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Originally Posted by Imryll
Ah, but could the reality compare with my childhood memories (a different sort of lens)?


Haha, so true! If you've never watched the movie 'Indian Summer' (excellent underrated movie from the early 90's, has Kevin Pollack, Bill Paxton, Diane Lane & Alan Arkin amongst others), do yourself a favor and find/rent it on Amazon or something. General premise is adults who go back and spend a week at the summer camp they grew up attending, and my favorite scene in that movie is when Kevin Pollack's character along with one of the female characters return to this lake with a 'dam', and Pollack just keeps going on and on and on (an on) about how "tiny" it all is, he doesn't remember it being so "tiny" etc etc....the female char just unloads on him finally and is like 'The dam is not smaller, ok?! Its the same size it always was!! *YOU* have grown up and gotten larger - deal with it!" laugh

Last edited by Tyndaleon; 08/09/20 01:32 PM.

“Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain - and most fools do. But it takes character and self control to be understanding and forgiving.”---Dale Carnegie.
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Originally Posted by Raze
Actually, about 3/4 of the game engine was updated or rewritten, and in addition to graphics quality improvements, there were also some changes to file formats used to make assets easier to manage, etc. I'm not sure about the basic textures, but no models / icons / characters / etc are being reused* (textures would at least be looked at for quality vs size; as mentioned, even if entirely new a texture of a common rock is going to be relatively similar to an old texture of a common rock).

* Obviously during development there were a lot of placholder and reused assets, replaced as development progressed.

@Raze, thanks for posting this. This is actually quite informative if you are being authoritative with this information (as opposed to it being your opinion or guess).

Assuming this is authoritative, could you please explain why "... even if entirely new a texture of a common rock is going to be relatively similar to an old texture of a common rock"? This is a sincere question.

And also, are you confirming that all art assets (models, textures, whatever) for environmental objects and characters are/will be newly created specifically for this game?

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Originally Posted by kanisatha


Assuming this is authoritative, could you please explain why "... even if entirely new a texture of a common rock is going to be relatively similar to an old texture of a common rock"? This is a sincere question.


Without wanting to sound like an ass, I think he means that a rock in Rivellon and a rock in the Forgotten Realms is quite similar.

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Originally Posted by Gt27mustang
Originally Posted by kanisatha


Assuming this is authoritative, could you please explain why "... even if entirely new a texture of a common rock is going to be relatively similar to an old texture of a common rock"? This is a sincere question.


Without wanting to sound like an ass, I think he means that a rock in Rivellon and a rock in the Forgotten Realms is quite similar.

Well, but that can be said for every video game, even across different game genres and different types of games. If a rock is a rock, then a rock in TOW would look exactly like a rock in PoE. Ditto Dragon Age v. Mass Effect; TES v. Fallout. Yet we don't see developers just simply copy and paste even these generic environmental objects from one of their game franchises into another. And in the case of my question, I go beyond just rocks or trees and specifically refer to such things buildings (i.e. walls, stone floors, pillars). And I don't see any rational justification for a stone pillar in BG3 to look exactly like a stone pillar in D:OS2.

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Originally Posted by kanisatha
And in the case of my question, I go beyond just rocks or trees and specifically refer to such things buildings (i.e. walls, stone floors, pillars). And I don't see any rational justification for a stone pillar in BG3 to look exactly like a stone pillar in D:OS2.


As it has been said, they retouched everything. To what extent, it remains to be seen...

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Its not the same rock textues tho.

its the same style. Because its the same studio.
If Larian makes BG3 it looks like a Larian game, its gonna feature some very catholic architecture and renaissance statues and tiled floors, Larian likes that shit.
Meanwhile if Obsidian were to make BG3 then it would look an Obsidian game, by which iw ant to say like absolute dogshit featuring ugly character that creep onto your PC

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Originally Posted by Daniel213
Originally Posted by _Vic_
I sometimes wonder if people do know how D&D5E´s creatures, uniforms and the city of Baldur´s gate actually look like before making comparisons...



Fair enough about the characters. But I wasn't really talking about the character design. I was talking about the general art direction, the entire look and feel. Let me show you what I mean.

If you would show those screenshots to someone who doesn't know both games, I assure you he'd tell you it's from the same game and the same level/map.

