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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
just spits on abilities such as Goodberry, Cure Light Wounds, Lay on Hands, Healing Word, Potions of Healing, Action Surge, and more.

Exactly - the healing via food ability seems to have been heavily overpowered according to what I just learnt in this thread.

Ragnarok: You could carry a lot more back then, so the pig head being heavier is not really an argument. I don't remember ever reaching maximum capacity before patch 5.


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Originally Posted by Innateagle
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by Innateagle
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Don't be condescending. If you dislike something, that is your opinion but DO NOT come into threads talking down to people because you disagree.

This is getting embarassing.

I direct you to my last post.

rolleyes

You literally just stated, on two different occations, that people on the other side of your barely built fence are gatekeeping.

Having read your other thread, and having witnessed the same pattern, i do understand this is how you operate, but please, at least try not to contradict yourself every other post even when you revert to moral talk and behavioral advise.

Of course, you could just say you want healing food regardless of rules and logic simply because it makes the game easier and that's fun for you, probably wouldn't have required you to pull out the rulebook and draw some wonky paralles between food as a source of sustenance and food as a source of literal mending, and surely would have made for a better argument, but i realize being right is more glamorous and shit.

I didn't contradict myself. I have seen you in other threads and you have bad habit of responding in a very a*****e way, for lack of better terms. Can you ever respond to someone without indirectly insulting them in a general way?

Last edited by Lady Avyna; 07/11/21 04:17 PM.
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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
just spits on abilities such as Goodberry, Cure Light Wounds, Lay on Hands, Healing Word, Potions of Healing, Action Surge, and more.

What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used and you are in the middle of a long combat? Wouldn't the ability to consume food help with that?

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by 1varangian
It has been explained many times over why the "if you don't like it, don't use it" argument isn't valid.

Just because YOU don't like something doesn't mean it has to be that way for everyone else. That's gatekeeping. Like I said many times, what's wrong with making it an option? No one is forcing you to eat food to replenish you health if all your other options have been used. You just don't do it, if that's how you want to play.

Originally Posted by 1varangian
Why do you feel like you need exactly food healing? What's wrong with another Short Rest, or even a free full heal after every combat? If you want more healing, why should it be done in a way that many players find immersion breaking when there are other ways that make sense and would even be more convenient?

I don't see how the option of eating food is breaking someone's immersion, if it a an option. That means you don't have to use it if you don't feel like it. I just don't think it's fair that a vocal minority gets to have a say on how everyone plays a game. That's gatekeeping.
Ok first of all, the first part works both ways. You are the one advocating for a change here because you want it that way. I'm not going to explain again why the "don't use it" logic doesn't work. It seems people who are repeating it just refuse to understand and prefer to use it as a go-to argument to get what they want without providing more solid reasoning.

In the second part, you didn't answer my question but just said the same thing on repeat. I'm trying to be constructive and offer solutions here. Why does it have to be exactly food healing when it could also be more short rests or automatic healing after combat?

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Originally Posted by 1varangian
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by 1varangian
It has been explained many times over why the "if you don't like it, don't use it" argument isn't valid.

Just because YOU don't like something doesn't mean it has to be that way for everyone else. That's gatekeeping. Like I said many times, what's wrong with making it an option? No one is forcing you to eat food to replenish you health if all your other options have been used. You just don't do it, if that's how you want to play.

Originally Posted by 1varangian
Why do you feel like you need exactly food healing? What's wrong with another Short Rest, or even a free full heal after every combat? If you want more healing, why should it be done in a way that many players find immersion breaking when there are other ways that make sense and would even be more convenient?

I don't see how the option of eating food is breaking someone's immersion, if it a an option. That means you don't have to use it if you don't feel like it. I just don't think it's fair that a vocal minority gets to have a say on how everyone plays a game. That's gatekeeping.
Ok first of all, the first part works both ways. You are the one advocating for a change here because you want it that way. I'm not going to explain again why the "don't use it" logic doesn't work. It seems people who are repeating it just refuse to understand and prefer to use it as a go-to argument to get what they want without providing more solid reasoning.

In the second part, you didn't answer my question but just said the same thing on repeat. I'm trying to be constructive and offer solutions here. Why does it have to be exactly food healing when it could also be more short rests or automatic healing after combat?

Okay, let me ask you this. If you are in the middle of fighting a very hard boss and all your healing options have been exhausted, why can't you eat a piece of food to help you regain some health? This was allowed in BG3 before they changed it.

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
just spits on abilities such as Goodberry, Cure Light Wounds, Lay on Hands, Healing Word, Potions of Healing, Action Surge, and more.

