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#615071 18/09/17 09:22 PM
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Linio Offline OP
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Hi All.

There are more and more topics revolving around the armor system. Since we can see a lot of messages here and there, I wanted to have a feel of what the community in general think of it.

Here's a little poll on the subject :

Easypoll on armor

I would appreciate you take a little time to answer regardless of what your opinion is (there should be enough options to cover pretty much every case).

Thanks.

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You should at least mention that you cross posted this to the Steam forums, will otherwise give quite a skewed impression of the audience size.


* as usual this is imho (unless stated otherwise); feel free to disagree, ignore or try to change my mind. Agreeing with me is ofc also allowed, but makes for much worse flamewarsarguments.

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Linio Offline OP
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Hi.

I wasn't aware that would cause an issue, but thanks for pointing that out.
I felt posting it only here would gather fewer responses and a narrower perspective on the matter.

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I like this new shields system

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I'm of two minds about the new armor / magic armor system.

I like the idea, and its not like its anything new. Many games have armor that has "physical defense" and "magical defense" as attributes. This goes back to the early days of RPGs so its nothing new.

What IS new (at least to me) is the idea that the Armor is basically your Physical Resistance and your Magic Armor is your Magic Resistance.

I'm of mixed views on armor & resistance being rolled into the same "stat". It feels like this makes status effects more of a late combat fight thing than something to try and lead the fight off with to push an advantage.

Last edited by KentDA; 18/09/17 10:05 PM.
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Only 34 votes so far.

My take on the Armor system is that it wanted to take the randomness away from the tatics. For me, I like the randomness because it gives a sensation of playing tabletop RPG, that's why I didn't like the way it's designed.

As many people said, it is not viable to have a build that mixes both type of damages and even your team has to be either only 1 type of damage or a extreme controlled 2:2 hybrid to win fights, otherwise, one of the characters will be useless by not being able to damage vitality directly nor causing CC's. I don't dislike the idea of having something protecting your health, but splitting into two types is the main problem.

Also, since we're talking about this, I also dislike the accuracy system. The base being 95% means most characters won't miss unless they have a negative condition (which can only be received by depleting their armor). I like the idea of not being able to rely on (almost) every single basic attack and spell. Maybe they could mix add more dodging options to tanky characters (simulating a high AC) and having the armor to gradually increase your resists to CC's.

I feel like this has been said too much by now, but if anyone makes a balanced mod with any of those ideas (all hail Baardvark), I'd love to play the game with them. With this system, I feel like my criativity is being constrained.

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I don't see the point of posting this poll now instead of at the start of Early Access. It ain't changing drastically at this point, that ship sank a long time ago.

Honestly, though, during the beta, I did try to think of a better system, and I couldn't.

Last edited by Stabbey; 18/09/17 10:31 PM.
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Armour system is fine by me... A bit unique and removes RNG.

Very cool.

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Neither systems designs are great, but it was better in D:OS 1.

The new armor system isn't terrible, but it becomes repetitive, because the general tactics in combat are pretty much always the same.

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Its fine. Its basically the spaceship system. Shields go down with lasers, armor needs physical damage, and the hull can be damage by anything. I do think it could be more interesting but the system is fine and has been done many times with success in the past.

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Linio Offline OP
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Originally Posted by Stabbey
I don't see the point of posting this poll now instead of at the start of Early Access. It ain't changing drastically at this point, that ship sank a long time ago.

Honestly, though, during the beta, I did try to think of a better system, and I couldn't.


For the first point to be fair, the current build was never made available. I remember the discussions at length about it, and being a little worried, hoping in the end Larian would do something, but didn't, so yeah, maybe the ship has sailed, still, regarding the poll we can see that a majority of people wants a change.

About the ideas, a lot were sent already, the one reccuring being the percentage based CC depending on how much armor you have left. The other being having monsters having either one or the other armor. Maybe not the best but somehow it already feels better than the system in place.


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Like Stabbey, I don't see so much sense in a poll which's intention seems to be change. Anything is made for the armor system and changing it to some untested alternatives now after release seems a bit bold.

