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Dude, stop using pseudo-science to try and justify not being inclusive, it just makes you look bad.

If elves were portrayed accurately they would not look like humans, but they do, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that, the problem is that they only look like certain types of humans, and there are people who want to identify themselves with their character no matter what race they choose.

This has nothing to do with politics, it's about not excluding people. Ask yourself, what the hell do you lose by letting other people have character options that represent their real life? You lose absolutely nothing except your oh so precious immersion, and to be honest, not even that, it's not like you'll be forced to play as a black woman or something. Trying to prevent other people from having fun with a game when you don't really lose anything by doing it just makes you an asshole.

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Originally Posted by VehementHalo


This has nothing to do with politics


Oh give me a break. Please stop trying to get your way by using real life political issues, it's tiresome and it's wrong.

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Originally Posted by Lethan
I just want my Elves to look like Elves.

Not a Critique of LOTR, but those ... those aren't really Elves in my books. Sure, best examples around and are the 'parents' of the DnD type. But I'd like my pointier, slender, alien Elves please.

Also, what's with Lolth and non-Lolth Elves having different face presets? Fix that!


The point is that fantasy since Jules Verne was always about discussing different cultures, species, other worlds. Their advantages and drawbacks, their pitfalls and conflicts. The worst thing that can happen to such fantasy stories, movies or books is people who simply do not want to depict any differences, because then people have no reason playing the game.

Take Drow and Elves - they are so interesting because they have a completely different culture. Elves are long lived and have an entirely different society and view on life than humans. Drow are evil and cruel and have an entire society focused on war and strife.

And now imagine someone comes along who doesn't like the depiction of such different cultures or species. Who want his Elves to be humans with pointed ears. Who can't stand Drow being depicted as evil because they have a dark skin color. And who changes Drow into being largely good and Elves into being just humans with pointed ears.

In the end, they are all just boring and the same. Exactly because there is no difference between them. Ideology is one of the worst enemies of a good game.

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Originally Posted by Arne


The point is that fantasy since Jules Verne was always about discussing different cultures, species, other worlds. Their advantages and drawbacks, their pitfalls and conflicts. The worst thing that can happen to such fantasy stories, movies or books is people who simply do not want to depict any differences, because then people have no reason playing the game.

Take Drow and Elves - they are so interesting because they have a completely different culture. Elves are long lived and have an entirely different society and view on life than humans. Drow are evil and cruel and have an entire society focused on war and strife.

And now imagine someone comes along who doesn't like the depiction of such different cultures or species. Who want his Elves to be humans with pointed ears. Who can't stand Drow being depicted as evil because they have a dark skin color. And who changes Drow into being largely good and Elves into being just humans with pointed ears.

In the end, they are all just boring and the same. Exactly because there is no difference between them. Ideology is one of the worst enemies of a good game.

Hear hear!

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Originally Posted by firebird71
I believe that elves should look more otherworldly, as several people here have argued as well. It would also provide the option OP wants in the form of Wild Elves and Wood Elves. However, if Larian really does want to make elves nothing but "humans but with cool pointy ears" then there really is no reason not to add diverse facial types. Though, as unrealistic as it is, I would prefer BG3 Elves to be remade to look more alien so to speak.


You mean like in Divinity for example, where you could see the branches and "plant spirit" like theme literally imprinted in their bodys?
I found that pretty wierd tbh but I must admit that was also kinda cool and new.

But the truly 'original Elf' had a look leaning onto the "European/Caucasian type Human".
Everything else is tryhard borderline political correctness and its cringe.
And in the case of original fantasy I find it highly offensive and disrespectful to the original theme.


I had a similar discussion on another website once.
But it was about Angels in general.
Not Celestials like in D&D, just Angels.

" Why are they White? Can there be Black/Brown Angels? "

My conclusion, sure why not. Ultimately Angels too aren't Human but their origin is absolutely primordeal from a spiritual existence.
I thought Angels take the forms they want to communicate with Mortals, in fact - they have no physical flesh appearance in the first place.
Maybe they identify with the forms they take. Maybe they don't. Who knows?

A narcistic Angel like "Lucifer" which embodies Pride might identify with his/her/it's form extremly, if you get my thought.

I always thought the Angels in Christianitys depiction are very much symbolic in nature.
They look simply white because the artists of that time had no imagination I think.
Or because they did not even knew what an Asian or African is. (LoL)


I think the Angels of Diablo are the coolest.
You really get this otherworldy, sacred vibe from them.
Allthough the Angels of that Universe can be pretty shitty personalitywise.

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This really doesnt need to be that hard lads, it's simple

We all know some of you are not happy with the current appearance of the elves since they look too human and that should be for a different discussion it has nothing to do with what the OP is expressing!

But as we currently have it the elves do look human! And do represent certain features! And if they do decide to keep the state of the elves it would be nice to have more inclusive and diverse elves! THAT IS ALL!

It doesnt need to get political

This is dnd my g, its about thinking outside the box and playing a fantasy game, let me repeat FANTASY! You can literally do whatever you want and it's different for everyone! Dont be mad at people for wanting diversity!

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Ooh can I make a drow with freckles?

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Originally Posted by A Clown
This really doesnt need to be that hard lads, it's simple

We all know some of you are not happy with the current appearance of the elves since they look too human and that should be for a different discussion it has nothing to do with what the OP is expressing!

