Larian Studios Forums Divinity: Original Sin 2 Divinity - Original Sin 2 - General Character poses seem a bit ridiculous - esp female

Irreconcilable Differences: The Forum Thread

I think if you really believe there's underlying sexism in a pose in a fantasy videogame where everything is highly stylized and designed to be aesthetic you should probably search for a better hobby.

I don't think there's anything wrong with the poses. It's just to give the feeling of femininity and masculinity. I don't think it's too different from when you see an advertisement of a woman in a feminine pose and another advertisement of a man in a masculine pose.

I'll say what I always say when these things come up - make it the same. If the armor is revealing, make it revealing for both genders, if the pose is over the top, make the exact same over the top pose for both gender etc. just make it the same.

I would just like to say that there are many other topics on this forum that could use some of the passion being displayed in this one!

Ayvah, I am uncertain what you are arguing for at this point.

Have you seen me making any points pertaining to the existence of sexism, or its possible effects? I am interested in your findings regarding me saying anything on the above topic.

In the meantime, I believe that I handily summarized my point at the very beginning of my first post in this thread, which I later extended. I quote:

You simply cannot argue with me regarding sexism, because I haven't made any points about it yet.

Since you seem eager to classify me, I will tell you this. I am less interested in someone's body shape, and far more in their being*.

Are you talking about MGSV or D:OS2? The sexism in MGSV should be pretty obvious. I still played it, and it was still a great game, but it was certainly far from perfect. Just because I'm willing to admit that, it doesn't mean I have to quit games forever.

Besides, sexism is everywhere. In some situations, sexism is justified (such as dance) because there is explicitly a sexual component to it. But there is no reason why these attitudes should be transported to an asexual setting, such as a workplace.

Artistically, you can also justify that the setting is distinct to the tone of the work. For example, the TV show Mad Men portrays 60s sexism, but the TV show does not present this sexism in a positive light.

However, the setting does not justify the pose under discussion for reasons 1 & 2 I explained earlier. (This is also why I also don't agree with transplanting the pose to the male, but the inverse would be fine.) Where this gets uncomfortable is when you notice that these non-contextual poses appear to have been introduced in a heavily gendered way to the female characters.

And yes, there are other poses that seem silly (such as leaning against a sword), but at least those poses are contextually relevant to the setting.

Returning to your point, it's ironic that there are so many comments in topics like this about the complainers being "non- gamers" and then there are comments like yours that explicitly seek to exclude them from gaming. I feel I'm committed enough to gaming to consider myself a hardcore gamer. Perhaps more would be joining us if we let them. Maybe that's what you're afraid of?

I've already bought D:OS2, and I'm sure I'll enjoy playing it, but not as much as I would if it could more adeptly negotiate these kinds of issues.

They are already the same.
But... they just toss out that fact, and males entirely since... well, it would distract from their argument that woman are suppressed or something.

Wew lad, that's some dedication.

I'm normally really good in noticing a joke but you really got me for a moment.

All this talk about sexism reminds me of a quote from one my favourite movies.

Seriously, it's only a videogame, and we should respect the artist's vision.

It's more important that the artist should respect their audience, isn't it?

Which bit of the audience, though? You can't please everyone, as this very topic proves, so I figure the artist may as well just stick with their vision. Because as soon as they change it to suit one person's taste and not offend someone else, it may no longer suit anyone's taste and be so bland as to not be worth bothering with.

I agree that they may want to reconsider something that might be generally considered to be very offensive, but there's nothing about Divinity that fits that description.

Not at all. Where did you get that idea? It makes no sense at all.

The artist does his thing and you follow him because of it. If he does something that you don't like, well you can just not like the thing and keep on following him or not, expecting the artist to censor himself because of your opinion is very entitled.

First you should make sure you actually represent the audience.

Absolutely savage.

To add to the above:
It is in fact the opposite.
If you dont like what an artist does then you are free to leave. Its as simple as that.

Further @ayvah, the source u linked earlier:
No surprise, given the website name, they dont come up with any factual peer reviewed stats.
Just like all other outlets that run down this narrative like a clock, they never come with facts and always rely on obscure "studies" and the perception of people.
And thats exactly what this source did as well.
Just because you believe something is true, doesnt make it true.
FYI these women they are talking about, considder a man simply looking at a women in a way THEY perceive to be wrong as sexism. So its no surprise they come up with this complete nonsense. Not to mention the entire article comes from the regressive left camp.
I could go far deeper into this but i dont think anyone here is interested in this anyway.

Here is an example of such study in a different context, done in my own country:
-Asked a bunch of people how safe they felt in their city
-High percentage claimed to feel unsafe
->People feel unsafe!
Is there any legitimate reason for these people to feel unsafe?
-Studies are done to find out how much crime occurs in the city
-Turns out it has one of the lowest crimerates in the entire country
->Facts =/= perception

Why were these people feeling scared?
Well one of the reasons put forward was that the people questioned where mostly old people, due to the fact that that particular city has a high concentration of old people living there.

I'm reminded of The Daily Mash and its frequent citation of the Institute of Studies. That said, the Mash is probably more accurate and honest than most other newspapers!

Why aren't any of the women at Larian Studios making a fuss about sexism? It's always someone else doing the complaining, and almost never the women that might be involved somehow with the "over-sexualizing."

I think this thread is another case of people with a premeditated goal of finding something to be offended about... Ultimately they aren't interested in fairness, but in exerting control over others' creative expression, so there's nothing they'd find acceptable.

Creators, please: don't be intimidated. Your works are neither realistic nor serious, and they don't have to be. Make the game according to your vision - there's no reason to compromise on that. Many serial offense-takers have no intention of being your customer regardless of what you do.