Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - Suggestions & Feedback The Stationary Camp Has to Go

I am generally for player convenience - with Larian's large singular area I think they need some form of fast travel. Just recent I wished Disco Elysium has some feature as soon as the map opened up. I am not sure, however, if I like the rune thing - it doesn't seem to fit.

Camp even more so - resting is same generic area, no matter where your party is, is jarring. I agree with OP that something like Kingmaker would be great, but I am not sure of devs want that - they want their camp to be more then just a sleeping place.

What I would suggest is something similar to diablo. Camp IS set in a certain area, and we need to use magic consumable items to get back. It could also be used to limit amount of resting available when adventuring (ala PoE1&2). Camp would be act specific and would makes sense - followers and spare companions wait there. Back to camp teleport would work both ways - you go to camp, and then teleport back to where you came from. Ideally, camp would be a spot on actual map - rather then existing in its own plane.

As to world quick travel - something needs to be there, but I would prefer something more relatable then runes.

I'm so tempted to change the subject to "stationery camp". All those inkpots and quills need a place to go.

I collected every quill in the game. I kind of wanted to make a video where I went around killing things with thrown quills, calling myself the Scribe of Death, and proclaiming that the pen is mightier than the sword.

Hopefully this camp concept is only used in EA and completely reworked later. It's much too convenient and unimmersive as it is, but imagine teleporting back and forth from where you go at the end of EA.

Why aren't they using the Druid Grove as the first "hub" or safe haven? It already is the town or inn equivalent in that area. That would also involve the party much more in the whole situation with the Druids and the Tieflings.

There's also another abandoned camp site that could serve for a long rest in the wilderness.

I don't understand why the pocket universe camp is needed. Localized long rests would be much more immersive and in the spirit of D&D adventuring. The feeling of safety knowing you can always teleport to a pocket dimension camp with the press of a button and regain all HP and abilities has to go. Resource management also needs to be a factor in a D&D game. D&D is not a system where you face every encounter at full health and resources.

The more I think about it, the more I feel like the whole "no instanced camp/better rest system" topic ties extremely tightly with the one about having a day/night cycle.
They are arguably two faces of the same coin, in fact, and you have to go out of your way (like Larian is currently doing) to MAKE them entirely separate mechanics and themes.

I don't believe this game engine supports a day night cycle. As far as I can tell, outside camp it is always daytime, always noon. I'm pretty sure there are 2 versions of camp. A night-time version that you visit when you long-rest and a daytime version that you visit if you choose to travel to camp without hitting the long rest button. That is the issue with allowing them to sleep anywhere. I think it is a game engine limitation issue. I also understand why they did it. They wanted the scenes to be able to make use of props within the environment. Something you can't depend on if you allow them to happen anywhere. But I also agree that camp should evolve. Preferably a new camp for each ACT/ CHAPTER. Once you get to BG, it makes no sense to sleep in the woods when there is a Inn nearby.

Immersion wise, I think the fix would be simple: Put a limit into the game which only allows you to fast travel/long rest when you are within 20 ft of a rune. IE: Right now, we can hit M at any time and fast travel. That should be disabled. The fast travel map should require that you click on a rune or be within 20 ft of a rune for the travel options to appear. And Long Rest should be disabled as well unless all party members are within proximity/sight of a rune.

In the druid grove, if things play out a certain way, the game tries to trap you in a room with Nettie. When it does that, it disables the fast travel. I need to replay that section to see if it also disabled the long-rest button. Basically, I think that should be the default behavior of the game except when you are within proximity of runes. That would strike a balance between convenience and immersion IMO. Who knows, maybe this is what they already plan on doing.

I'm genuinely not sure why regardless of the topic (controls, lighting, UI/inventory, etc) some of you people keep attributing completely arbitrary limitations to the engine that make hardly any sense from a technical standpoint.

Even assuming that dynamic light changes would be out of the current technical possibilities (which I'm very doubtful of) a day/night cycle in this type of game could easily be a very basic, binary thing where you just swap the "day map" with the "night version" with a short loading screen in the middle.
Which incidentally is exactly what BG1 and 2 did.

Then again, this is all stuff we already discussed in the dedicated thread: https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=683934#Post683934

I kinda created a backstory thing regarding this. I play a wizard mainly. Dudes mentor gave him a special gift of an amulet that allows them to teleport to a safe area (think of it as a version of the druid of circle of dreams, hearth of moonlight and shadow ability, or mordenkainen's magnificent mansion spell), where enemies cannot find them, but are safe in a pocket dimension. Characters in this dimension can see and hear what the rest of the party is experiencing, hence the approval/disapproval ratings of the characters that aren't with you. Not really far fetched, if you think about it, and makes some good RPing. Just my way of doing it.

As far as the fast travel runes, I don't really have a problem with them. I think having a day/night cycle would be cool, and then you can implement the off screen fast travel like BG1 and 2. But again, that would take much more programming. Would help with the rogue's hide ability though.

