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I just wanted to point out the character creation is very confusing in it's current form. I somewhat understand now why I need to create 2 characters, but not when I started a new playthrough yesterday.

You start the process, complete each step (top menu) and when satisfied, press 'Venture Forth'. This is where the confusion starts. I created a rogue with ginger hair, but the screen suddenly showed a dark haired wizard. My first thought (and probably of many people doing this the first time) was "oh no there is a bug". It looks like either your character wasn't created at all, or the character was somehow randomized. Both are quite a shock if you just spent 30 minutes carefully setting up your character.

Like I said I partially understand why I need to create another character, but can you please add (a lot) more guidance? More explaining, texts, popups, etc.

It will really help new players to feel less confused or frustrated when you know what's going on. It doesn't have to explain why but it should tell you what you're doing.

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do you mean the "tell me, who do you dream of at night?" part?

i didn't know why it asked me to create a dream partner at first, but it did not cause the same confusion as you stated (to me at least).

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Agreed ...
First time i started the game, i was on Discord talking with friends (yup i have few laugh ) and praising how AWESOME this game is looking ... and i completely missed the sentence. laugh

Also i believe few Youtubers had simmilar problem, they expected some cinematic so they started to talk with audience and sudently they were like "damn ... what is this" when they looked back. laugh

Some text, popup, or sign would be appreciated. smile


Short coment on my English. smile

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Originally Posted by Injustice
do you mean the "tell me, who do you dream of at night?" part?
Yeah, no confusion here.


Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
First time i started the game, i was on Discord talking with friends (yup i have few laugh ) and praising how AWESOME this game is looking ... and i completely missed the sentence. laugh
Is that why games tend to be so intrusive with their tutorials nowadays? People don't pay attention to it, and then are confused when it doesn't play as they expect? No wonder games tend to play the same.

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Its possible, but im not sure if one sentence said kinda quietly can be compared to compelte ignoration of all tutorial tips. laugh


Short coment on my English. smile

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Didn't have a problem but I had the sound on...

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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Its possible, but im not sure if one sentence said kinda quietly can be compared to compelte ignoration of all tutorial tips. laugh
True. I mean I suppose, if big enough chunk of the audience is missing what you are trying to communicate, then you are doing something wrong.

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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Agreed ...
First time i started the game, i was on Discord talking with friends (yup i have few laugh ) and praising how AWESOME this game is looking ... and i completely missed the sentence. laugh

...

Some text, popup, or sign would be appreciated. smile

You mean the text that is there on the screen, that reads "Who attracts you?" when it moves to the second character?

I don't agree with the design, nor the concept, nor the message it sends - and enforces on your character - but it definitely tells you both visually and aurally what it is you are doing on that second screen.

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Really? O_o
In that case i ask for it to be replaced by neon sign with 4huge arrows pointing there with writing "pleace notice this" laugh


Short coment on my English. smile

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Well, here's a screenshot of the default second screen.... how do you feel it should be made clearer?

[Linked Image from imgur.com]


Edit: Fixed! I'd forgotten to grab the independant image, rather than the image address... silly me.

Last edited by Niara; 17/09/21 03:19 AM.
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I say, pay attention next time. I was not confused at all during my first play through.

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It's especially confusing if you never use the tadpole and never have a dream after 25 hours...

Last edited by Maximuuus; 16/09/21 06:55 AM.
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Originally Posted by Niara
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
I fixed that for you. smile

Originally Posted by Niara
How do you feel it should be made clearer?
Personaly i would prefer to move it to top middle part of the screen (abowe her head), made it bigger and with its own golden frame. smile

Right now, its just part of the "race window" i ignore ... since all i need to read are names of races. laugh
If it would be separate, it would be more ... on sight i would say.

Last edited by RagnarokCzD; 16/09/21 11:55 AM.

Short coment on my English. smile

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So, you'd like to put it in a text box on a different part of the screen which the player never needs to look at and does not physically interact with at all...
As opposed to in text at the top of the box on the screen that players *Must* look at because it is the section that they physically interact with to design the character, and is at the top of the box (which is the entire character design box, not just the 'race' box - race is just the first sub-heading, and is identical to all the other sub headings that follow)... Literally, is the heading of the box, expressly to tell them what it is they are designing, before they make any selections in the box at all?

It's there, and it's text, and you see it, and you wilfully, consciously, choose to ignore it: it doesn't matter where they put it in this case - the game cannot help you. If it was in the centre, you'd ignore it there too, since by your own reasoning and description, there's nothing there you need to interact with and you don't need to look at it or read it. This is absolutely a between-chair-and-keyboard system fault that the game cannot realistically do anything about.


(Also, what was the tag formatting that it accepted, beecause I tried a handful of things and none of them showed up correctly for me... I haven't had this problem in other threads with many images in the past...)

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Perhaps Larian should put a Mr. Clippy at the bottom of the screen with the prompt “please explain what Is happening!”.

And when you click it, there should be neon colored text boxes, emojis, balloons, and voiced narration to explain every detail of what you are seeing on your screen at any given moment, what u should do next, what your motivation is, what the story is about, where you are, who the npcs are, what the tadpole is, what the book you just read meant, what time it is, and where the good armor is located, etc.

Also a timeline of events should pop up at the top of the screen so you can keep it all in order, and bright pulsating arrows should point you to where you should go next given your current level. Oh, and there should be a golden framed box telling you who the Absolute is in the right hand corner. Oh, and in the left corner, a link to Halsin’s instagram account with photos of him pumping iron in the grove.

