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Jumping around the terrain is fine, but the jumping in combat needs to be cut down. It makes the jump spell a little irrelevant.
I would also like to see climbing and rope use used instead of all the jumping. Some jumping is fine, but having to carry a rope and climbing gear sounds a lot more D&D to me than jumping does (there is a LOT of rope in this game already).

Food is also an issue. I also try and self police, but sometimes it is all you have (I'd rather that then constantly going to camp to have a long rest- which I don't do until my party really needs it).
Perhaps food could also be corrected by having to make food out of ingredients, with some already prepared food available as well (buy or find). Eating raw potatoes to get better doesn't seam right!
Larian could also limit the amount of food you could eat. This would also increase the desire of people to make food in the game, which has better healing powers. You would still have to be careful that it doesn't take the place of healing spells and potions.

As far as discounts or refunds are concerned. Sorry, I don't agree with that. This is EA and we bought in knowing that. If it was a finished game and it was broken, I'd understand completely.

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Originally Posted by Anfindel
BG 1 and 2 were games presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using substantial aspects of the 2.0 rule set and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Fearun.

BG3 is a game presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using the 5.0 rule set, and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Faerun.

While YOU may not see enough ties to that prior lore, they are there - and once we get to a full game, and not 10-20 % at best, will surely be there to a greater degree.

So it is clearly BG3.

Uh, having a game set in Forgotten realms lore with D&D doesnt make it a Baldurs gate game.

Showed the game to friends (not giving away the title of course) everyones first impression : WOW Divnity Original Sins 3!!!?
So yea.

Firstly you have GAMEPLAY. For me the most important indicator of WHAT A GAME IS. Does it play like BG2? No. Does it try to evolve that game system? NO. DOS2 roots.
The UI, inventory management and presentation. Like BG2? No. Does it try to keep a similar theme/design but a bit more modern? NO. DOS2 roots.
The atmosphere, graphics? Again NO. Does it try to improve and update these systems? NO. DOS2 roots.
Huge dialogue trees, tons of playable characters including a party of 6 (tied to that gameplay element) ? NO. DOS2 roots.

The story and setting? Yes...hopefully.
A new D&D system? Ok, yes! BUT heavily borrows again from DOS2. Aaaand thats all you got thats similar.

The game should be called , <Dawn of the Illithids, > a D&D RPG cinematic adventure made by Larian, makers of the acclaimed DOS1 and 2 games!

I dont dislike BG3 nor do I love it. It just does not feel like a Baldurs gate game which is disappointing. Right now its a pretty good strategic RPG, a D&Dized DOS2 with clunky cinematic dialogues.

Last edited by mr_planescapist; 26/01/21 02:48 PM.
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Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
Originally Posted by Anfindel
BG 1 and 2 were games presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using substantial aspects of the 2.0 rule set and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Fearun.

BG3 is a game presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using the 5.0 rule set, and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Faerun.

While YOU may not see enough ties to that prior lore, they are there - and once we get to a full game, and not 10-20 % at best, will surely be there to a greater degree.

So it is clearly BG3.

Uh, having a game set in Forgotten realms lore with D&D doesnt make it a Baldurs gate game.

Showed the game to friends (not giving away the title of course) everyones first impression : WOW Divnity Original Sins 3!!!?
So yea.

Firstly you have GAMEPLAY. For me the most important indicator of WHAT A GAME IS. Does it play like BG2? No.
The UI, inventory management and presentation. Like BG2? No.
The atmosphere, graphics? Again NO.
Huge dialogue trees, tons of playable characters including a party of 6 (tied to that gameplay element) ? NO.

The story and setting? Yes...hopefully.
A new D&D system? Ok, yes! Aaaand thats all you got thats similar.

The game should be called , <Dawn of the Illithids, > a D&D RPG cinematic adventure made by Larian, makers of the acclaimed DOS1 and 2 games!

This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1. The previous games are too old. Do you want same graphics? Like 20 years ago? I'm not!

2. Do I want a "slideshow" gameplay with old mechanics? NO plz

3. About atmosphere, perhaps, I agree. I hope it gets darker as the story progresses..

There is too much time difference between the games, this game is made not only for old generation of fans, but also to attract new players who have never played Baldur's Gate. And trust me, new players may not like old mechanics and design. Personally, I hate them. Again, I'm not saying the game doesn't have problems. Yes, there are problems, but this is not about OLD BG.

