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I would not say the indications are that Larian *isn't* listening, but rather, we can't be *sure* if they *are* listening...

To Larian moderators & developers,

In the vein of this thread, it would be helpful if you included in your patch notes, "We have heard a lot of what you said regarding X (pick your big topic - 5e rules, ground effects, etc.), and we are evaluating how best to adjust the game as progress develops."

Or

Be straight up in the other direction: "We have heard a lot about what you said regarding X, and we feel we are on track and will continue with XYZ in this regard even though it disagrees with 5e PnP mechanics."

Or

Hey, "We heard what you said about XYZ, and we are implementing fixes that will hopefully blend the 5e mechanics with other cRPG philosophies we believe will benefit the game and community..."

Or

There's a hundred variations...I'm just saying: Give us something to indicate where you're headed in response to the gross amount of feedback in this forum. Very few care about cinematic imperfections at this point -- we know its early access and frankly we want to hear more about how you are handling the finished product with regard to rules & gameplay issues we have brought up versus cinematic imperfections.

$.02

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Larian has serious structural issues where it comes to community management. When it comes to communicating with your community I think no one does it better than people working on Path of Exile or Space engineers.

1)In case of path of exile they have their patch notes and updates and on the other hand you have a community manager keeping an eye on the forums, being part of the discussion and passing some of the more important feedback to dev's. You know she will read your bs. She will answer. And if it's not bs but actually structured feedback you will hear what the dev team thought about your " idea". A very successful game.

2)In the case of space engineers, they literally had weekly feedback during EA all the way up to the release. The game itself turned out to be a Frankenstein but the communication was there and was visible. They also had a community manager and his entire work was about being a forum dweller and communicating with the devs + creating the weekly updates. Without it space engineers wouldn't be a nice (failed) idea . It would have been considered as thievery.

3)Path of exile is free to play and space engineers was an EA sold for 10 EUR.

Compare that to BG3. We have patch notes.


I jumped into BG3 EA out of curiosity but also because I hoped for a two way communication. We have a one way communication right now.

But effectively there's no answer regarding the forum feedback. I have no doubt there's a guy at Larian who's going through everything in here trying to create some kind of feedback list for devs. He probably wants to eat his keyboard reading all of the above btw. But this same person should be given time to interact with people from the forums. The same people who just want to stay in touch with a company they entrusted their money for what seems to be less than 20% of the game.

The money you pay for EA is obviously a help for the DEV based on trust but you need to upkeep that trust. With the quality of the product + communication.
For now we have quality (with some flaws) but no communication. I want both cookies.


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Originally Posted by The Composer
The first few weeks have dominantly been about working to make sure that blockers are fixed first (crashes, saves corrupting or being unable to load, bugs that severely cripples some players' ability to play the game).

I suppose it's also important to point out that while Larian is a big group of people now, not all of them are working on Early Access. One portion works on maintenance, polish and implementing content to EA, while the rest works on actually finishing up the game. And not all of them are involved in writing community updates. In fact you'd count that on less than a hand. Then there's the nuance of corporation and communications, further complicated by Covid and different people working from home, all over the world.

So while processing feedback is fairly easy, I've collected about 80 pages from Discord and the feedback form from the game launcher has seen pages upon pages of feedback as well - Processing that, forwarding it and going through internal discussions, decisions, and then starting to map out what you may start talking about, is not something that's done in a week.

There's a lot more nuance to it than that, but I've tried my best to simplify the gist of it down to a few lines.

What I can tell you though, is that -so much feedback- have gone through the gates, that not only will just reading through it take time, but discussing it would take significantly longer. And only then can you start deciding on additions/changes - At least of what is based on player feedback.

Hopefully my ramblings are found worthwhile at least to some 🙈

Thank you for this post. I think a lot of us were looking for this type of comment from the Community Update and were disappointed when there wasn't one.

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Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Riandor
Well Orbax if you feel that way, I’m not here to tell you you’re wrong. I mean my understanding of EA was to help out financially, get a shot at playing early and provide some feedback.