Then no one will be confused.

(We really need Patch 6 soon…I fear everyone is going mad)

Last edited by timebean; 17/09/21 03:10 AM.
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Originally Posted by timebean
Oh, and in the left corner, a link to Halsin’s instagram account with photos of him pumping iron in the grove.

Then no one will be confused.

But maybe more distracted.

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Originally Posted by Niara
So, you'd like to put it in a text box on a different part of the screen which the player never needs to look at and does not physically interact with at all...
As opposed to in text at the top of the box on the screen that players *Must* look at because it is the section that they physically interact with to design the character, and is at the top of the box (which is the entire character design box, not just the 'race' box - race is just the first sub-heading, and is identical to all the other sub headings that follow)... Literally, is the heading of the box, expressly to tell them what it is they are designing, before they make any selections in the box at all?

[quote=Niara]It's there, and it's text, and you see it, and you wilfully, consciously, choose to ignore it: it doesn't matter where they put it in this case - the game cannot help you. If it was in the centre, you'd ignore it there too, since by your own reasoning and description, there's nothing there you need to interact with and you don't need to look at it or read it. This is absolutely a between-chair-and-keyboard system fault that the game cannot realistically do anything about.
I disagree ...
From my perspective, its just the same window that i have seen just few minutes back, when i was choosing race for my own character ... nothing new here ... that is reason why i dont look there, all i need to interact with are those small buttons with race names, title abowe is not interesting for me. smile

On the other hand, IF something sudently apprear in top middle part of the screen, where until now was nothing ...
That would certainly drag my attention. smile

But that is just my point of view.

How about this change ...
Switch writing on "vent forward" button to "Next step: dream person customisation" ... or something simmilar?


Short coment on my English. smile

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Originally Posted by timebean
Perhaps Larian should put a Mr. Clippy at the bottom of the screen with the prompt “please explain what Is happening!”.

And when you click it, there should be neon colored text boxes, emojis, balloons, and voiced narration to explain every detail of what you are seeing on your screen at any given moment, what u should do next, what your motivation is, what the story is about, where you are, who the npcs are, what the tadpole is, what the book you just read meant, what time it is, and where the good armor is located, etc.

Also a timeline of events should pop up at the top of the screen so you can keep it all in order, and bright pulsating arrows should point you to where you should go next given your current level. Oh, and there should be a golden framed box telling you who the Absolute is in the right hand corner. Oh, and in the left corner, a link to Halsin’s instagram account with photos of him pumping iron in the grove.

Then no one will be confused.

(We really need Patch 6 soon…I fear everyone is going mad)

AHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA!

Oh god, I think I fell of my chair. :'D

Anyways, if I play CRPGs I always do with with 100% concentration on the game, so I never experienced the issue - but I guess they could just move the text to the center of the screen for those who are multi-tasking. :]


Hoot hoot, stranger! Fairly new to CRPGs, but I tried my best to provide some feedback regardless! <3 Read it here: My Open Letter to Larian
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I chuckled there too heheh

But that doesn't mean the OP is wrong to feel like the Daisy creator is sort of an oddball thing to have tacked on. It's novel and a bit non sequitur, or at least not something the player would probably expect to have to do in normal D&D char creation. There's also no follow up there for several hours of gameplay, and what does follow is instead the big opening scene with the Nautiloid being chased by Gith Dragon riders.

Now imagine instead, that after the "Who do you dream of? What attracts you" part, there was a little preamble cut scene where your dream lover actually says or does something, to set the mood or tone of the opener. Doesn't have to be major, just something. That would work more forcefully and effectively than a text box or a VO snippet.

Also something to let the player know explicitly that they're talking about attraction "in others" as opposed to like some aspirational self or mirror thing. Or perhaps if other sections of the Char creation process had a similar treatment, with a new window or prompt similar to the daisy one, it might fit more naturally. Even without hitting alignment on the nose they could do one where the player tells the game their characters beliefs, and maybe that's the section where they choose their Deity? Or to borrow a simple thing from Westerns like picking a Black Hat or White Hat, to the tell the game you're interested in playing a Hero or a Villain?

Right now "who do you dream of? what attracts you" is pretty vague. Maybe the player thinks they are creating a second party member or a sidekick, or an ideal companion, or they think its a proxy for character sexual orientation etc. When what the game seems to be asking us to do is create a physical avatar for our inner Jungian Anima/Animus.

Which is a cool idea actually, but the player doesn't necessarily know what they're doing, and won't really find out until way way later. I can see where the gripe is coming from.

ps. I'm also eager for a patch 6, but the pace of development for this game has been so glacially slow thus far, that I'm not particularly excited about "the next patch" anymore. My enthusiasm gap just seems to be getting wider and wider, and the pandemic patience is also wearing a bit thin, whereas at the start I wrote off many things on account of that. I don't feel like this game is a worthy successor to BG right now at all, and they have a ton of ground to make up before they start getting close. I hope they get there. I honestly think they jumped the gun and pushed out their EA like a year before they should have. This game still feels like an E3 demo to me or something. Heartbreaker

Last edited by Black_Elk; 19/09/21 01:08 AM.
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Might be better to have this character creation screen appear before your first dream. Would make more sense to design the character you dream of immediately following your character laying down to sleep.

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