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Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Time limits are a bad idea. How many really do you remember the role-playing games that actually have them?
I also do not understand the complaint that the game is not consistent in this respect. I guess some people here have never played any role-playing game. There is something like this in practically every game.
No matter if you are stopping a rebellious specter / mad mage / darkspawn invasions / destructive god etc. you can always ignore it for some time and every time the game will wait for you.
This is practically an integral part of all RPGs for as long as I can remember.
The time limit that some people propose, the only thing that would bring to the game is that it would spoil the enjoyment of playing a huge crowd of players. How popular was Pathfinder with its limitations? I don't remember that it somehow stood out for sale.
I don't believe some people propose even more restrictive restrictions.
I don't feel like playing a game that practically forces you into a metagame.


Just because someone has a different opinion (and/or taste) than you, does not mean they necessarily are less experienced in any way.

I mean, it is absolutely fine and all to not agree on time restrictions and prefer them out of the game - absolutely. But to tell the people who advocate for it that they "never played any role-playing game" and then proceed to say that Pathfinder Kingmaker wasn't very popular (I mean, if you read around a bit, you'll see that a lot of people appreciate P:K here)... Degrading your opponents is not gonna do much good for your cause...

I personally do by no means belong to the veteran crowd here, so I am not one to start barking about how many popular / classic RPGs run with time restrictions - but as I've understood, a lot of people here that do advocate for time restrictions - in some form - ARE, in fact, veteran CRPG players and it feels very unnecessary to start a "my opinion is right because I am more experienced than you"-debate.

Besides, time restrictions =/= forcing you to meta game. There are so many different ways to implement it without "forcing" the player to do anything else than just... Play the game? Hard-set timers - like P:K, time-limited events - like PoE2, "hidden" (or rather logical) priority system (aka, you get locked out of certain side-content if you proceed too far in the story quests) - like ... Well, a lot of RPGs. There are probably many more ways to do time restrictions in a kind way just to give the game a sense of time moving forward without stressing the player out, but those are the ones that I came up with just on the spot.

I personally don't really mind either way. I've played games that do all of the above, and some with other unique systems. I do, however, agree on that there should be *SOME* kind of time-line that moves forward, even if it is only through the main quests (like villages being permanently destroyed after certain quests, like in DA:O). As long as Larian dedicates themselves to whatever system they choose and do their best trying to make it as good as possible, I am sure I'll be satisfied. After all, their game is what brought me into the CRPG-community. c:


Hoot hoot, stranger! Fairly new to CRPGs, but I tried my best to provide some feedback regardless! <3 Read it here: My Open Letter to Larian
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Here are the reasons for Long Rest Times Sensitive Events:

1. Story pushes time sensitivity. Again, Druids will sit and do nothing for 20 days if you want, never completing the ritual that's should only take a few days and gobbos never attack either.
2. Unlimited Long Rests make most items you pick up pointless. If I can long rest as much as I want the only use for healing items is as extreme emergency items. I don't need food, potions, etc. hardly at all because I can long rest after every battle.
3. Short rests are pointless too. Why Short Rest at all when there is not penalty for Long Rest?
4. The world is almost totally static. How long does the Tiefling girl need to pack for their trip to Baldurs? How long are the trio going to discuss their lives and futures? How many days are the gobbos in Blighted Village gonna pick through the same garbage if I don't kill them?
5. No sense of time in the game. And yet, Long Rest is clearly defined as end day and thus the passing of time. So the system is built to be time sensitive, but then there is not real time passage in the game. NOTHING changes. Ever. Even in BG1 and similar games they had a journal that told you how many days you spent doing different things. In this game, totally nebulous. Again. It's like Groundhog Day, reliving the same day over and over again doing different things each day.

Look. I get that OTHER video games don't care about these things, but this is D&D. It is THE RPG. The Original RPG. The whole point of an RPG is to immerse yourself into the role of your character. The story, the environment, everything, should simulate reality. If the story says move your butt, you should move your butt. If you don't, then DM is supposed to do things to nudge you back on course. Good DM's nudge players in the direction they should go.

So my idea is, you do 2 long rests, or something similar, and the game nudges you by reminding you that you need to: rescue Halsin, save the Tieflings, get to the creche, kill the gobbo leaders, etc. I'm not saying that you only get 3 days to stop the druids or kill gobbos. Im saying after 3 days SOMETHING happens to say "Hey. You know. You don't have forever to do this thing." Then give another couple days and say "Im...seriously. If you don't do something soon..."

Then, after x number of days, whatever Larian decides makes sense, then maybe some side quests trigger for you. Gobbos attack, druids kick people out, etc., but only AFTER a lot of Long Rests. SOMETHING to give other items and game functions purpose and meaning and to be consistent with the story.