Also some ppl never played DOS and they will never call this game DOS3 because it is a new experience for them.

Also, each developer has its own "features", I remind you that a new game is being made by another developer on a different game engine. And this is important.


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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Originally Posted by mr_planescapist
Originally Posted by Anfindel
BG 1 and 2 were games presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using substantial aspects of the 2.0 rule set and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Fearun.

BG3 is a game presenting adventures in the D & D Forgotten Realms, specifically the Sword Coast region, using the 5.0 rule set, and lore specific to the territory, characters, magic, bestiary, and history of that part of Faerun.

While YOU may not see enough ties to that prior lore, they are there - and once we get to a full game, and not 10-20 % at best, will surely be there to a greater degree.

So it is clearly BG3.

Uh, having a game set in Forgotten realms lore with D&D doesnt make it a Baldurs gate game.

Showed the game to friends (not giving away the title of course) everyones first impression : WOW Divnity Original Sins 3!!!?
So yea.

Firstly you have GAMEPLAY. For me the most important indicator of WHAT A GAME IS. Does it play like BG2? No.
The UI, inventory management and presentation. Like BG2? No.
The atmosphere, graphics? Again NO.
Huge dialogue trees, tons of playable characters including a party of 6 (tied to that gameplay element) ? NO.

The story and setting? Yes...hopefully.
A new D&D system? Ok, yes! Aaaand thats all you got thats similar.

The game should be called , <Dawn of the Illithids, > a D&D RPG cinematic adventure made by Larian, makers of the acclaimed DOS1 and 2 games!

This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1. The previous games are too old. Do you want same graphics? Like 20 years ago? I'm not!

2. Do I want a "slideshow" gameplay with old mechanics? NO plz

3. About atmosphere, perhaps, I agree. I hope it gets darker as the story progresses..

There is too much time difference between the games, this game is made not only for old generation of fans, but also to attract new players who have never played Baldur's Gate. And trust me, new players may not like old mechanics and design. Personally, I hate them. Again, I'm not saying the game doesn't have problems. Yes, there are problems, but this is not about OLD BG.

Also some ppl never played DOS and they will never call this game DOS3 because it is a new experience for them.

Also, each developer has its own "features", I remind you that a new game is being made by another developer on a different game engine. And this is important.

This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1) no one asked for 20 years old graphics.

2) no one asked for old mechanics to be implemented as they were in a new game (except maybe for party movement because what was done 20 years ago was better than the chain mechanic)

3) yes, maybe... I hope more companionship, a better feeling of a journey across the swordcoast.

What does time has to do with this ?
Isn't there new games that looks or feel way more like BG than BG3 does ?

Last edited by Maximuuus; 26/01/21 03:09 PM.
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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1) no one asked for 20 years old graphics.

2) no one asked for old mechanics to be implemented as they were in a new game (except maybe for party movement because what was done 20 years ago was better than the chain mechanic)

3) yes, maybe... I hope more companionship, a better feeling of a journey across the swordcoast.

What does time has to do with this ?
Isn't there new games that looks or feel way more like BG than BG3 does ?
+1 i agree with max - these just come off as straw man arguments/responses that dont actually work to address the valid criticism being cited of an early access dnd 5e video game, we all can do better as a community/fanbase here.

regarding the atmosphere point, i do agree that the current plot/atmosphere feels a little too 'vibrant' or 'campy' for the bg ip - idk, it is hard to describe, but i just feel like the current build/world is too full of bright colors. in particular when compared to the opening cinematic.

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1) no one asked for 20 years old graphics.

2) no one asked for old mechanics to be implemented as they were in a new game (except maybe for party movement because what was done 20 years ago was better than the chain mechanic)

3) yes, maybe... I hope more companionship, a better feeling of a journey across the swordcoast.

What does time has to do with this ?
Isn't there new games that looks or feel way more like BG than BG3 does ?

> The atmosphere, graphics? Again NO.
> The UI, inventory management and presentation. Like BG2?

No one? Yes?

Maybe I misunderstood post I was responding to, but it's very likely that some of you want literally the same game. Even in a graphic sense, lol.

Also I think inventory in BG2 is terrible. Yes in BG3 inventory system is not perfect too, but this is not a reason to do exactly the same inventory like in old BG. It just needs to be changed, in a new way.