[Linked Image]

[Linked Image]

And there is something about the graphic portrayal about all the characters and assets that makes it look like the exact same game, that just got some graphical updates.


Hardly surprising these shots look similar really, if you pick pretty much the most generic fantasy location possible- An overgrown ruined fort. Stone walls, flagstones, steps, plants, etc. There’s places very much like this all over the Witcher games, Dagon Age: Inquisition, etc, etc.

Even with new textures, how different do you expect them to be? Granted, the bushes look the same and broken columns appear to be the same style, but you appear to have carefully picked out screenshots to make a point about the “entire look and feel” of the game.

How about a bit more of a challenge and try to match up something like this, which is just as much part of the “entire look and feel” as your examples?

[Linked Image]

As for there being “something about the graphic portrayal of the characters“, do you mean how DOS games have 3D cartoon characters with fixed facial expressions and don’t move an inch during dialogue, while BG3 has life like characters with fully animated dialogue and cut scenes roughly on par with major studio releases?

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Originally Posted by Sordak
Meanwhile if Obsidian were to make BG3 then it would look an Obsidian game, by which iw ant to say like absolute dogshit featuring ugly character that creep onto your PC

I think that's a little harsh. I played The Outer Worlds last year and it was a very, erm... graphical game. "Pretty" isn't quite the word I'm looking for, not unless teamed with "ugly" so I shan't go there. Its aesthetics were unconventionally appealing.


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Originally Posted by vometia
I played The Outer Worlds last year and it was a very, erm... graphical game. "Pretty" isn't quite the word I'm looking for, not unless teamed with "ugly" so I shan't go there. Its aesthetics were unconventionally appealing.

I thought artstyle and look wise Outer Worlds was great. Nothing I can complain about there. PoE1&2 looked phenomenal as well IMO.

I think it's a bit odd to complain about Obsidian game's look when they mostly build campaigns for other people's games. KOTOR2 is just as ugly as KOTOR1. F:NV as F:3. NVN2 as most games build on Aurora Engine (perhaps Jade Empire is an exception).

The complaint I often hear regarding Obsidian is them making characters instead of wifus, but that's less looks and more priority thing.

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Originally Posted by Wormerine
I thought artstyle and look wise Outer Worlds was great. Nothing I can complain about there. PoE1&2 looked phenomenal as well IMO.

I think it's a bit odd to complain about Obsidian game's look when they mostly build campaigns for other people's games. KOTOR2 is just as ugly as KOTOR1. F:NV as F:3. NVN2 as most games build on Aurora Engine (perhaps Jade Empire is an exception).

The complaint I often hear regarding Obsidian is them making characters instead of wifus, but that's less looks and more priority thing.

Oh, I wasn't complaining about it at all. I think they got the look and general vibe of the thing exactly right. There was something quite special seeing the lumpen shape of the Unreliable careering into a rather pretty night sky, the silhouettes of the cliffs and trees nicely framing the ringed planet in the distance.

I thought the characters looked okay too. I mean they looked individual and realistic so no complaints there. I did feel a bit sorry for the guy with the moon hat though.


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Originally Posted by Dagless


Hardly surprising these shots look similar really, if you pick pretty much the most generic fantasy location possible- An overgrown ruined fort. Stone walls, flagstones, steps, plants, etc. There’s places very much like this all over the Witcher games, Dagon Age: Inquisition, etc, etc.

Even with new textures, how different do you expect them to be? Granted, the bushes look the same and broken columns appear to be the same style, but you appear to have carefully picked out screenshots to make a point about the “entire look and feel” of the game.

How about a bit more of a challenge and try to match up something like this, which is just as much part of the “entire look and feel” as your examples?

[Linked Image]

As for there being “something about the graphic portrayal of the characters“, do you mean how DOS games have 3D cartoon characters with fixed facial expressions and don’t move an inch during dialogue, while BG3 has life like characters with fully animated dialogue and cut scenes roughly on par with major studio releases?


There are many things on the screnshot that visualy looks or feels like DoS, especially the user interface.
I think the UI could give a more Baldur's Gate feelings instead of just another "DoS" UI like this ?