But as we currently have it the elves do look human! And do represent certain features! And if they do decide to keep the state of the elves it would be nice to have more inclusive and diverse elves! THAT IS ALL!

It doesnt need to get political

This is dnd my g, its about thinking outside the box and playing a fantasy game, let me repeat FANTASY! You can literally do whatever you want and it's different for everyone! Dont be mad at people for wanting diversity!


How can you say that this doesn't have to be political all the while you try to force modern day politics of inclusivity and representation into a fantasy game? You do realize that only one side of the argument has to consider this political for it to be politcal, right? Also, the aforementioned Wild Elves are an option that could satidfy this demand. That being said I fully disagree with you, even if elves look human, they are NOT human.

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Originally Posted by Bruh

How can you say that this doesn't have to be political all the while you try to force modern day politics of inclusivity and representation into a fantasy game? You do realize that only one side of the argument has to consider this political for it to be politcal, right? Also, the aforementioned Wild Elves are an option that could satidfy this demand. That being said I fully disagree with you, even if elves look human, they are NOT human.


Why you mad bro?

Will this inclusivity harm you? Why you mad?

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I'm thinking we've probably exhausted this particular tangent and maybe it'd be better to agree to disagree and move on...


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I just want to know that Larian has much more customization options in general. I dont care of what kinds of faces, I just want more for fun and general variety for all.

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Originally Posted by A Clown
Originally Posted by Bruh

How can you say that this doesn't have to be political all the while you try to force modern day politics of inclusivity and representation into a fantasy game? You do realize that only one side of the argument has to consider this political for it to be politcal, right? Also, the aforementioned Wild Elves are an option that could satidfy this demand. That being said I fully disagree with you, even if elves look human, they are NOT human.


Why you mad bro?
Will this inclusivity harm you? Why you mad?


He isn't mad. That was a perfectly logical and accurate observation without emotional investment. (─‿‿─)

Elves are not Humans, but they are similar.
To give them a total freak appearance - even one that would not be "diverse", would still be disrespectful to the original.

I find it already disgusting that we can make a character ingame with colorations that make absolutely no sense.
The only way this feels tolerable for me is because I know nothing can force me to ever play with someone who made an Abomination colorwise.
Never ever felt I the need to look at a Rainbow on LSD.


But I keep saying it "politely".
Some things got invented by Caucasian/European people.
Those things were made popular and original by Caucasian/European people.

That is not racist, that is not mean, that is just what it is.
It was never meant to hurt, harm or offend anyone.
But to debate its right to remain original, is very offensive in itself.


All this Clownworld Meme's and cynical expressions of how nonsensical our society has become, how can it ever end with demands like this?

Imagine
° A representation of Japan, with Samurai and all, but they look like a Northamerican Native demographic.
° Africans are in fact so white now, it is snow-white. Oh yeah and their facial structure is whatever now. Everything EXCEPT African of course.
° Europeans have become the Borg, or Vulcans, or Klingons... cause this is wierdly pleasing for some virtue signaling individual.
° And Chinese people are now those blue Catpeople from the Pandora Movie.

When is enough crazyness enough? ζ༼Ɵ͆ل͜Ɵ͆༽ᶘ

Let me say it, whoever reads this, if you are a super minority looking Migrant in some white country, I am truly sorry for your lack of identification with a culture not created by your own ancestors but those of others.
I am sorry that you feel like you are not represented in it or that you feel invisible.
But that is just what it is.

Blame the game. Not the players.
And do not try to change the game until it resembles absolutely nothing anymore - and no majority anywhere in the world will ever truly agree to it.
Your birth heritage in this world is on another difficulty.
Dunno if you wanna feel proud about it or sad. But rest easy. There are A TON OF PEOPLE currently that cannot stop to virtue-signal towards yourself.

So wether you have Hard or Easy mode on, who knows?
But all this noise is slowly but surely starting to wake something very ugly and bigoted.
Cause majority people too have feelings.
And they too can feel "stigmatized" and treated unfairly.


Do we play the game as it was intended?
Or do we cry and whine about it all day until absolutely no one has any motivation left to play it anymore?
And I am feeling like a lower-class human already by being of the "native demographic" on the northern hemisphere.

I have to endure the cocky, narcistic preaching of hollow people probably until the day I die, just so that they themself can feel better about themself because of their virtue signaling.
And the cocky demands and hostility shown to me "in case I dare to disobey", lets say I already know how it must feel like to be truly seen as lesser for my outer appearance.
If people of other visual appearance would be treated like that, especially those of minoritys, holy hell would this be seen as racism quickly!

There is even a slur like n-word for my demographic as well, as soon as I dare to resist the call for obedience!
It has something to do with a group of people that grew very popular in Europe during the 1930's.

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Originally Posted by A Clown


Why you mad bro?

Will this inclusivity harm you? Why you mad?

I doubt that I'm the mad one here.
And it's not about me, it's about the game world. And yes, pushing real life politics unto a fantasy world will harm it significantly from many points of view.

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Originally Posted by vometia
I'm thinking we've probably exhausted this particular tangent and maybe it'd be better to agree to disagree and move on...

And I think we're done here.


J'aime le fromage.
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