What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used and you are in the middle of a long combat? Wouldn't the ability to consume food help with that?
It would make this combat easier, yes. But realistically you should not have gotten into such a scenario, especially with the ability to freely long rest in BG3. A very important aspect of D&D (that all the classes are designed and balanced for) is resource management. You chose to cast your spells in earlier fights AND not long rest AND not have healing spell scrolls/potions as a backup. Maybe you had to use your spells/consumables because there was a difficult combat. Or maybe you just were being careless, using healing spells instead of the short rest mechanic. Either way, the better solution is to rest and/or buy healing potions, not add in a safety mechanic that invalidates core components of D&D/class abilities.

I could just as easily ask: What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used, you're in the middle of a long combat, and you have no food left. Wouldn't the ability to restore hp with the click of a button help with that?

The answer is the same: yes, obviously it would make the combat easier. But why bother having healing spells at all if you can easily heal with commonly-found and inexpensive resources?

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
I didn't contradict myself. I have seen you in other threads and you have bad habit of responding in a very a*****e way, for lack of better terms. Can you ever respond to someone without indirectly insulting them in a general way?

It's the only way i allow myself to interact with dumb people.

No but really, if you feel like i did that with you... Now you know why.

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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
just spits on abilities such as Goodberry, Cure Light Wounds, Lay on Hands, Healing Word, Potions of Healing, Action Surge, and more.

What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used and you are in the middle of a long combat? Wouldn't the ability to consume food help with that?
It would make this combat easier, yes. But realistically you should not have gotten into such a scenario, especially with the ability to freely long rest in BG3. A very important aspect of D&D (that all the classes are designed and balanced for) is resource management. You chose to cast your spells in earlier fights AND not long rest AND not have healing spell scrolls/potions as a backup. Maybe you had to use your spells/consumables because there was a difficult combat. Or maybe you just were being careless, using healing spells instead of the short rest mechanic. Either way, the better solution is to rest and/or buy healing potions, not add in a safety mechanic that invalidates core components of D&D/class abilities.

I could just as easily ask: What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used, you're in the middle of a long combat, and you have no food left. Wouldn't the ability to restore hp with the click of a button help with that?

The answer is the same: yes, obviously it would make the combat easier. But why bother having healing spells at all if you can easily heal with commonly-found and inexpensive resources?

I see what you are saying and I understand. I just do understand why some have a big problem with someone asking for the option to be able to consume food like they did before? In case your in the middle of fighting a very hard boss who is besting you every time, you ran out of potions, healing spells have been exhausted and all you have is food. Say you have a fighting chance to beat the enemy, why can you eat food to replenish a little bit of health? I want to stress that this is just an option, I'm not forcing it on anyone. It's just a choice.

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Originally Posted by Innateagle
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
I didn't contradict myself. I have seen you in other threads and you have bad habit of responding in a very a*****e way, for lack of better terms. Can you ever respond to someone without indirectly insulting them in a general way?

It's the only way i allow myself to interact with dumb people.

No but really, if you feel like i did that with you... Now you know why.

You are basically calling me stupid. That extremely uncalled for. Please apologize or I will report you if you keep this up. That is no way to talk to someone.

Last edited by Lady Avyna; 07/11/21 05:04 PM.
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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
.....
Originally Posted by Amirit
With that addition, you literally bring checker's rules into the chess game. Systems are incompatible - it's either DOS or DnD, together they do not work. Once again, Larian did not say "we are using our homebrew variation of DnD", no. What was promised is 5e, and 5e people expect.

Since I am seeing some people wanting strict 5e rules and ONLY 5e rules. Let's take a look at the D&D Player Handbook, on page 185 section FOOD AND WATER. It states:

"Characters who don't eat or drink suffer effects of exhaustion. Exhaustion caused by lack of food and water can't be removed until the character eats and drinks the full required amount."

I know I mentioned eating food to replenish health either during or after combat, to which some are like "NOOOOO" but according to D&D we need to consume food and water or our character get's exhausted. Thereby, technically what I said isn't entirely wrong or dumb. It may not be for combat but you still need to consume food and water.

Um... And your point here? Yes, that rule exists AND
1. People asked for adding exhaustion into play.
2. We DO consume food now during long rests.

So, right now food consumption goes according to 5e and those who wanted it to be the case are not complaining about that part anymore.


Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used and you are in the middle of a long combat? Wouldn't the ability to consume food help with that?

