Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback Romance is Dead

You missunderstand me ...
As far as i know (didnt check in Patch 6 yet, so maybe this is just outdated) ... you have to probe, either for her desire, or for her fear ... but i would like to respect her privacy and dont invade her mind at all.

Huh, I'll check again, but I was sure there was an option that was basically just 'enjoy the afterglow and rest'

Let me know what you find.

So far i was only watched video from Kazuliski ... and that is whole blurred, so i dont see options there.
But s/he showed only two options so that is why i was sure there is no third. O_o

Dman, they are really doing it. Somekind of Vampire stuff, how they talk and stand etc. It sounds so damn pervertic.

Lots of good points in this thread, but this is probably the most important one IMO. It makes no sense that EVERYONE would be ready to get physical on the exact same night. It also makes no sense that this is tied to a game event. Maybe I decide to go for Lazel's Cresh. Or maybe I fumble into the under-dark while looking for Halsin, explore a bit, find out about moonrise from Omeluum and head strait there without saving Halsin or getting involved with the druids at all. Right now if one chooses to be indifferent or skips the whole grove slaughter/aid thing for any reason, what does that mean relationship wise? Have we just sabotaged all companion relationships because we missed that first opportunity?

When it comes to relationship milestones, I think every NPC should have their own unique pacing (likely tied to individual attitude) and that pacing shouldn't be bound to game events in any way. I am hoping the current connection between game events and relationship development is is just an EA thing. Hopefully they just threw the naughty-night-celebration together quickly to test out scenes and it isn't indicative of the final products pacing.

Did I get this right. They did orgies. +1 to Larian, and +1.

Are you really criticising your own idea right now? O_o

I am left with the impression Minthara does get some hints from the Absolute or its three disciples but they are open to interpretation. Or indeed she got some orders from the Absolute but you do persuade her that you are an exceptional person and a waste to be killed.

To be honest, I am surprised a lot of the discussion is focused around Minthara. She is not badly written, I think. She is not portrayed as very sane and is heavily tainted by the (backstabbing) drow culture. It is clear what she loves about Tav: his power and ability to impose it on the others. It is not a healthy relationship.

This is a matter of sloppy execution first and foremost. Technically, not every companion is supposed to be propositioning the player at the same time, only those with high enough approval. The problem is, the required approval threshold is very low right now (Medium, only a step above Neutral, which everyone starts at) and it's very easy to get everyone to that level. Simply giving Gale two artifacts will put him way above the requirement, and the same is true for Wyll if you do his quest and Lae'zel if you let her take charge during hers. For Astarion it's enough to give him your blood, let him feed on enemies, and kill the hunter with him. Shadowheart is probably the trickiest, as she doesn't have any big moments right now, but she approves of being nice to animals, which most people will do naturally, and lying, which the players will also be doing out of necessity while exploring the goblin camp. This results in a shower of proposals at the party, and yes, it's quite jarring, even if the occasion is suitable.

Compounding the problem is the fact that there's nothing to do at the party other than pick who you (don't) want to sleep with. Every companion has a short exchange where you can either accept or reject their advances, and they just send you away after that. You can't celebrate with them or get to know them better, it's all about hooking up. The companions don't even have alternate dialogue trees if you don't have enough approval with them, they start the conversation as if they want to get with you, but backpedal at the last moment, and still act jealous if you pick someone else and talk to them afterwards. It's fine for Gale to say he's thankful for being able to spend time "with just the two of us" if he's trying to get you to bed, but why is he using such suggestive language if he's not interested? It's amusing to listen to Astarion try to insult whoever you picked, but he really shouldn't be acting so spurned if he didn't want to get into your pants in the first place. And so on for every other companion; I think only Shadowheart and Wyll act like adults if you don't pick them. This way of structuring dialogue makes it seem like everyone wants a piece of you even if they actually don't.

My hope is that this is an EA-only thing. Larian want to show off different aspects of the game, romances included, and made them so easily accessible for that reason. Hopefully, in the full game it will be harder to gain enough approval and there'll be options to celebrate the victory in other ways.

As for skipping the party, I don't think it's a problem. During it you can say "Maybe another time" to companions you didn't pick, so this obviosuly won't be the only opportunity to enter into a romance with someone. Not to mention, you're not actually starting a relationship with anyone at the party, except for maybe Gale and Shadowheart (and even with those two it's not certain), you're just spending the night together. There's not much weight to it.

It's all personal opinion and experience of course. Based on patch 6.


Yes and no. I did the goblin fight and the defense of the grove fairly early in the game (talking of Minthara, deceiving her felt good!). Medium threshold is the best I could hope so early in game.