Last edited by GM4Him; 25/04/21 02:15 AM.
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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Here are the reasons for Long Rest Times Sensitive Events:

1. Story pushes time sensitivity. Again, Druids will sit and do nothing for 20 days if you want, never completing the ritual and gobbos never attack either.
2. Unlimited Long Rests make most items you pick up pointless. If I can long rest as much as I want the only use for healing items is as extreme emergency items. I don't need food, potions, etc. hardly at all because I can long rest after every battle.
3. Short rests are pointless too. Why Short Rest at all when there is not penalty for Long Rest?
4. The world is almost totally static. How long does the Tiefling girl need to pack for their trip to Baldurs? How long are the trio going to discuss their lives and futures? How many days are the gobbos in Blighted Village gonna pick through the same garbage if I don't kill them?
5. No sense of time in thr game.

Look. I get that OTHER video games don't care about these things, but this is D&D. It is THE RPG. The Original RPG. Thr whole point of an RPG is to immerse yourself into the role of your character. The story, the environment, everything, should simulate reality. If the story says move your butt, you should move your butt. If you don't, then DM is supposed to do things to nudge you back on course.

So my idea is, you do 2 long rests, or something similar, and the game nudges you by reminding you that you need to: rescue Halsin, save the Tieflings, get to the creche, kill the gobbo leaders, etc. I'm not saying that you only get 3 days to stop the druids or kill gobbos. Im saying after 3 days SOMETHING happens to say "Hey. You know. You don't have forever to do this thing." Then give another couple days and say "Im...seriously. If you don't do something soon..."

Then, after x number of days, whatever Larian decides makes sense, then maybe some side quests trigger for you. Gobbos attack, druids kick people out, etc., but only AFTER a lot of Long Rests. SOMETHING to give other items and game functions purpose and meaning and to be consistent with the story.

1. Yes I understand what you are saying. But you are trying to place a linear restriction on a non linear game. What if the player wants to investigate the owl cave, or the spider cave before this? What if they rather investigate the bog? Each have heavy combat, therefor the need to rest to recharge your abilities. Maybe run around and get in some more conversations to trigger the dream and possibly use your illthid ability? This is a totally different game than say XCOM where the entire game is basically based on the use of time.
2.So? Not to mention you are trying to say this is going to happen after the starting area? Maybe the combat will get way more difficult once you leave the starter area and potions and food will be more important (which Larian is known to do just look at DOS).
3. Short rest is 2 chance to quick recharge before needing to long rest.
4. Seriously, do you think that the majority of players give their tertiary NPCs much after thought? I mean they don't even leave until after the main battle and finishing the Druid questline. I am also thinking, they are another side quest once we leave the starting area.
5. I know that is seriously important to you, and that is cool, but I am sure there is plenty of players that it is not a game breaking loss. More of a cherry on top.

I get what your saying after this list, but I just don't agree. That seems like something that I would find restricting. Every RPG is different to some degree, but I do not think there is some epic difference between this RPG just because it is based off of WoTC content.

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Let me try to reword what I'm suggesting.

Picture this: First Playthrough. New player.

Day 0. Wake up in nautiloid. Escape hells. Land on beach. Nee day dawns.

Day 1. Explore beach. Meet Shadowheart. Fight Devourers. Meet Astarion. Fisherman encounter. Meet Gale. Encounter Gimblebock. Fight Marli and Barton and crew. Long Rest. End day 1.

Day 2. Beat Dank Crypt. Save Lae'zel. Get to Grove Fight. Meet everyone in Grove. You learn about the ritual and Halsin needing rescue and such. Long Rest. Day 2 ends.

Day 3. Fight harpies. Explore. Meet Ed's sibs. Fight owl bear. Long rest. End day 3.

Day 4. Meet Scratch. Arrive at Moonhaven. Fight gobbos. Explore a bit. Long rest. End day 4.

Day 5. Wake up at camp. Tiefling is there sent by Zevlor. "Quick. Come to the grove," he says. "One of the Tiefling children stole the idol. The druids are judging her right now. Will you help?" Astarion says, "Don't be ridiculous. How does this effect us?" "Agreed," says Lae'zel. "The Tieflings are of no concern to us." You agree to go. You save Arabella. The ritual now must start over. Kahga is fuming. You now return to Moonhaven and explore. Lae'zel stops you. She complains that you are wasting precious time. "We need to find the creche already. Do you think my kin will wait for us to show up?" You ignore her and explore the town, save the gnome, explore Spider Lair. Long Rest. End Day 5.

Day 6. You return to Moonhaven and the gnome is there. "Goblins are preparing to attack some sort of grove soon. I heard them talking about it. I'm trying to find the best route out of these parts. Goblins west. Gith watching the road north. Gnolls everywhere. It's nuts!" Then he leaves. You head north. Fight gnolls. Deal with Tyrite issue. Long rest. End day 6.

Day 7. Waukeens rest. Gith. Long rest. End day 7.

Day 8. You receive word from Zevlor. They just repelled another goblin attack. It was larger this time. They were testing defenses. Druids were forced to help. The ritual has to start over again. You explore south. Face hag. Long rest.