I don’t remember being promised anything in particular, but Larian did say multiple times they would gather and listen. The fact that no big announcement on issues has been made either way simply suggests to me they aren’t ready to discuss those items with us yet.

We’ve had some bug fixes, nothing else... Larian haven’t even added OR DISCUSSED the changes and additions we know will come (classes etc...), should we question those now too because they weren’t in either update?

Let’s not get our knickers in a twist eh?! I’ve worked in oft ware development, I’ve seen nothing to make me concerned in any of their commutations “so far”.


I'm a Technical Solutions Architect that for almost two decades has done nothing but develop, deploy, and support enterprise applications for companies in the billions for annual rev. I do a heck of a lot better than these guys walking people through this stuff. Its a simple tactic - communicate a bunch so people don't ask you questions and repeat known issues. If users know what is up, the channel quiets down to new issues and everyone has more time to find and focus on the high priority issues. The level of effort is so low - that is what is blowing my mind. Can anyone say what this will look like in 2 weeks? 1? Thats crazy. Im at 250 hours into this right now, so it isn't like im flipping them the bird, but my submission rate has dropped to a tenth of the previous rate. If they care they can ask about something. The throw sht against the wall and see what sticks attitude isn't that much fun, ill just play the game and hope their in-game engine is giving them something useful as that is the only thing they are really acknowledging right now.



You can't really compare us, the forumites, to clients such as that honestly it's a different scale and expectations are different. For starters, if you work in enterprise your team definitely has signed some legal paperwork that binds you to respond in certain ways. Also, it's quite often that you're dealing with developer-to-developer or if you're consulting and building an in house solution you're still somewhat part of that process. In other words, expectations are set.

Here it is definitely not the case; we don't know whether or not we're the core demographic or just a small salty bunch with even saltier people in between. There's also no modicum of professionalism between us and the devs; a lot of the negative users here are consistently terrible towards the devs. What incentive would they have to placate those people let alone the rest of us who have zero trustworthiness? It's why A LOT of studios simply have their devs behind a wall because the abuse they face is pretty depressing. Again, this doesn't apply to the enterprise world because lol HR and also lol business ramifications.

You're also giving quality feedback through your game play assuming they bad touched everything with analytics, your actual feedback is shit at the end of the day compared to your actual behaviors in game. The best thing you can do is whenever they do release new content is to play it repeatedly and add more data points.

So, sure, they could talk but what's the point when the energy is generally going to be trending towards the negative. They have their data and the feedback they deem necessary and will address it in time, hopefully to your liking.

I believe the silent majority is what Larian is targeting at the end of the day, the forums are just for shits and giggles and occasionally useful as a tool to get feedback that might have been missed.

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Originally Posted by virion
Larian has serious structural issues where it comes to community management. When it comes to communicating with your community I think no one does it better than people working on Path of Exile or Space engineers.

1)In case of path of exile they have their patch notes and updates and on the other hand you have a community manager keeping an eye on the forums, being part of the discussion and passing some of the more important feedback to dev's. You know she will read your bs. She will answer. And if it's not bs but actually structured feedback you will hear what the dev team thought about your " idea". A very successful game.



PoE Devs constantly get shit on and you heard how some of them break down and cry due to the criticism they receive. Also, look at how every league the complaints are the same even though they're pretty much not a vocal issue amongst the majority of players.

So, what you want might not be for the best either for their sanity. But as the Composer alluded to and what you suspected is that there is someone at the other end having to sort through all the stuff to make sense of it.

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Originally Posted by mrfuji3

Thank you for this post. I think a lot of us were looking for this type of comment from the Community Update and were disappointed when there wasn't one.

Meh, sort of.
I appreciate that he took the time to write that reply, but without any pretense to speak for everyone else I should probably make it clear that on a personal note I'm not looking for being patted on the head.
What I'd like from Larian is more along the lines of telling us what they are taking away from the feedback. What they are planning to do about it.

"We are listening" should be more a prerequisite than an answer.