The genre must evolve and change, including mechanics and gameplay elements.

Many games in this genre have tried to simply copy BG, such as PoE. And what Obsidian doing now? Oh, yes, some kind of action game that can be sold much better. If you want to make a genre popular (cuz now it's not very popular if you compare sales with action games), then you need to change it, not follow the old mechanics, because " the fans remember it that way".

Make this game better? Yes.
Make it look like the old ones? Nope.

Even if you and some of the old fans think that "everything was better before."

This is my opinion.


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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
This has been said a thousand times, but I will say it again.

1) no one asked for 20 years old graphics.

2) no one asked for old mechanics to be implemented as they were in a new game (except maybe for party movement because what was done 20 years ago was better than the chain mechanic)

3) yes, maybe... I hope more companionship, a better feeling of a journey across the swordcoast.

What does time has to do with this ?
Isn't there new games that looks or feel way more like BG than BG3 does ?

> The atmosphere, graphics? Again NO.
> The UI, inventory management and presentation. Like BG2?

No one? Yes?

Maybe I misunderstood post I was responding to, but it's very likely that some of you want literally the same game. Even in a graphic sense, lol.

Also I think inventory in BG2 is terrible. Yes in BG3 inventory system is not perfect too, but this is not a reason to do exactly the same inventory like in old BG. It just needs to be changed, in a new way.

The genre must evolve and change, including mechanics and gameplay elements.

Many games in this genre have tried to simply copy BG, such as PoE. And what Obsidian doing now? Oh, yes, some kind of action game that can be sold much better. If you want to make a genre popular (cuz now it's not very popular if you compare sales with action games), then you need to change it, not follow the old mechanics, because " the fans remember it that way".

Make this game better? Yes.
Make it look like the old ones? Nope.

Even if you and some of the old fans think that "everything was better before."

This is my opinion.

Yes, you missunderstood what you read.
"Looking like" and "feel like" doesn't mean it has to be the exact same without any improvement.

Make this game better? Yes.
This is probably what everyone still posting here want.

Even if you and some of the younger fans think that "everything is better now".
Looks like even if this has been said a thousand times... you still don't (try to) understand.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 26/01/21 05:20 PM.
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Before purchasing this game on Stadia, I was only familiar with the name Baldur's Gate due to my having played all of the Dragon Age games, by it's original developer (Bioware). I've never dabbled with D & D stuff either. Personally, while I read the constant back and forth between hardcore fans that are acquainted with the rulebooks for that stuff and those who like me are more console oriented gamers ... I'm not too bothered by Larian perhaps bending those rules a bit.

The game is in early access and nobody knows if the final release will be more palatable to the former group or whether it will be geared to a broader audience? Like I said, I'm not too bothered either way. I'm liking what I see and am far more annoyed at glitches or bugs that plague this game on Stadia at the moment.

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Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Yes, you missunderstood what you read.
"Looking like" and "feel like" doesn't mean it has to be the exact same without any improvement.

Make this game better? Yes.
This is probably what everyone still posting here want.

Even if you and some of the younger fans think that "everything is better now".
Looks like even if this has been said a thousand times... you still don't (try to) understand.

I already told you, I also think game has problems, so I don't think "everything is better now". I just think devs must add something new and not copy old. Adding old mechanics "like in BG2" is not a solution to problem.
It's an indulgence of your nostalgia.

Also it is very convenient to ignore inconvenient phrases, but oh well.

Last edited by Nyloth; 26/01/21 09:23 PM.

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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Yes, you missunderstood what you read.
"Looking like" and "feel like" doesn't mean it has to be the exact same without any improvement.

Make this game better? Yes.
This is probably what everyone still posting here want.

Even if you and some of the younger fans think that "everything is better now".
Looks like even if this has been said a thousand times... you still don't (try to) understand.

I already told you, I also think game has problems, so I don't think "everything is better now". I just think devs must add something new and not copy old. Adding old mechanics "like in BG2" is not a solution to problem.
It's an indulgence of your nostalgia.

Also it is very convenient to ignore inconvenient phrases, but oh well.

Something new ? Absolutely. Who said something else ?

Adding old mechanics could be a solution to specific problems yes. An exemple ? The chain mechanic.
It was obviously better.

Inconvenient phrase ? Obsidian ?