No, it really wouldn't? it would be as basic as it gets in terms of scripting.

What would would imply, on the other hand, is a different area design from what we have currently here.
"World map fast travel" would suggest that we move physically between smaller areas in the world map, with the good old dotted line marking our path etc.

Now the question is: are we ACTUALLY going to get smaller areas and world map movement? Or every "chapter" in the game is going to be a big seamless area like this starting one and no world map movement will ever be required?

Agreed.

The problem is they made a fast travel system that is actually explained in the game by magic teleporting runes.

It would be better not to explain anything. Just change location. Or I would prefer quickly moving a party icon on a map. So that the player can assume they are traveling normally off screen.

It hurts immersion when a player convenience feature is forcefully explained by an actual magical teleport system. Why in the nine hells do you NEED teleport runes in a normal forest??? Why aren't the enemies using these runes to ambush you? Why aren't hook horrors and Duergar coming up from the underdark since it's so easy?

This feature is so clearly made for the player and not for anything actually living in Faerun. It breaks the fourth wall.

I think that I just had a really good idea what if you can clear different resting places out and making them your camp for the time being like the toll house when you fight Anders and his team you can set up beds and all kinds of things there and loot just like a D&D adventure reminds me of the system that state of decay had

I agree with this. The teleport runes seem too convenient, and yet not apparently used by anyone except for our party members?

I mean if teleport stones were a thing in the FR they wouldn't need roads.

Pete - Hey Jo do you feel like walking to Baulders gate it's only 10 days walk?
Jo - Narrr i'll just teleport via the rune over there and avoid all the bugbears, Drow raiders, undead and other nasties along the road.
Pete - Okay lets do that, I forgot for the past 47 years of D&D we had to physically walk places until recently. For some reason we can just appear where ever the hell we want now which is great.
Jo - I know right? why didn't someone think of these convenient warp all over the joint runes before now?
Pete - I don't know mate, maybe just like all the food all over the place with absoluely no reason to eat it.
Jo - Not true Pete, I ate an apple yesterday and my leg grew back.
Pete - Oh yeah I just noticed you had a new leg, an apple you say? Was it magic or something?
Jo - Narr just an apple I found in a barrel.

Haha, that would be awesome.

I almost want to do that with chests, crates, and barrels. Collect them all and throw them to make my kills.

My five coins on the runes: we can use them only after we find them. Seems it has some kind of authorisation process. And that pretty much closes all the questions about why enemies do not use them.
And the runes are not in the middle of a forest. We are not in the middle of a forest in the first act. Don't let the druid grove to fool you into mistaking the place for a forest. We are on a beach with the druid grove, 2 abandoned temples (one more like monastery), 1 village, 1 inn, 1 teahouse and 1 outpost nearby. If it isn't now, it was before highly populated with sapient humanoids area. And nearly each one of those runes placed near some "populated locality".
On the main topic. I wrote in my suggestions before and I'll repeat: the camp needs to get some more solid connection to the rest of the world like Larian did in their previous games. Preferably with addition of day/night cycle, which actually can make it easier to drag players in their camp. And that's enough without throwing the camp out of a window for no good reason.

+1 to OP. Another very unimmersive feature of the game.

I think they best solution might be a few camp locations scattered across that map that you actually have to discover and travel back to in order to use.

As others have said, most content in camps is the normal conversation cutscenes, which wouldn't need any extra work.

Not sure how they would manage the bounds of your camp if they were in specific locations around the map, though...

I hate the idea that once we arrive in Baldur's Gate, when we hit the Long Rest button we will just teleport to an Inn and not actually have to move through the city to find an Inn to rest.

The Fast Travel system needs reworking too. I'd much rather we had to be within range of a rune to actually fast travel. Much more immersive.

+1
I'd much prefer if fast travel was just allowed for notable locations we've visited, and it was assumed that our characters actually walked there. Show a little animation of us walking across the map while "fast traveling" (e.g., DAO) while the area loads. Perfect!

I like how we, as 1st level characters, can use what is basically D&D's 5th level spell "Teleportation Circle" but enemies/NPCs (Minthara is 5th level and also has a tadpole, so it can't just be explained as "tadpole magic") cannot.

Also, please allow us to fast travel directly inside the Grove. Either to the tiefling section or the druid ritual site.

As if I didnt already enjoy your posts..this one is gold.

On subject: Seems to me the fixed camp and ability to long rest are two different issues that get conflated. I have no problem with the 1st and hope the 2nd is part of a difficulty system.

Someone has to make a mod for that!

I could see the camp spot maybe changing in different major areas? Like this is the camp in the prologue area, maybe all of these things are relatively close, but you have another camp when you get towards Baldurs gate, etc.... Or getting the opportunity to create temporary camps because the main camp is a multi day journey away, but still having the main camp available if you want to go "home" or even that, the opportunity to purchase a building later and make that "camp" but again, long journey, so you may choose to travel all the way back there or you may make a temporary camp.