Last edited by Tuco; 28/10/20 01:28 AM.

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Originally Posted by Limz

PoE Devs constantly get shit on and you heard how some of them break down and cry due to the criticism they receive. Also, look at how every league the complaints are the same even though they're pretty much not a vocal issue amongst the majority of players.

So, what you want might not be for the best either for their sanity. But as the Composer alluded to and what you suspected is that there is someone at the other end having to sort through all the stuff to make sense of it.



You get used to it : D tech is a rough biz. They just need to watch this a few times https://youtu.be/r6Lf8GtMe4M


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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Originally Posted by Limz
Originally Posted by virion
Larian has serious structural issues where it comes to community management. When it comes to communicating with your community I think no one does it better than people working on Path of Exile or Space engineers.

1)In case of path of exile they have their patch notes and updates and on the other hand you have a community manager keeping an eye on the forums, being part of the discussion and passing some of the more important feedback to dev's. You know she will read your bs. She will answer. And if it's not bs but actually structured feedback you will hear what the dev team thought about your " idea". A very successful game.



PoE Devs constantly get shit on and you heard how some of them break down and cry due to the criticism they receive. Also, look at how every league the complaints are the same even though they're pretty much not a vocal issue amongst the majority of players.

So, what you want might not be for the best either for their sanity. But as the Composer alluded to and what you suspected is that there is someone at the other end having to sort through all the stuff to make sense of it.




I mean yes they get shit on due to their decisions BUT bex is staying in touch with reddit. The problems with the shitstorm around GGG was the understanding of " less is more" . After this league they finally understood what this means xD. But now imagine if Bex wasn't here. If the ONLY answer were GGG patchnotes.


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Originally Posted by Tuco
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
Thank you for this post. I think a lot of us were looking for this type of comment from the Community Update and were disappointed when there wasn't one.

Meh, sort of.
I appreciate that he took the time to write that reply, but without any pretense to speak for everyone else I should probably make it clear that on a personal note I'm not looking for being patted on the head.
What I'd like from Larian is more along the lines of telling us what they are taking away from the feedback. What they are planning to do about it.

"We are listening" should be more a prerequisite than an answer.

I didn't say this was a sufficient response. Especially since there were no specifics in that post. But it's more than we got from the Community Update

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Originally Posted by virion
Originally Posted by Limz
Originally Posted by virion
Larian has serious structural issues where it comes to community management. When it comes to communicating with your community I think no one does it better than people working on Path of Exile or Space engineers.

1)In case of path of exile they have their patch notes and updates and on the other hand you have a community manager keeping an eye on the forums, being part of the discussion and passing some of the more important feedback to dev's. You know she will read your bs. She will answer. And if it's not bs but actually structured feedback you will hear what the dev team thought about your " idea". A very successful game.



PoE Devs constantly get shit on and you heard how some of them break down and cry due to the criticism they receive. Also, look at how every league the complaints are the same even though they're pretty much not a vocal issue amongst the majority of players.

So, what you want might not be for the best either for their sanity. But as the Composer alluded to and what you suspected is that there is someone at the other end having to sort through all the stuff to make sense of it.




I mean yes they get shit on due to their decisions BUT bex is staying in touch with reddit. The problems with the shitstorm around GGG was the understanding of " less is more" . After this league they finally understood what this means xD. But now imagine if Bex wasn't here. If the ONLY answer were GGG patchnotes.



If you look at what Chris Wilson said they're changing their process and fighting against scope creep but their iteration time remains the same. However, that does not mean they won't try new ideas like Synthesis, Betrayal, Blight, etc which also received a ton of complaints. It's not simply "less is more" some players really just want to map and play iterations of Breach, other players want something else.

But sure, I can imagine if Bex wasn't there because I rarely look at her posts and her posts are only once every 3-4 days depending on the context.

My point is that no dev really wants to bother with the most ungrateful shits that comprise of the vocal community. They obviously didn't bother in DOS2 and it sold fine.