Do we really need that big mmorpg style action bar on the bottom ?
Is that big ennemy's HP bar on the top necessary ?
The portraits are something important in BG UI. Maybe they could be more important here with buffs/debuff not especially outside of it. The HP bar is under the portrait, couldn't the portrait become more and more red while your HP decrease as in the old BG ?
Can't those portraits be a little bit less generic and a be a little bit more beautifull ?

Can't they re-design the old icons to have a visual link with the old games ?

This is only a few little exemple I think about now but many things could be improved to looks more like what BG was.
Pillars of Eternity did it pretty well for exemple and there are many possibilities for BG3 to have it's identity.

UI is an exemple of things Larian could work on to pleased players that find nothing related to BG in BG3.

About UI I just add that it's actually very intrusive. There are informations all over the screen and I really think it coulb be better if it's lighter.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 09/09/20 11:52 AM.
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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by Dagless


Hardly surprising these shots look similar really, if you pick pretty much the most generic fantasy location possible- An overgrown ruined fort. Stone walls, flagstones, steps, plants, etc. There’s places very much like this all over the Witcher games, Dagon Age: Inquisition, etc, etc.

Even with new textures, how different do you expect them to be? Granted, the bushes look the same and broken columns appear to be the same style, but you appear to have carefully picked out screenshots to make a point about the “entire look and feel” of the game.

How about a bit more of a challenge and try to match up something like this, which is just as much part of the “entire look and feel” as your examples?

[Linked Image]

As for there being “something about the graphic portrayal of the characters“, do you mean how DOS games have 3D cartoon characters with fixed facial expressions and don’t move an inch during dialogue, while BG3 has life like characters with fully animated dialogue and cut scenes roughly on par with major studio releases?


There are many things on the screnshot that visualy looks or feels like DoS, especially the user interface.
I think the UI could give a more Baldur's Gate feelings instead of just another "DoS" UI like this ?

Until now I though it was a question of different perspectives, but right now I´m starting to think you´re just messing with the rest of us, guys laugh

The UI in Dos2 is like this: Portraits in vertical in one side (Like in BG2), combat order in up and center, skill bar down below, quick menus in the bottom right,etc etc


[Linked Image]


And this was the UI in bg2. You know, with a big action bar in the bottom, the buff/debuff icons covering the important portraits, and no hp bar under the portrait (the hp bar was the coloured part of the portrait), portraits in one side, etc.

[Linked Image]


So. You want an UI that resembles the old games or you want an UI that is more likeable to you? because your description does not seem like the old games...

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Originally Posted by Wormerine
Originally Posted by vometia
I played The Outer Worlds last year and it was a very, erm... graphical game. "Pretty" isn't quite the word I'm looking for, not unless teamed with "ugly" so I shan't go there. Its aesthetics were unconventionally appealing.

I thought artstyle and look wise Outer Worlds was great. Nothing I can complain about there. PoE1&2 looked phenomenal as well IMO.

People are free to have their personal preferences, of course, but I agree that the PoE games are incredibly gorgeous. Easily the most beautiful artwork of all high-fantasy cRPGs (because I can only comment on those games). At the same time, D:OS artwork was hideous, as I've described it before, like fingernails on a chalkboard.

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Originally Posted by _Vic_

So. You want an UI that resembles the old games or you want an UI that is more likeable to you? because your description does not seem like the old games...


You really feel that the DoS 2 UI feels like BG's UI because portraits are on the side ?
Is that only a matter of position according to you ? That's very short.

I really try to do my best while choosing my words (especially in EN) but yea, in EXEMPLE the user interface of P:K, PoE or Tyranny suits way better to a game named Baldur's Gate to me (even wasteland 2 if you want an exemple with a totally different style).

The UI of BG3 and DoS feels like a mmorpg with many informations everywhere, big skills bar, informations and effects everywhere on the screen... There not only one side of the screen where you have nothing in front of the action.
It's very intrusive while it's way more sober in the old BG and suits better to "writing a story" in a RPg according to me.

That was just a clue that maybe, gives the feeling that the game looks more like DoS than that a Baldur's Gate game.


Last edited by Maximuuus; 09/09/20 01:41 PM.
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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by _Vic_

So. You want an UI that resembles the old games or you want an UI that is more likeable to you? because your description does not seem like the old games...


