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Originally Posted by fylimar
I always gave Morrigan a more sensible outfit and Isabela pants...

Yeah, me too. I even gave Varric a shirt. Putting unsexy (to me) characters in sexy outfits and shoving them in my face isn't very appealing.

(Alistair and Zevran, though, they get the good stuff. And if BG3 adds some sexy light armor for men, it's going right to Astarion.)

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Originally Posted by Aishaddai
@Starlights I was in a joking mood then and didn't finish what I was going to say. You misunderstood my tone. I was actually going in a more joking direction before the interrogation began. My point in a more serious manner is that when given the choice to simply request what some have claimed to be wronged, some of you instead went to change something that was not in question in the first place. Essentially you are not righting a wrong you are causing a revenge tactic to claim fair game which of course means you at least subconsciously know what's going on. That's not justice, that's revenge. Which is close but not the same. Your claim was that the armor for women does not please you, therefore the armor for men must change. That is sexist and does not even solve the problem you complained about in the first place.

@Aishaddai, it looks like pushed your bottons a bit, by the tone of your message, or perhaps not - its hard to express emotion/tones in a text. But the following post here, I am happy and respectful of you & all. I enjoy reading you, you making me paddle a little bit smile. (look up my new signature smile )
The following text is my perspective and doesn't necessary reflect ALL women's views.

ok ..

I started playing BG3 in October and I started with a Ranger, I took Lae's armor right away, on the ship, because I liked the look and didn't like her. It was a "fluke", I didn't know it would turn out to be the best armor in EA with the stats and right away I noticed the legs open and the buttcheek. At this point, no big deal. It looks great ! I love it.

It's only recently, in this forum, where we were comparing race faces that I decided to make a "dude" for my 5th run. I grabbed Lae's armor for my "male Ranger" as usual and then oh - same armor - same class - same level, different style - sign, why ?. It doesn't even look great on a male, now "he" looks like a robot - a can of coke and all puffy. Clearly this seems, once again in this whole gaming ecosystem, a double standard male/female.

I know it's hard to comprehend for men, and I acknowledge that some women in this forum also think differently. Whoever not expose to sexism - well, it doesn't exist. I am in computer science and there is 3 women for 20 men and we get some sexism comments here and there all the time - why ? You get a job, same experience, same skills, same same same, but salary is different - why ? It's always a bit harder to get to the next thing all the time, as a woman compare to man - why ?. Over time, you just can't help it, your brain becomes Alerte to details like the gith's armor not the same for both gender, it becomes the "what you see". I was just trying to rationalize with the spartan/roman armor to me make it more acceptable - but I was wrong, I was avoiding talking about my own point. With my point, I really felt like this wikipedia link, what I'm highlighting in red:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexism
Sexism is prejudice or discrimination based on a person's sex or gender ... It has been linked to stereotypes and gender roles.

Before you ask, no - I didn't mess up with wikipedia definition smile

I acknowledge that this is a game and perhaps we shouldn't make a big fuss about it (as shadowheart would say), but we opened the topic in this forum where we were looking for feedback to the admins of the game. I jumped on the opportunity, thanks to @Kadajko. @Kadajko is my real hero for opening up this can of worms allowing the few of us to talk about this. Because It is "very hard" as a woman to even talk about these things, you're being judge. Just ask around, in your close circle and be mindful that some of us will say no, because of ego and frustration - but is sexism common or uncommon ? Tell me. Even if we all agree in this forum and have the Dev/Admin jumping-in - I don't expect this thread to become popular with other gaming platform and then we will go change the world. I just hope if we fix one detail at the time we will kill this topic and that's what I meant by asking to make them both the same.

I hope this post is not too heavy and doesn't attract too much thunder and if so, I will delete it and move on.

Last edited by Starlights; 11/01/21 04:04 PM.

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For me, it depends on the character I play. So sexy cloths are ok, unsexy too. All I want is to have a choice.
So if a female armor look like this:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
Then male armor should look like this or similiar:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
This:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
And that:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

A few sets of diffrent armors for both.

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Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Originally Posted by AvatarOfSHODAN
Banning things is just a bandaid for deeper issues. If a game wants to have it, it's my choice whether I want to deal with it or not. And in weighing whether I am interested in a game or not, that can play a part. It's easier for me to ignore the prevalent perception of skimpy female armor when there is skimpy male armor to match.

But you were the one who implied sexualized armor potentially creates harm. Band aid or not, shouldn’t it be removed even at the expense of some artistic creativity if it will prevent some future violence?

You may ignore it but others may not.

I've already answered your question. The metaphor means that you can put a bandaid on it, but it still won't stop the bleeding.
An example would be Bioware and it's Andromeda graphical glitches. The bandaid of "let's stop making pretty women" censored staff from speaking up about horrendous animation glitches. Super reductive thinking is the wrong approach and just isn't capable of solving a deeper issue.

Originally Posted by Nyloth
You keep talking about git armor. So I will say again, Lae's open legs look good, in a way it (maybe) sexualizes her. But the skirt on men looks silly, to sexualize their you need to remove the upper part of the armor and open the chest, not the legs. In fact, if you left legs open, it wouldn't be the same. Women will look sexy in this, and men will look stupid, for most people. So if you want to sexualize both types of armor, you need to make them DIFFERENT. The effect will be completely different for different genders..

Fun fact, I'm pretty sure gits themselves have their legs open in that armor right now. Why do you think not? Did you meet them at the bridge?