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Originally Posted by The Composer
The first few weeks have dominantly been about working to make sure that blockers are fixed first (crashes, saves corrupting or being unable to load, bugs that severely cripples some players' ability to play the game).

I suppose it's also important to point out that while Larian is a big group of people now, not all of them are working on Early Access. One portion works on maintenance, polish and implementing content to EA, while the rest works on actually finishing up the game. And not all of them are involved in writing community updates. In fact you'd count that on less than a hand. Then there's the nuance of corporation and communications, further complicated by Covid and different people working from home, all over the world.

So while processing feedback is fairly easy, I've collected about 80 pages from Discord and the feedback form from the game launcher has seen pages upon pages of feedback as well - Processing that, forwarding it and going through internal discussions, decisions, and then starting to map out what you may start talking about, is not something that's done in a week.

There's a lot more nuance to it than that, but I've tried my best to simplify the gist of it down to a few lines.

What I can tell you though, is that -so much feedback- have gone through the gates, that not only will just reading through it take time, but discussing it would take significantly longer. And only then can you start deciding on additions/changes - At least of what is based on player feedback.

Hopefully my ramblings are found worthwhile at least to some 🙈


They are worthwhile mate. You just need more little imps to help you with it. It's visible from a mile that there's one guy taking care of it. I used to work for a bank. The kind of boring one and the kind of no one heard of. They are everywhere but they are well hidden in the financial structures of this world. We had 5 people working in community relations department. Most of the time they were doing things totally not related to managing community cause a bank community is not exactly as active as a video game forum smile. Still, worst case scenario they could be assigned at any time to deal with a lot of incoming messages from forums, Facebook, Twitter , etc.

So it's more a question of Larian philosophy than anything else. Do you need to have a dedicated team only for this? Eeeeh....probably not. Your company won't cease to exist. Is it safer to avoid this kind of thread on the forum? Yes. On the internet, it doesn't matter what's true or not. What matters is the title of threads on forums and who screams louder. In the end, it's a question of company philosophy and policy.


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Originally Posted by Limz

My point is that no dev really wants to bother with the most ungrateful shits that comprise of the vocal community. They obviously didn't bother in DOS2 and it sold fine.


Any dev worth their salt wants to hear all of the opinions. You can get really good ideas even reading the most vitriolic crap. Source 25+ years in I.T., 20 doing development and architecture. If reading mean things makes you sad don't make things that humans interface with, they're all little animals and the nice ones will turn vicious as fast as anyone when it doesn't go their way. Go watch how Jobs treated people at Apple, Bill Gates was a tyrant. You either have vision like they did and its just as miserable or you want the community to help. Star Citizen has its poison too, but I havent paid attention to it in like a year and a half and I still et emails like twice a week from them about all their stuff. I'd say they have a pretty aggressive goal too.

The point is simple: Its possible, its relatively easy. Pretty low odds that I could walk into their offices for a week and walk out saying "Yep. Its impossible to meet their goals and have any kind of interaction with the community. Whoa!"

The fact is they are doing exactly what they want to be doing, and it doesn't involve the community. It wouldn't be an issue if they had made their process and goals clear. The forums would be empty except for a hopeful few and the rest would play the game, beat it, wait for the next patch, and probably play it again.Stop if they aren't having fun anymore. Quiet, simple, we are in accord. Could have been a brothel, we paid our money, got what we wanted no frills, and we go home. Right now, it was implied we'd be getting coffee back at their place and they said "thanks for the ride, I didn't have any change" and patted the taxi off to take you home when you got 3 blocks away from their apartment. If I knew that would have happened I'd have gone to a brothel :p


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Limz

My point is that no dev really wants to bother with the most ungrateful shits that comprise of the vocal community. They obviously didn't bother in DOS2 and it sold fine.


