save and deal large amounts of holy damage". Similar to lich, really, except you get proper defensive buffs (and the high level buffs are ridiculous) vs. bugged (at least when I've played) undead immunities.
As for why it's so popular, well, my impression is the main plot was written with the angel path in mind. You learn more of the background at what was happening at Pulura's Fall, you learn what really happened to Lariel, and you get to kill the big bad demon once and for all. By comparison even though you can go early as a trickster to Pulura's Fall, you won't be able to learn anything interesting there.
In a way yes, the angel path is what officially happens at the end of WotR
Weeeeell in the Pathfinder TTRPG the closing of the worldwound is canon, so are the defeat of Baphomet and Deskari and the redemption of Nocticula. More likely than not the group of heroes who closed the worldwound and ascended to demigod status (lvl20+10 mythic ranks) were on the good side of the allignment wheel
if you weren't on the hype train thinking it was going to be gta and skyrim combined, it's not a bad game at all. It feels very much like a Deus Ex style of game to me.
Actually, games like GTA don't appeal to me at all, and I did not care for Skyrim. But I loved TW3, and the only reason I didn't buy CP2077 right away is that I tend to like only RPGs in fantasy settings and generally have a hard time with immersion in other settings, especially ones involving guns/directed energy weapons because the consequences of getting hit by those kinds of weapons don't seem to be realistically represented. Any thoughts (from anyone) on how to get past this?
Interesting. So you find fantastical creatures and magic immersive, but hi-tech not. If anything, the hp bloat is generally *MUCH* worse in fantasy RPGs. Did you consider what dictates your preference maybe simply the setting and that you subconsciously attempt to rationalize your feelings?
Anyway, the solution is mods (Nexus is great). There are plenty of them that address game balance. Headshot Damage simply increases the headshot multiplier significantly. While Realistic Combat Overhaul largely eliminate the bullet-spronginess in a more holistic manner.
That's why I further explained in another post after this one. In a fantasy setting I can gain that immersiveness by acknowledging one simple thing: magic. Once you say *magic*, everything works out, because magic serves as a very nice catch-all explanation for things that science and engineering in the real-world would not be able to explain. But in a non-fantasy setting, there is no equivalent to magic. So then I do expact if someone gets hit in the face or chest with some .50 cal rounds they're ded ded ded.
As for the setting being the true variable here, that's not it for sure. I do agree that the setting matters a lot for liking a game. But the thing is, there are fantasy settings that I have not liked, the D:OS setting of Rivellon being a great example. Even in D&D, many of the settings that have been used over the years I do not personally care for. So there is no clear black and white line where I like ALL fantasy settings and dislike ALL non-fantasy settings.
At least with Wotr we dont have MEME calore shitty dialogue cinematics to deal with. Man was this the worst decision taken for the game. These age so badly...its already a big hit on youtube.
Baldurs Gate 3 has an advantage over Pathfinder - Drow. There were no playable drow in the Pathfinder, just a couple of minor NPCs.
Pathfinder had a lot of interesting demons and succubus for every taste and color. Larian, do the same with Drow in BG3 and you will win. You can even add Eilistraee's drow for good playthroughs. Maybe even show the whole drow city, their society
Minthara is the best character and she NEEDS to be recruitable if you side with the grove!
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