You really feel that the DoS 2 UI feels like BG's UI because portraits are on the side ?
Is that only a matter of position according to you ? That's very short



Nope, I`ve never said Dos2 UI looks like bg, please reread my post before start making derisive juzgements. I only said that your description of an UI does not match the old bg games and bg3 interface is different from the one on DoS2 too wink

I`m starting to think that for some people all looks like DoS games

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I don't really have a problem with the 3, and to be totally clear I'm someone who played the originals on release, didn't care for DOS and skipped DOS2 (played the first hour on a ps4 and hated the control scheme, I realize that isn't a fair shake). In my opinion the story was an important aspect of BG but not a majorly important aspect. That said, I also do wish that Larian hadn't gone with the 3. It gives them more flexibility and freedom, while still meeting the (realistic) expectations of some of the old school fans like myself. It's pretty clearly a money grab in the era of sequels.

I like a previous post where it could be titled something like BG: <insert title here> so that you can communicate that this is something happening in the same universe and that fans can expect a certain amount of similarity between the two. Wasn't the story finished by the end of ToB? What was the canon ending?

All in all, I feel like the fairest and most balanced thing to do would be to wait for the game and then judge after that.

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So the latest iteration of this thread is about saying the UI is not enough BG like and too much DOS like? Am I the only one who doesn't care about how the UI looks like as long as it's practical for the purpose of the game?

Last edited by Nyanko; 09/09/20 03:01 PM.
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Originally Posted by Nyanko
So the latest iteration of this thread is about saying the UI is not enough BG like and too much DOS like? Am I the only one who doesn't care about how the UI looks like as long as it's practical for the purpose of the game?


Well, I think it goes without saying that that's what most people would want. At this point it's a matter of what do YOU think is practical? Some people are also arguing about the overall design. Personally I prefer the older BG UI, but there can be improvements. I want to be able to mouseover conditions and know what they are without having to open up a character screen, for example. The BG UI also feels bigger to me, which I like. I tend to prefer to have abilities and spells behind an icon, like BG, otherwise it feels cluttered.

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Originally Posted by Nyanko
So the latest iteration of this thread is about saying the UI is not enough BG like and too much DOS like? Am I the only one who doesn't care about how the UI looks like as long as it's practical for the purpose of the game?

When the whole issue of 'this isn't a BG game' arose some months ago, I consistently tried to get some clarity on what the disappointed party meant. After a lot of back and forth, specifics started to emerge, one of which was discontent with the UI. So, at least there are some specifics being mentioned. That being said, I absolutely do agree with you. Moreover, older UIs tended to obscure more of the screen with unnecessary imagery and have less customization options, all while sometimes giving less information. The UIs of today don't look like the UIs of yesteryear for a reason.

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Originally Posted by _Vic_
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Originally Posted by _Vic_

So. You want an UI that resembles the old games or you want an UI that is more likeable to you? because your description does not seem like the old games...


You really feel that the DoS 2 UI feels like BG's UI because portraits are on the side ?
Is that only a matter of position according to you ? That's very short



Nope, I`ve never said Dos2 UI looks like bg, please reread my post before start making derisive juzgements. I only said that your description of an UI does not match the old bg games and bg3 interface is different from the one on DoS2 too wink

I`m starting to think that for some people all looks like DoS games


Sorry to compare it to DoS especially but on the other hand, it looks many players here seems unable to imagine something else whatever we're talking about the UI, the colors, the textures and the models (i.e a rock looks the same in every games).
Whatever we're thinking, everyone compare BG3 to Larian's game and I guess that's not a problem here.

In ordrer to qualify my remarks, I give more details about the "mmorpg" style, the intrusive UI that gives nformations everywhere on the screen and that very intrusive UI.

I guess that could be something they work on to create BG3's own personnality. That could give on another visual feeling when you look at/play the game and getting inspired by games in which UI suits better to a story telling RP game seems a good compromise to me (i.e the old BG but also PoE, P:K and other more modern game...)

This was for the feelings that give the UI when you look at the game but there are many other exemple of (TB) games that needs nearly the same informations on the screen and have something really lighter, really less mmorpg and really more personnal.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 09/09/20 03:39 PM.
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