Any dev worth their salt wants to hear all of the opinions. You can get really good ideas even reading the most vitriolic crap. Source 25+ years in I.T., 20 doing development and architecture. If reading mean things makes you sad don't make things that humans interface with, they're all little animals and the nice ones will turn vicious as fast as anyone when it doesn't go their way. Go watch how Jobs treated people at Apple, Bill Gates was a tyrant. You either have vision like they did and its just as miserable or you want the community to help. Star Citizen has its poison too, but I havent paid attention to it in like a year and a half and I still et emails like twice a week from them about all their stuff. I'd say they have a pretty aggressive goal too.

The point is simple: Its possible, its relatively easy. Pretty low odds that I could walk into their offices for a week and walk out saying "Yep. Its impossible to meet their goals and have any kind of interaction with the community. Whoa!"

The fact is they are doing exactly what they want to be doing, and it doesn't involve the community. It wouldn't be an issue if they had made their process and goals clear. The forums would be empty except for a hopeful few and the rest would play the game, beat it, wait for the next patch, and probably play it again.Stop if they aren't having fun anymore. Quiet, simple, we are in accord. Could have been a brothel, we paid our money, got what we wanted no frills, and we go home. Right now, it was implied we'd be getting coffee back at their place and they said "thanks for the ride, I didn't have any change" and patted the taxi off to take you home when you got 3 blocks away from their apartment. If I knew that would have happened I'd have gone to a brothel :p


Orbax : thx for the insight based on experience. Always cool to hear how it might look after years of dealing with this kind of subject form the other side ^^.
Limz : They sold more copies than they expected day one. Such a huge success comes in the end from the games they make. The feedback everyone hears, the one that impacts the sales is based on the majority of those who bought the game. You are right.

Now you have the fact this thread exists. Is it cool for Larian to have it on the forum? Eeeh..not really. Is it avoidable at relatively low cost? Also. Is it impossible to reach successful sales without avoiding it? Absolutely not. But over time the reputation of Larian's EA (and only EA) might be kinda " meeh". It won't be a problem on the short term but on the long run if you can avoid it why not do it?

The thing is most of the things you do to interact with your community are straight pointless when it comes to the goal you're working on. Apart from managing your community "sanity". ^^


Last edited by virion; 28/10/20 02:19 AM.

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Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Limz

My point is that no dev really wants to bother with the most ungrateful shits that comprise of the vocal community. They obviously didn't bother in DOS2 and it sold fine.


Any dev worth their salt wants to hear all of the opinions. You can get really good ideas even reading the most vitriolic crap. Source 25+ years in I.T., 20 doing development and architecture. If reading mean things makes you sad don't make things that humans interface with, they're all little animals and the nice ones will turn vicious as fast as anyone when it doesn't go their way. Go watch how Jobs treated people at Apple, Bill Gates was a tyrant. You either have vision like they did and its just as miserable or you want the community to help. Star Citizen has its poison too, but I havent paid attention to it in like a year and a half and I still et emails like twice a week from them about all their stuff. I'd say they have a pretty aggressive goal too.

The point is simple: Its possible, its relatively easy. Pretty low odds that I could walk into their offices for a week and walk out saying "Yep. Its impossible to meet their goals and have any kind of interaction with the community. Whoa!"

The fact is they are doing exactly what they want to be doing, and it doesn't involve the community. It wouldn't be an issue if they had made their process and goals clear. The forums would be empty except for a hopeful few and the rest would play the game, beat it, wait for the next patch, and probably play it again.Stop if they aren't having fun anymore. Quiet, simple, we are in accord. Could have been a brothel, we paid our money, got what we wanted no frills, and we go home. Right now, it was implied we'd be getting coffee back at their place and they said "thanks for the ride, I didn't have any change" and patted the taxi off to take you home when you got 3 blocks away from their apartment. If I knew that would have happened I'd have gone to a brothel :p



Its a hair different for me. I dont typically use forums as they are clumsy and difficult to organize. Lets not forget that a lot of this concern stems from simply the Title.

We have a generation of gamers that went from "for their times." epic RPGs like NWN made by relatively small companies that took a lot more time to develope games to industry giants like EA (Electronic Arts) buying successful names and systemically raping them for every penny they could pinch from them.