This is called "resource management" and is a part of the game. I mean, part of DnD - you plan ahead, you get prepared and you fight or you run away and return prepared next time. You DO NOT ask DM for a miraculous cure of everyone in the middle of a session just because you forgot to take enough portions with you. This is the whole point of gameplay.
(mrfuji3 answered that part better while I was typing)

Last edited by Amirit; 07/11/21 05:08 PM.
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Originally Posted by Amirit
[i][/i]
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
.....
Originally Posted by Amirit
With that addition, you literally bring checker's rules into the chess game. Systems are incompatible - it's either DOS or DnD, together they do not work. Once again, Larian did not say "we are using our homebrew variation of DnD", no. What was promised is 5e, and 5e people expect.

Since I am seeing some people wanting strict 5e rules and ONLY 5e rules. Let's take a look at the D&D Player Handbook, on page 185 section FOOD AND WATER. It states:

"Characters who don't eat or drink suffer effects of exhaustion. Exhaustion caused by lack of food and water can't be removed until the character eats and drinks the full required amount."

I know I mentioned eating food to replenish health either during or after combat, to which some are like "NOOOOO" but according to D&D we need to consume food and water or our character get's exhausted. Thereby, technically what I said isn't entirely wrong or dumb. It may not be for combat but you still need to consume food and water.

Um... And your point here? Yes, that rule exists AND
1. People asked for adding exhaustion into play.
2. We DO consume food now during long rests.

So, right now food consumption goes according to 5e and those who wanted it to be the case are not complaining about that part anymore.


Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
What about in a scenario where all those abilities have been used and you are in the middle of a long combat? Wouldn't the ability to consume food help with that?

This is called "resource management" and is a part of the game. I mean, part of DnD - you plan ahead, you get prepared and you fight or you run away and return prepared next time. You DO NOT ask DM for a miraculous cure of everyone in the middle of a session just because you forgot to take enough portions with you. This is the whole point of gameplay.

Again, it's not about the lack of planning ahead. Say your fighting a really hard boss, you didn't expect it to be this hard. All of your healing option have been used. You can't do a short rest in the middle of battle but have some food. Why can't a DM allow that? What rule is there that says you can't do that?

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
If you are in the middle of fighting a very hard boss and all your healing options have been exhausted, why can't you eat a piece of food to help you regain some health?
That's what healing potions are for. DnD uses limited resources for a reason - and as Larian removed healing through food, then combat encounters should be balanced appropriately, aka. not requiring unending supply of healing items. Personally, I can't say I run into the issue when I was short on healing spells/items in combat, but I do think an original 5e short rest system would be probably better then was Larian currently has - while playing Solasta classes that tended to take the most beating could also effectively recover during short rests.

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Again, it's not about the lack of planning ahead. Say your fighting a really hard boss, you didn't expect it to be this hard. All of your healing option have been used. You can't do a short rest in the middle of battle but have some food. Why can't a DM allow that? What rule is there that says you can't do that?

The rule (if you need the rule here) is "food does not restore your health" and "eating full pig's head takes longer than a bonus action". But 99.9% DMs and playes would have enough common sense not to even ask for such a thing.

I'll repeat my post that you cited but probably did not read: "... you get prepared and you fight or you run away and return prepared next time"

This is the point of the game to fight challenges that are thrown at you.
Please, read Mrfuji3 post https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=799134#Post799134 detailing that part.

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Originally Posted by Wormerine
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
If you are in the middle of fighting a very hard boss and all your healing options have been exhausted, why can't you eat a piece of food to help you regain some health?
That's what healing potions are for. DnD uses limited resources for a reason - and as Larian removed healing through food, then combat encounters should be balanced appropriately, aka. not requiring unending supply of healing items. Personally, I can't say I run into the issue when I was short on healing spells/items in combat, but I do think an original 5e short rest system would be probably better then was Larian currently has - while playing Solasta classes that tended to take the most beating could also effectively recover during short rests.

I may be misunderstanding, are you suggesting being able to use short rest during combat? If you used up your potions and healing spells while in combat.

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You know what you need to be asking for? Story mod. Many games have now - it's when you want to just see the story and the combat is nominal, only to indicate that at this point you had to fight.

Rules tweaking only make people angry and in general is not productive. But story-mods is a great mechanic! It allows those who is not interested in combat still enjoy the game. It's opposite - super hard-mode - usually made for those who do not care for the story and tests itself in combat only. For them is enough to add full custom parties and an option to skip dialogues. And anything in between (preferably a few gradations) for everyone else.

So, yeah, seems like we just need difficulty system.

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Originally Posted by Amirit
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Again, it's not about the lack of planning ahead. Say your fighting a really hard boss, you didn't expect it to be this hard. All of your healing option have been used. You can't do a short rest in the middle of battle but have some food. Why can't a DM allow that? What rule is there that says you can't do that?

The rule (if you need the rule here) is "food does not restore your health" and "eating full pig's head takes longer than a bonus action". But 99.9% DMs and playes would have enough common sense not to even ask for such a thing.