I can easily perceive Lae's armor as only incidentally sexy - it's half plate intended only to armor the upper part of the body. Again, I can't change the fact that humanity as a whole find female legs (and ass - her ass is also out lol) more attractive than male legs - so a woman in the aforementioned "Spartan" armor will have sex appeal to most people. But it's harder to perceive this design choice as only incidental (on what could be practical armor of a dexterous fighter) and more as an intentional "lets see how we can get away with having her fight with her ass out", when the males get leather wraps on the legs and have no in-lore reason to require more protection than the females. They are just as lanky as the females, lending to the same dexterous fighting style. I personally see it as a nuanced case where sexualizing the male upper torso could work, but simply removing the leather wraps allows one to remove the possible exploitative nature of it from mind. Again, my male Gith looks like a hobo in half plate. This armor could be meant to glorify an agile warrior (not necessarily sexualize) first and foremost.

Originally Posted by sahardima
For me, it depends on the character I play. So sexy cloths are ok, unsexy too. All I want is to have a choice.
So if a female armor look like this:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
Then male armor should look like this or similiar:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
This:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
And that:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

A few sets of diffrent armors for both.

I very much agree! And I think these are good examples. My fav class is Barbarian so I love the first two pics especially.

Last edited by AvatarOfSHODAN; 11/01/21 02:55 PM.
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Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]


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When it comes to recent fantasy art.
I think Adrian Smith understands perfectly how to do it.

men are hulking barbarians, and women lithe athletes, i love it.

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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]

I prefer this one:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
or this:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

Last edited by sahardima; 11/01/21 04:47 PM.
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Originally Posted by sahardima
Originally Posted by Nyloth
Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]

I prefer this one:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
or this:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

This is also very hot! It's stylish! That's what they have to give us, I don't want to wear Gale's robe or somth like that T_T


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Originally Posted by Sordak
When it comes to recent fantasy art.
I think Adrian Smith understands perfectly how to do it.

men are hulking barbarians, and women lithe athletes, i love it.
He is good, but not my favorite artist. His art is too sharp/"cold".

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Originally Posted by spectralhunter
Originally Posted by AvatarOfSHODAN
Yes, it is a false equivalence - skimpy male armor does not have the same implications as skimpy female armor. It's not true equality, but it will never be revenge because they appeal differently to who they appeal to. Sexualized clothes to some are an invitation (deserving of whatever it provokes) rather than it being an advertisement, which echoes longstanding real world issues I will not elaborate on in this forum. You call it hypocritical revenge because you think we're just trying to flip the script.

We have Drow for that. This is about putting a bare minimum of static noise over something otherwise blaringly obvious. When it's just females sexualized, there is the implication of "deserving whatever they provoke", there to be feasted upon by the eyes and not a serious, capable character. Compared to a male that is not given a compromising implication. When its both males and females sexualized, I can say it's not targeted to one sex. It's "equal".

If sexualization of armor potentially creates an "invitation" of something bad, shouldn't we remove it completely, male or female? If that's the case, it seems the best solution is to remove it completely.

problem is everything can be saw as "inviting" from the point of view of a predator (as anyone who has even the slightest knowledge of what are the clothes in molested or abused women know)

also to just translate clothing that function on a female body (that has curves) on a male body (that doesn't have the same lines) doesn't function, because that kind of clothing (independently from the fact that it had or not had been designed to be sexy or sezualizing) is designed for a body that has curves.


Changing argument: the two barbarians armors are awesome, and that balded barbaria oh my he's frigging sexy! devil crazy birthdayjump thankyou celebrate evil

And the two rogue females are amazing too. Specialy the last one is really elegant and sexy too. cool2 celebrate evil

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Originally Posted by sahardima
Originally Posted by Nyloth
Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]

I prefer this one:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
or this:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Those are clothes, not armor.

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Again:
Originally Posted by Kadajko
Originally Posted by Ixal
Except that this is also not armor. Remember the thread topic?

By game terminology it is, we even discuss robes here, we dicsuss the things that go into your torso slot, if you want to get pedantic about it.

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Originally Posted by Ixal
Originally Posted by sahardima
Originally Posted by Nyloth
Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]

I prefer this one:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
or this:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Those are clothes, not armor.

This is what you might call armor for rogue or class like this. Armor is just a generic word in this case, not an alloy of metal...


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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Originally Posted by Ixal
Originally Posted by sahardima
Originally Posted by Nyloth
Fully closed clothes, but still very hot... Design, that's what it's about. It's about design... q-q

[Linked Image from cdn3.savepice.ru]

I prefer this one:
[Linked Image from i.pinimg.com]
or this:
[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]
Those are clothes, not armor.

This is what you might call armor for rogue or class like this. Armor is just a generic word in this case, not an alloy of metal...

Even for a rogue that is not armor. Armor must offer some sort of protection which those outfits do not.

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Those both goes as +0 AC +DEX Mod armours wink


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I want sexy edgelord armor. I want rule of cool.

Any arguments about practicality are completely foolish in light of ANY armor preventing you from being rent in half by a dragon.

I am however down for a wide variety of armor appearances and an appearance tab. If you want to dress like a nun, Id like you to be able to. If I want to dress like a sexy nun, I want to be able to.

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Originally Posted by Ixal
Even for a rogue that is not armor. Armor must offer some sort of protection which those outfits do not.

They offer protection from papercuts and a slight breeze at the very least. Not much, but certainly not nothing.

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Originally Posted by Ixal
Even for a rogue that is not armor. Armor must offer some sort of protection which those outfits do not.

Yeah true buttttt I'm sure looking like a cute pirate in leather armour corset is worth it XD

But seriously though I feel like playing a mage or any ranged class it would be better to be equipped lightly so you can manoeuvre more no?

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I mean if this is AC 11:

[Linked Image from i.imgur.com]

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Originally Posted by Ixal
Even for a rogue that is not armor. Armor must offer some sort of protection which those outfits do not.

No, my dear friend, this is called LIGHT ARMOR and even in the game it gives protection, just less. You can see for yourself.


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