Its been a successful model; and a mostly dissapointing one at that. I dont typically buy early access either but i was hoping this would be a labor of love considering Larians background and the fact that other than WoTC they dont answer to any publishers. Im not attempting to put them in the same bucked as bioware or anything - i'm just saying the community has caught on and most of them are tired of the same old promise of nastalgia only to be greeted with a few pretty cinematics, some good graphics, and shit writing/gameplay so to that end EA for me was me trying to do my part and avoid that outcome.

If thats not what this particular EA was for then okay, my mistake. $60 wasted wont do it again. Itll be the last penny i toss at Larian though.

Last edited by Tethtoril; 28/10/20 02:59 AM.
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Originally Posted by Orbax

Any dev worth their salt wants to hear all of the opinions. You can get really good ideas even reading the most vitriolic crap. Source 25+ years in I.T., 20 doing development and architecture. If reading mean things makes you sad don't make things that humans interface with, they're all little animals and the nice ones will turn vicious as fast as anyone when it doesn't go their way.


You want to hear opinions that matters to your particular context - qualified and quantified, the rest can be lumped together (and that's not exactly hearing all of them) - you also have a time frame for it too. Otherwise your feedback would never end nor would your meetings nor your contract which might be good in some cases, but you would also never get a product out.

You can also get really good ideas without going through that shit and you can always hire someone else or have a machine parse through it without ever having to respond to it directly either. How many times does an AT&T engineer actually bother responding to a customer? You either get an automated message or you get a low level rep - not a dev. You would be lucky (or unlucky) to have a dev directly interact with you, otherwise the best you can hope for is that your complaint makes its way through their intake and ends up as a JIRA ticket. That's pretty much the experience of most people and somehow I don't think you're asking for an automated reply. Also, go ahead and look at the github issues opened on say Sendgrid and tell me how many of those complaints say "You guys are so fucking stupid you have no idea what you're doing". Pretty much none.

You're also conflating good development to having to directly read and respond to things; you have CM for that and barring that it isn't a given that you need to write a reply. Most of the time it isn't your job as you're better off coding rather than get involved in arguing with the endless wave.

Most development companies are not what you describe - I've jumped around a few Y Combinator start ups and I do currently work at a Fortune 500 company as a lead developer.

Originally Posted by Orbax

The point is simple: Its possible, its relatively easy. Pretty low odds that I could walk into their offices for a week and walk out saying "Yep. Its impossible to meet their goals and have any kind of interaction with the community. Whoa!"


And the point is it's also simple to read and move on. What isn't simple is having to craft a reply and have it vetted by PR, legal, and what other forces are at play.

I mean what's more simple? Reading and responding or reading?

At the end of the day you aren't entitled to a response. You're entitled to a product that is described on the store page but that's about it.

Originally Posted by Orbax

The fact is they are doing exactly what they want to be doing, and it doesn't involve the community. It wouldn't be an issue if they had made their process and goals clear.


Depends on your definition of involving the community considering that the only way to get the data that they have is for the community to play it and as others have alluded they are taking feedback, but they aren't required to respond directly either. Also, the EA period isn't over so there's plenty of time for them to open up (or not). At the end of the day, they don't need to make their processes or goals clear beyond setting basic expectations and you may have overreached with yours. Would it be better if they did? Maybe. But looking at how DOS2 went and how it sold, I don't think there is a compelling argument that they should change their process viewing it externally.

And here's the funny thing...

Originally Posted by Orbax

The forums would be empty except for a hopeful few and the rest would play the game, beat it, wait for the next patch, and probably play it again.Stop if they aren't having fun anymore. Quiet, simple, we are in accord


This is pretty much what is happening now. All this outrage is pretty much a minority much like the 5e purists.

Also, if you are what you say you are, you earn enough money to do both. In a matter of fact, why not play BG3 while at a brothel.