My drow has been rejected by Lae'zel and Astarion (and he had Medium approval with the latter and donated a bit of his blood; he had no illithid dreams or encountered the hunter at that point, though). Surprisingly, he did get an offer from Gale and Wyll (despite both being Neutral). However, my drow had quite the chemistry with Shadowheart from their first dialogues. And yes, you can fairly easy mess it up as the outcome from your "date" with SH depends on an insight check. It is at times confusing but I admit I did not find anything too unrealistic about it. Especially taking into account the amount of alcohol being spilled.

I do agree that that party should not be the only place where you can start a romance.


Nothing from this surprises me. Gale has quite the ego, Astarion is... well, Astarion and Lae'zel is also very prideful.

Yes, of course, we're all just sharing opinions here.

It's very true that if you deal with the goblins soon after getting the quest you probably won't get a lot of the companions past the required threshold. I do think an average RPG player will try to finish all the sidequests before proceeding with (what looks like) the main quest, so they'll have more opportunities to raise approval.

Astarion can be a little unintuitive. On Medium, he'll only agree to spend the night if he's the one making the offer. It's interesting that you got an offer from Gale, though. To my understanding, you can get him only if you resolve one of his camp scenes – the one where you cast a spell together – in a romantic way. Was the offer actionable?

Shadowheart's romance progression is probably the best in the game right now. You can flirt with her a little, it's not too overbearing, and the lowkey, relaxed romance scene feels like a natural progression of that. The player also has a lot of agency in how it can play out, and that's always good. Coming out to her, drinking the wine, and immediately leaving is pretty fun.


My point might have run away from me, but the problem isn't that companions' responses are out of character, it's that their responses barely if at all change regardless of their level of approval.

Take Lae'zel for example. As you say, she's very prideful. In fact, she's so full of herself she views sex as a privilege she grants to you. It's perfectly in character for her to rub it in your face that you won't be sleeping with her tonight, whether she's interested or not. Except if you pick someone else, she'll say what a "pity" it is that she "can't lay claim" to her "proper trophy" even if your approval is low. She's disappointed she can't lay claim to you, yet rejects you if you ask. This, to me, indicates that this whole branch is meant to be romance-related, so what is it doing in a conversation with a version of Lae'zel who isn't interested?

You can see similar hiccups in all companions, and it makes it seem not like they're responding according to their character, but like Larian defaulted everyone to romantic lines to circumvent having to write dialogue variations, except for places where it can't be avoided. This romantic-by-default dialogue in turn makes it seem like everyone wants to jump your bones even if they don't. In my eyes, that's a problem, and I hope this is an EA-only thing.

So, if their attitude towards Tav is unaffected by events, how does one go about improving, or lowering, one's standing with them, purely in conversation? They aren't allowed to like, or dislike any actions you take? Some, or a lot, of these actions are tied to events after all.

Well, certain cRPGs might have taught me to do the main quest first. I guess it depends on the player.


I was actually quite split between Astarion and Shadowheart and was simply probing the ground with "What's your idea for fun?" . He went totally with "sex but not with you, it will be ridiculous". Maybe because my character (a drow) did not take most kindly the attempt to be kept as a hostage and being stalked at night (Astarion got headbutted and hit with a fist respectively). He still gave him a little bit of his blood and allowed him to feed on enemies... It's complicated, I guess. Overall, there was an agreement between the two (with occasional compliments and very light insults that did not seem to lead to disapproval). I even got to High Approval with him by the time we reached the Grymforge.

Gale: nothing of the sort. He has just asked me for an artifact. I had none at the moment (some time after the feast I fed him the Thay book and the Staff of Crones, which very fast rocketed his approval to High). I have no idea what cutscene that would have triggered but he was quite invested in his offer. I got some disapproval for rejecting him. Btw, it was certainly not the story about the book and the orb. I got this a bit later. Wyll was cool with rejection, though.


I think she will most probably be the romance choice once the game is fully released (I am planning of playing this character once the game is fully released). I was surprised how well the conversations were flowing between her and the drow. I guess the fact he respected her secrets played a major role in it. If only he had passed his insight check. (I avoid reloading).

The party member propositions have been different since I played a couple times. The first time was close to initial release and Astarion says "oh no not with you, I have standards!" or something similar lol. But I reloaded and when it's his idea, he goes for it. That play, I made EVERYONE mad all the time and Gale was Medium? But yet everyone propositioned BUT GALE.

2nd time was after patch 6, and I had made the flirty talk with Astarion and had the extra scenes before the party. Felt like it was a natural romance progression...but I was attempting for Gale and he was not picking up what I was laying down lol. When it came to party time, only Astarion was interested and iirc one of the people suggested he was wanting to buddy up. Made sure to talk with him last to be sure. Again, this felt like I had already made a choice and that it wasn't anyone and everyone wanting to get some action with Tav.