BTW, CC as percentage of armor reinvents the randomness system, no please. And mobs with this or that armor were mobs without armor because every group would be two magical and two physical chars, nicely focusing the two convenient enemies at a time. It would be like now, but worse.

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The system required tuning that there was obviously no time to do.

The overall design of the abilities also doesn't help, since there's a very poor sense of proper progression and relative power.

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A easy to implement system would be CC skills deal physical damage check magical armor and CC skills deal magical damage check physical armor. This way the player has to choose between damage to vitality and CC if only one of the target's armors down.
It would likely force a solo player to play hybrid build though, but provides more interesting dynamics for a team.

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I really don't like the whole armour system, for the many, many reasons which were discussed at length before.
Also, thematically speaking I prefer armour working as reduction of impact rather than a life bar. I'd prefer to have the CC problem dampened at the source (making CC themselves less prevalent/less powerful) instead of building a whole new armour system around it.

I would prefer having OS1 armour system overall, and having the defense reducing the CC effect proportionally to the defense provided. So for example, if your armour absorb 50 % of the damage, it will reduce CC by 50 % (two turns worth of stun would become one turn of stun ; one turn of stun would become "reduce AP by 50 % for the next turn" and so on).

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Linio Offline OP
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Originally Posted by geala
Like Stabbey, I don't see so much sense in a poll which's intention seems to be change. Anything is made for the armor system and changing it to some untested alternatives now after release seems a bit bold.


They did an EE for the first opus.
And honestly, I'm not very fond of the "Oh well, too late now" argument.
The topic of course led to thinking there was issues with the system as it is now, then again, I just created the poll with as little context as possible. The responses are pretty clear, the majority of players dislike the system. I do not know what would be a good way of changing it, but I do know being here the past few months that a lot of people who kickstarted the game voiced the issues, and it seems they were ignored, which is not what you want when you kickstart a game.


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Originally Posted by Linio
Originally Posted by geala
Like Stabbey, I don't see so much sense in a poll which's intention seems to be change. Anything is made for the armor system and changing it to some untested alternatives now after release seems a bit bold.


They did an EE for the first opus.
And honestly, I'm not very fond of the "Oh well, too late now" argument.
The topic of course led to thinking there was issues with the system as it is now, then again, I just created the poll with as little context as possible. The responses are pretty clear, the majority of players dislike the system. I do not know what would be a good way of changing it, but I do know being here the past few months that a lot of people who kickstarted the game voiced the issues, and it seems they were ignored, which is not what you want when you kickstart a game.



Am I looking at different poll or what? From the easypolls 52 percent of people like it as perfect or with small tweaks, another 22 percent like the idea, but not the implementation.

Thats pretty far from statement "The responses are pretty clear, the majority of players dislike the system."

Are you a politician? You sound like some politics from our country.. laugh

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Linio Offline OP
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It's perfect, I wouldn't change it 13%

I call them as I see them. The number changes, when I looked, there was less than 50% with the two first answer.
A need to tweak the system is not an acceptance of it.

Anyway, I think the other topics speak for themselves, I just wanted to give Larian a picture of things, and to me it's clear, but of course analysis of those number is a matter of taste. If I were to create something that only 13% are confortable with, I wouldn't be happy, but hey, call me a politician wink

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Nah, people are NEVER satisfied completely, so liking it even if you think it could be tweaked still doesnt mean people are generally against it. I mean you write MAJORITY DISLIKES it, even when the answer in poll states "but I LIKE IT"

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I think the system is fine. I however think the skills you can get are the problem. As there is almost nothing that bypasses the different armors, not even taunt, wich makes it the most useless skill in the game. Frankly i think the best way to improve this system, wich i like btw. Is to tweak or add some skills that can bypass it, and do something except armor. Taunt f.ex, needs to just get fixed so it bypasses armor. There is no point to it otherwise, as just using a knockdown skill is superior ALWAYS when armor is gone.

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