Do you really think PoE would have been more sucessfull with another UI, with a party of 4, with a chain, with a list to fast travel between locations or with less companions ? Because that's a few exemples of what "looking more like BG" mean.

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Out of all the PoE complaints, mechanics or ui were not really ones that came up a lot if at all. Story and loredumping with blocks of text was the main issue.

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Originally Posted by TheFoxWhisperer
Out of all the PoE complaints, mechanics or ui were not really ones that came up a lot if at all. Story and loredumping with blocks of text was the main issue.

Ugh. I mean, Obsidian lost money. No matter how good their game is, if they can't make money on it. Because it's only interested for old players. Ask yourself why latest Obsidian game is so different. Why this is an action game. This is not news at all.


Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Do you really think PoE would have been more sucessfull with another UI, with a party of 4, with a chain, with a list to fast travel between locations or with less companions ?

Well. you know wut? Maybe. As far as I know, DOS2 is also considered a very good game, and it includes all things that you so terribly hate.


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PoE has its flaws, sure. That does not immediatly mean the mechanics are bad. It also does not mean these mechanics alone can carry the game to make it a bestseller if the rest is missing. It is not all black and white.

A good game can still be received poorly due to people not liking the setting or writing, not because it is not a popular genre or mechanics anymore.


Regarding DOS2, it is considered a good game despite those mentioned mechanics, not because of them.

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Originally Posted by Nyloth
Originally Posted by Maximuuus
Do you really think PoE would have been more sucessfull with another UI, with a party of 4, with a chain, with a list to fast travel between locations or with less companions ?

Well. you know wut? Maybe. As far as I know, DOS2 is also considered a very good game, and it includes all things that you so terribly hate.

Does DoS 2 considered a good game because of its UI, its short number of companions, its chain mechanic, its party of 4 and it's fast travel system ?

Seriously... I hope you understood why you were wrong about the meaning of "feeling like/looking like".
Now I'm done. Your non sense assumptions aren't interresting at all.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 27/01/21 05:26 AM.
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@Maximuuus

I entirely disagree. The powers from the tadpole, are a direct homage to the powers from Bhaalspawn. An evil entity using you(Bhaal), a new god The Absolute(Rebirth of Bhaal using his spawn as a new vessel or just taking over the throne), Having to give into the influence of the tadpole, or resist it(literally exactly what you are doing in BG I), the true souls are working together(OK so not this one, Bhaalspawn were more of a Highlander, there can be only one, getting more powerful from killing your half-siblings. However, we do see that....forgot her name, The Goblin Shaman seems to be a true soul and wants to study/kill you, so maybe it will be Highlanderesk in the later chapters.) Then who is this Absolute, its a new god, and its definitely not a benevolent one. Could this be the Bhaalspawn that ascended?

As of right now the game seems like a love-letter to Baldur's Gate I & II. It's also EA, and I'm sure they want to leave some big reveals to come as well.

As far as gameplay goes, I feel its held onto too much of the PnP style of RPGs / Original BG/NWN games. It needs to evolve that system, if we are going to truly get a rebirth of this franchise and/or successful WotC representation in the genre again.

Also as an aside, just the fact that they mentioned Elminster in a author's note inside a book you can read, sucked me back to my childhood when I played BG I. Surreal moment for me.

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There are elements that hint back to how things were handled in the BG series but... It feels hamfisted in. It is not too original to do a repeat of things in a new coat (borrowing from both BG story as well as DOS stuff, the intro is a big offender there) and it feels forced. I get it is meant as a love letter to the old BG games and a homage (something that I considered a good thing and was excited for before I started playing) but... it kind of misses the mark I feel.

The impression I got with BG3 so far is that there is an attempt to make us get the Baldur's Gate 2 experience, without the Baldur's Gate 1 experience. No buildup at all, you just get thrown in what almost feels like the middle of a story, with really high stakes that I tend to associate with high level stories. (Mindflayers, dragonriders, literally one of the Hells itself). This is emphasized by the companions with their backgrounds where they are portrayed as powerful/accomplished people. This is a story that would make a good sequel, but instead we get it as the start of a story where it feels weird to be level 1. To survive the entire prologue as a new adventurer is kind of a case of dumb luck more than anything and kind of feels railroaded in a sense. To have these companions with epic backstories feels.. weird to be level 1 too.