I'll repeat my post that you cited but probably did not read: "... you get prepared and you fight or you run away and return prepared next time"

This is the point of the game to fight challenges that are thrown at you.
Please, read Mrfuji3 post https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=799134#Post799134 detailing that part.

This response kinds goes to what someone earlier has been saying about players that want certain things in a game but also expect everyone else to accept that. BG3 was never marketed as a strict DnD 5e game. It was marketed as an RPG "based" on DnD 5e. According to Larian it's meant to be a hybrid of RPG and 5e. So, if someone asks for an option, it shouldn't be a big deal.

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Originally Posted by Amirit
You know what you need to be asking for? Story mod. Many games have now - it's when you want to just see the story and the combat is nominal, only to indicate that at this point you had to fight.

Rules tweaking only make people angry and in general is not productive. But story-mods is a great mechanic! It allows those who is not interested in combat still enjoy the game. It's opposite - super hard-mode - usually made for those who do not care for the story and tests itself in combat only. For them is enough to add full custom parties and an option to skip dialogues. And anything in between (preferably a few gradations) for everyone else.

So, yeah, seems like we just need difficulty system.

I agree with that.

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
Originally Posted by Innateagle
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
I didn't contradict myself. I have seen you in other threads and you have bad habit of responding in a very a*****e way, for lack of better terms. Can you ever respond to someone without indirectly insulting them in a general way?

It's the only way i allow myself to interact with dumb people.

No but really, if you feel like i did that with you... Now you know why.

You are basically calling me stupid. That extremely uncalled for. Please apologize or I will report you if you keep this up. That is no way to talk to someone.

Lady, there's no basically.

Anyway, my cringe meter is fucking dying right now so i'll just wish you good luck on your future endeavours, reporting me and the like, and imma press the ignore button. Bye.

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Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
I see what you are saying and I understand. [...] I want to stress that this is just an option, I'm not forcing it on anyone. It's just a choice.
I have a problem because it
- breaks my immersion
- puts the onerous on me to choose to play sub-optimally, which is not fun
- if Larian allows everyone (as in, included in the game by default) to eat food for mid-combat healing, then there's a decent chance they'll balance the game assuming players will do that. Which will then definitely affect my playthrough: either I intentionally make combats more difficult by not eating food, or I do eat food and dislike doing so

Here's a compromise: how about a "food restores HP" toggle option in the game settings that comes with a warning "game encounters are not balanced for food items restoring HP mid-combat"? You have your option, but I have my immersion and comfort in the knowledge that the game isn't based around healing via food items.

Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
In case your in the middle of fighting a very hard boss who is besting you every time, you ran out of potions, healing spells have been exhausted and all you have is food. Say you have a fighting chance to beat the enemy, why can you eat food to replenish a little bit of health? I want to stress that this is just an option, I'm not forcing it on anyone. It's just a choice.
These sentences simply repeat what you said before, so my response hasn't changed. Why not have a button that you can click - in case you're out of potions, healing spells, and food - that restores hp? It's just an option.

Again, the better solution is to a) have rested before this fight, or b) to lower the difficulty setting of the game. Not add a backup safety that invalidates class abilities and resource management.

Last edited by mrfuji3; 07/11/21 05:41 PM.
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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
I see what you are saying and I understand. [...] I want to stress that this is just an option, I'm not forcing it on anyone. It's just a choice.
I have a problem because it
- breaks my immersion
- puts the onerous on me to choose to play sub-optimally, which is not fun
- if Larian allows everyone (as in, included in the game by default) to eat food for mid-combat healing, then there's a decent chance they'll balance the game assuming players will do that. Which will then definitely affect my playthrough: either I intentionally make combats more difficult by not eating food, or I do eat food and dislike doing so

Here's a compromise: how about a "food restores HP" toggle option in the game settings that comes with a warning "game encounters are not balanced for food items restoring HP mid-combat"? You have your option, but I have my immersion and comfort in the knowledge that the game isn't based around healing via food items.

Originally Posted by Lady Avyna
In case your in the middle of fighting a very hard boss who is besting you every time, you ran out of potions, healing spells have been exhausted and all you have is food. Say you have a fighting chance to beat the enemy, why can you eat food to replenish a little bit of health? I want to stress that this is just an option, I'm not forcing it on anyone. It's just a choice.
These sentences simply repeat what you said before, so my response hasn't changed. Why not have a button that you can click - in case you're out of potions, healing spells, and food - that restores hp? It's just an option.

Again, the better solution is to a) have rested before this fight, or b) to lower the difficulty setting of the game. Not add a backup safety that invalidates class abilities and resource management.

As an option that is fine. I don't have a problem with that.

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