Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General New players and the problem with Shar

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First, the spellplague happened over a hundred years ago. That's a lot of years for folks to get things twisted about in stories, especially when those folks live in a world where something crazy is happening all the time, like the recent decent of Elturel into literal hell.

Second, I'm not even convinced people know what's being argued here. The point under current discussion isn't whether or not someone knows who Shar is or that she's a goddess. The point being discussed is whether or not they would recognize her armor immediately. Or associate her circlet jewelry for worship most foul.

Third, if we want to discuss what people know about Shar, then fine.
A. if everyone thought the same about Shar, then there wouldn't be people like Shadowheart. People who worship Shar and see her as a positive in the world.
B. yes, knowledge rolls are typically required for knowledge.
C. that said, there's nothing wrong with a reveal that's paced by storytelling, where the character learns to trust Shadowheart before learning more and more about Shar through the unfolding of the story. I dare say that information about Shar is getting revealed as the story progresses, most certainly after having played through Grymforge.

Basically, I go back to a post I made in this thread several several pages back. Imagine that the game treats Shar the way so many of you seem to want. You go to Shadowheart's pod. You open the pod. You make a religion roll after seeing Shadowheart's armor. You learn that she worships Shar based on her armor and circlet. You learn right then that Shar is the worst. Literally. The worst. Shar wants to destroy the entire universe, and has tried to do so, resulting in, as someone else put it, millions of deaths. Not even the mind flayers want to destroy everything. What do you do then? Join up with Shadowheart? Or remove her as a threat? Great game so far, right? Like I said, I don't mean this in a rude way, but I'm really glad Larian isn't taking this advice because it's not good and it doesn't go anywhere good.

Much more nuanced. Much more understanding. I would absolutely play in a game like this.

Go bump the Elves aren't Elven thread again, hypocrite! (joke)

23 more pages let's go!

You can also take her with you, resolving to keep an eye on her. You are trying to escape from near-certain death after all which makes for strange bedfellows. You also have a Gith ally who's entire species basically thinks of all other races as lesser; a cultist on her own isn't that bad in comparison even if she worships Shar.

You can also ask SH directly: "listen, before we go any further, I recognized the symbols on your armor as those of Shar....care to explain?" which could make for an interesting dynamic between Tav and Shar earlier in the game where she trusts you earlier. Or perhaps she'd leave in a huff, but then try join the party later (as she already does if you don't recruit her) once she realizes she needs help. But this time would be a bit less standoffish and more willing to answer questions.

There are plenty more options than "join up with her" or "remove her as a threat," some of which could be very interesting.

Edit: I suppose also Larian could also make her armor dirty/covered-in-pod-goo after coming out of the pod, so you can't really get a good look at her armor until after you land on the beach. At which point you possibly already had a good (or at least not terrible) interaction with her.

Looking at the 'thumbnail' of her armor and the Justiciar armor I noticed the areas with the symbols are blank. I'm wondering if that's what it'll be like when it's final.

It's more like that is how it used to be, before they made them black. In previous patches they (the shoulder gems st least) were metallic.

Really? That completely escaped my notice.
I've noticed at this point, I've played the first part of the game so many times, I have trouble distinguishing what was when an how about a lot of things.

A little off topic, but you know what I miss? The Bracing Ring. It used to be in the chest by the harpies in Patch 5, but it's not there anymore.

Exactly. This is a nuanced way to set up a game. What @JandK is talking about is not nuance or sophistication at all. What the game does right now is railroading, forcing us into reacting to/behaving towards SH a certain way all to preserve a special place in the game for Larian's precious SH character.

Whatever.

Guys, we're just looking for some basic setup.

I agree that the nautiloid is not the best place for a Religion check. In the heat of the moment, it makes sense that your character may not be focusing on the armor or whatever.

But we're talking that at NO time does ANYONE notice the armor or question it or anything and NO ONE gives you ANY background on Shar at any point. You have to read books and tomes to get basic information on one of the most important goddesses in the world and game.

In BG 1 and 2, nobody cared about this. Why? Because Shar was not important to the story in those games. In BG3, she is one of the MOST important since here is SH, a major character who is her cleric dressed in armor of a Dark Justiciar.

A roll should be made when you first meet her on the beach, and there should be more explanation, at least basic explanation, on who Shar is. And if they're going for an "Oh my gosh, you're a Sharran cleric of evil?" Moment, they need to put different armor on her and hide her background a bit more. Bottom line, either they need to hide her background and have the Aha moment, or they need to have a Religion check and people make some sort of big deal out of her armor.

Just do it in the chapel, its impossible to miss and already has something about Shar. Just make it more cinematic and in your face.
And have Shadowheart lie to us there to justify some of the later dialogue lines.

I've noticed my last playthrough that a few of the Shar prompts have been removed. Making it a little easier to avoid finding out Shadowheart is a Sharran, my dim witted barbarian only would have easily found out if pressing her about the artifact after the Absolute scene.

Other than that I don't think anything else has been changed regarding talking about Shar that I've seen yet.

Haven't read most of the thread. But welcome to the rabbit hole of DnD lore! One life is not enough to understand it all, but that's also the draw imo.