It is a shame, because I think for me I would have enjoyed the story a LOT more personally if it indeed was a sequel/BG4. Your main character would be accomplished too at the mid-levels (assuming this would be a starting point, going by the BG1 >2 experience) and would fit in with the companions, rahter than being the random baby adventurer amongst the group of big shots (storywise at least). The setting and stakes would feel more in line what to expect from the midlevels and you had a buildup as well (if the stakes and situations are epic from the start, there is nowhere to go but up from there really, making stuff more and more ridicilous as you go on to keep the awe factor).

Even without a fantastical, epic introstory you can weave stories where you start as a fresh adventurer properly ( building up to the point where Hell travelling eldritch spaceships attacked by dragonriders is a natural porogression) that is cool and makes you feel like a hero.

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I think you really nailed what I have not been able to so far : indeed, the SOUL of BG was also that :
A fresh start, meeting very basic, ordinary and simple people (kind of "realistic" !), and then, very gradually, feeling the progression and the Epic (with something close to the progression in levels)
Of course, they can't reverse that, but maybe they can introduce more "fresh simple" stuff at times in baldurs gate or villages...

And actually, they could still bring this flavor !!
You begin in a small peaceful village (or a small portion of a big city), level 1, speak with some common folks, learn the first steps, have two or three fights, maybe get 1 level...
and then, boom, you are captured by the illithids !

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Originally Posted by Seiryu Suta
@Maximuuus

I entirely disagree. The powers from the tadpole, are a direct homage to the powers from Bhaalspawn. An evil entity using you(Bhaal), a new god The Absolute(Rebirth of Bhaal using his spawn as a new vessel or just taking over the throne), Having to give into the influence of the tadpole, or resist it(literally exactly what you are doing in BG I), the true souls are working together(OK so not this one, Bhaalspawn were more of a Highlander, there can be only one, getting more powerful from killing your half-siblings. However, we do see that....forgot her name, The Goblin Shaman seems to be a true soul and wants to study/kill you, so maybe it will be Highlanderesk in the later chapters.) Then who is this Absolute, its a new god, and its definitely not a benevolent one. Could this be the Bhaalspawn that ascended?

As of right now the game seems like a love-letter to Baldur's Gate I & II. It's also EA, and I'm sure they want to leave some big reveals to come as well.

Interesting points you raise here about the tadpole powers and to some extent I agree but at present it is are just a theory of yours, not a fact and from my point of view I don't see the homage or love letter to the original BG games in any meaningful sense. The Bhaalspawn powers in BG2 if I remember rightly were not introduced until some way into the game (could be wrong here I admit). Maybe The Absolute is as your theory suggests but story aside, when I think of homage I can think of plenty of other things that have no link to previous BG games.

By implementing so many things that were in DOS: no day/night cycle, party chain mechanics, 4 person party, explosive surfaces, healing food, etc., it's inevitable some people feel the lack of familiarity. Clearly nobody expects a replica of a 20 year old game but I find the soul of BG is indeed missing in BG3. I understand some people will disagree with me and that is fine; these are all just opinions after all.

I read in another thread that someone described BG3 as having a feel similar to a Marvel film and that resonated with me, from a story/companions/overall tone perspective. From the crazy intro hurtling through the planes to the exceptional backstories of the majority of the companions, everything feels very extreme.

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Even if I don't really understand what Seiryu Suta could disagree about what I said...

I'd also like to answer about the tadpole powers which "could be" an homage to the old games.
That's an interresting point but if that's really something supposed to be like in BG1/2... I guess we'll also have new powers for not using the tadpole...?
Because that's what happen in the old games. You have an evil route and a good route, good dreams and bad dreams.
At the moment In BG3 you have the choice between using the tadpole (evil) or nothing (good).
But it's the beginning of the EA and something like this would definitely be interresting.

On the other hand everyone knows that the stories have a link. Is that enough to make a game "feel like" or "look like" ? As many players, I don't think so.
The D/N cycle/meteo effects is another great exemple of things that could have been implemented for BG3 to "look more like".

But you're right there's not nothing.
That's not something I said.

Last edited by Maximuuus; 27/01/21 12:33 PM.
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Just a quick point of order? Can people PLEASE stop saying that dumb jokey humor doesn't "feel like DnD". Anyone that says that clearly hasn't played much pen and paper (stupid jokes are the norm). Just one well-worn example: a major setting character that has been around for decades was created because some guy thought that the name "Medium Rary" would be funny.

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