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Originally Posted by virion


Orbax : thx for the insight based on experience. Always cool to hear how it might look after years of dealing with this kind of subject form the other side ^^.
Limz : They sold more copies than they expected day one. Such a huge success comes in the end from the games they make. The feedback everyone hears, the one that impacts the sales is based on the majority of those who bought the game. You are right.

Now you have the fact this thread exists. Is it cool for Larian to have it on the forum? Eeeh..not really. Is it avoidable at relatively low cost? Also. Is it impossible to reach successful sales without avoiding it? Absolutely not. But over time the reputation of Larian's EA (and only EA) might be kinda " meeh". It won't be a problem on the short term but on the long run if you can avoid it why not do it?

The thing is most of the things you do to interact with your community are straight pointless when it comes to the goal you're working on. Apart from managing your community "sanity". ^^



Here's another outcome. They release a content patch that seems to address whatever shortcomings but they never say anything but a cutesy phrase. Instead they might say, "We released a bunch of new stuff and changed some stuff. We're hoping for people to play X Y Z! Did you know a bunch of people did B thing? Wow. " rather than say "We looked at the feedback, felt that it was not right and made some changes because it wasn't in our vision".

They also just release patch notes and have a content and it would be enough for many people here.

Based on how DOS2 went, I don't think they respond through words but by action.

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Originally Posted by Limz


Also, if you are what you say you are, you earn enough money to do both. In a matter of fact, why not play BG3 while at a brothel.



Amsterdam has spotty internet, I have to have priorities smirk


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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Originally Posted by Orbax
Originally Posted by Limz


Also, if you are what you say you are, you earn enough money to do both. In a matter of fact, why not play BG3 while at a brothel.



Amsterdam has spotty internet, I have to have priorities smirk


You said they should collect every opinion. So now we need the opinion of an Amsterdam sex worker + Orbax co-op BG3.

You do want to help give Larian as much feedback as possible right?

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Originally Posted by Limz
Originally Posted by virion


Orbax : thx for the insight based on experience. Always cool to hear how it might look after years of dealing with this kind of subject form the other side ^^.
Limz : They sold more copies than they expected day one. Such a huge success comes in the end from the games they make. The feedback everyone hears, the one that impacts the sales is based on the majority of those who bought the game. You are right.

Now you have the fact this thread exists. Is it cool for Larian to have it on the forum? Eeeh..not really. Is it avoidable at relatively low cost? Also. Is it impossible to reach successful sales without avoiding it? Absolutely not. But over time the reputation of Larian's EA (and only EA) might be kinda " meeh". It won't be a problem on the short term but on the long run if you can avoid it why not do it?

The thing is most of the things you do to interact with your community are straight pointless when it comes to the goal you're working on. Apart from managing your community "sanity". ^^



Here's another outcome. They release a content patch that seems to address whatever shortcomings but they never say anything but a cutesy phrase. Instead they might say, "We released a bunch of new stuff and changed some stuff. We're hoping for people to play X Y Z! Did you know a bunch of people did B thing? Wow. " rather than say "We looked at the feedback, felt that it was not right and made some changes because it wasn't in our vision".

They also just release patch notes and have a content and it would be enough for many people here.

Based on how DOS2 went, I don't think they respond through words but by action.




Responding by actions won't solve the fact this kind of topics might appear. That's my point. Like if you think about it there's really 0 issues right now with BG3. It was released not long ago, they already had 3 patches. They went quiet for some time and it seems obvious they are busy. It' s obvious sooner or later they will address some of the issues raised by people from EA, they literally asked for it. But by then some people will already start to talk bs. Matter of choice if you care about those people or not. It's not a cataclysm either :p


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Originally Posted by Limz

So now we need the opinion of an Amsterdam sex worker + Orbax co-op BG3.



The internet the way it is, that would probably pay a hell of a lot more than what I make lol. Oh, to be young again


What is the problem you are solving? Does your proposed change solve the problem? Is your change feasible? What else will be affected by your change? Will your change impact revenue? Does your change align with the goals and strategies of the organizations (Larian, WotC)?
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