Gale has never proposed anything at camp because I think I haven't had him go through the death scenario. My druid was too good at keeping him alive. That, or something else overrode the scene needed and I have no clue what. I intentionally slept a few times at the campsite with everyone (not the dungeon camps that have a few peeps missing) before turning in the druid. Nothing. Gave up and went for the vamp who expressed interest...

Gale has, by far, the most dependant flags in order to get him to propose intimacy; for all of the others, you'll get their offer as long as their affinity is high enough, without any particular scene being dependant whereas, with Gale, every single one of his side scenes, up to the weave scene, are necessary to progress and some of them are missable because they only fire at certain affinity levels, and it's incredibly easy to shoot past two affinity levels in a single rest cycle or singular chain of events and choices, which can lock you out of romance regardless of having exceptional, capped-out affinity with him.

In order to ensure you get all of Gale's flags, you can follow these steps:

1) Go pick Gale up right away once you're off the ship (not strictly necessary, but don't, for example, go to the ruins, or the grove gate, before collecting him)
2) Take along rest just before you pick him up, to clear other companions events, then take along rest immediately after collecting him.
3) Keep Gale in your party at all times, so that he's with you for every choice you make - as much as Larian perpetuates the "everyone knows everything you did or said regardless of where they are" mess that they've carried over from their previous game (and just put a silly lampshade on with the tadpole even though it's clearly not a two-way street), some events seem to still need the character with you actively for them to register their acknowledgement of your actions there.
4) Take a long rest every single time you make any kind of decision that *anyone* approves or disapproves of, even if it wasn't Gale.
5) Take a long rest any time you make a decision about a situation or how to approach it, even if *none* of your companions approve or disapprove.
6) Take a long rest every time you enter a new area as well.
7) Yes, even though this means you'll take a half dozen long rests while in the druid grove, between most conversations.
8) Yes, this means you'll be taking a lot long rests even while his actual visible affinity doesn't change - you'll take *many* rests to trigger events while on neutral and on medium.
9) If you get the Weave scene at any point (and you might have to save scum in order to succeed the four or five checks that you need to make to progress it... otherwise, again, you're locked out), and imply intimate interest to Gale there, then you're set. Otherwise, continue to do as many of your pre-underdark objectives, areas and events as possible before hitting the goblin camp, until you've triggered it.

This may seem a bit overkill, and it probably is, but being this pedantic about it is the most reliable way to ensure that you get it.

Good lords... I'll try that next time I am doing a playthrough (but that seems like the level of an easter egg almost)

Current camp scene progression is a nightmare, and Gale suffers the most from it. His scenes seem to have the lowest priority in the queue, and if that wasn't bad enough, not only can you skip two important ones by having too high approval (and he approves of damn near everything if you're even marginally good-aligned), but you can lock yourself out of them without even realizing it. For some reason, Raphael's visit prevents the Weave and failed spell scenes from triggering altogether. So you have to avoid getting help from Nettie, Ethel, and Priestess Gut until you trigger them, which is a tough call when most players will be naturally drawn to Nettie after arriving to the grove.

It's not just romance that suffers from it too, it's characterization in general. One of the common criticisms of Gale is that his backstory is too colorful for a level 1 wizard. The failed spell scene addresses this concern, but a lot of people aren't going to see it because the way of triggering it is so opaque.

You really need a strategy guide just for resting with this game. We can only hope it's not some attempt to add variance for multiple playthroughs or anything equally ridiculous.

I find the whole idea of characters overriding each other to be quite stupid. We are a group of 4 and I would not mind if I have reactions by at least two companions on certain events. Same for camp events.

Someone talk about a "good romance with a drow".

Well, just go romance Viconia in BG2, it was ONE VERY GOOD ROMANCE.
It was long, complicated, developped, with conflicts in the emotions, needed to be carefull, sometime nice, sometime rude.
It was, indeed, a true romance (which mean a story based on FEELINGS, not sex).

There is no romance in BG3.
Gale try to bang me even if I didn't even give him a look.
This party was soooooo stupid.
People thinking a bloodthristy female drow can "totally fall in love" in one night just don't understand what drow's culture is.
And people who think BG3 romance are good romance spent too much time on pron sites...

In the real world, Minthara's whiplash change of perspective towards the player would be a huge red flag, coming off as a potentially psychotic attachment issue.

In a fantasy world, it's a little too wish fulfillment-esque. All of them, except perhaps Shadowheart, are. The stakes of a romantic sub-plot should rise with, and hinge upon, the climax of the main plot. I'm hoping Larian made these romance chains abbreviated for the EA and that they will stretch across the length of the game, once complete.