Day 9. Find stuff in bog. Face Kahga. Stop ritual. Long rest.

Day 10. Tiefling at camp again. Reports goblin army is ready to attack soon. Scouts report it could be any day now. You set out to the gobbo base. So some stuff. Long Rest.

Day 11. Face gobbo bosses. Celebration at camp.

Day 12. All is well. Set out for underdark. From there, any places you didn't explore you could now explore at leisure before going there.

Now let's say in the second playthrough, the player takes 15 days. On Day 15, they wake up to hear marching and horns. Player has a choice. Gobbos are attacking the grove. Either you help defend it, like you might during evil playthrough, or you sneak onto gobbo camp to save Halsin. You save Halsin. Return. Gobbos are still fighting the Tieflings and Druids. They are holed up in the area with Kahga and Nettle. You must save them with Halsin's help. You do. Celebration. Next day, explore any other areas and head for the underdark at your leisure.

Different game experiences based on timing. Long rest has more meaningful. Time exists. The world is not static. Players are encouraged to use items and maybe rest less.

Last edited by GM4Him; 25/04/21 04:06 AM.
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They could just make it an option now that I think about it. Time-constraints that is. Allow players to select in the options when making the game whether or not they want quests and world elements to have timers. Would please both groups and add a layer of customizability where people get to tailor their game to what they want, like how some tables love time constraints and things happening because they didn't engage with x NPC yet while other tables loathe it. Basically, add options like how we can choose to have loaded dice or not.

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Yeah. I don't know. It seems like every conclusion we come to on these forums is: Make it and Option that we can customize.

Larians gonna explode from all the customizations we're asking for.

The bottom line is that unlimited Long Resting throws other game elements out the window. I don't need potions, food, short rests or pretty much any of the items I find in game of I can just Long Rest after every battle. So what's the point?

If Long Rests at least trigger different events, then every time I play, I will probably have a different experience with the game based on how many Long Rests I take and when I take them.

So to summarize. No limits too long rest, all healing items etc are pointless. Make Long Rests trigger time sensitive events, now the items have more meaning and different events are triggered based on how many long rests I do and when O take them. Know, everything has purpose and meaning.

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I don't really know how this could be an option except if the options are :
- timer and game over
- no timer no game over

I'd definitely love timed events in the world for the sake of a living world but these 2 options wouldn't be interresting at all according to me.

The story is something else and we don't know it at all but I assume no one is really going to become (and play) a mindflayer.

It could be interresting if in exemple : the more you rest, the more the tadpole takes control, leading to specific interactions/dialogue restrictions, quests resolution and so on.

Something like a tadpole influence gauge that fills up when you rest. I think this could be amazing.

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Well, I agree. That's why I said that it wouldn't be about Game Over. Timed events would be about making the world more alive and offering different story paths based on how many days you take to do things.

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Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Time limits are a bad idea. How many really do you remember the role-playing games that actually have them?
I also do not understand the complaint that the game is not consistent in this respect. I guess some people here have never played any role-playing game.

Man, talk about making baseless claims that are also a complete logical non-sequitur.


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How popular was Pathfinder with its limitations? I don't remember that it somehow stood out for sale.
It was one of the most surprising success stories of the past few years and it's especially impressive given its TIGHT overall budget.
In fact its popularity dwarfed the far more expensive Pillars of Eternity II Deadfire (which was notoriously a poor seller even compared to the first, despise being arguably an improved sequel in many ways).

It managed to create a large fanbase despise coming off as a technical mess and taking several patches to reach maturity.
Also, on a personal note, it took a turn-based mod (which later became a native optional mode) to be finally enjoyable even in terms of combat. But I'm sure there are people out there that love that wishy-washy half-assed mess that is RTWP combat, so this is pretty subjective.

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Still, I havent seen a fix yet for long rest not overruling and nullifying short rest and healing items etc. Except to put limits on it of some kind. As long as people can long rest the game away without anything happening, potions mean nothing, short rests are pointless, etc.

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The amount of resting is not realy a thing in a lot of games.

Short and long rests are not an issue at all when there is no time pressure.
Game story implies that there is some kind of pressure in early game until we find out that the tadpoles seem to be asleep.

In pathfinder kingmaker the constant time pressure was a bit annoying, when you tried to do all the sidequests and build up the kingdom.
The thing in kingmaker was that the time pressure did not stop. Every single chapter in the game triggered another main questling with time limit. I would have loved to build up a prospering kingdom, but due to constant time limits this aspect of the game had to be ignored up to some degree.


Time limits are a thing hard to do right. Having them only story driven will result in some logic gap at some moment. Nagging around companions is (in my opinion) propably the easiest way to have some kind of "pressure" until the party realizes that the change to mindflayers seems to be paused.

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But the time pressure is more than the tadpole. That's my point. You should have some sort of something happening in regards to using too many Long Rests because:

1. Goblins know, now, where the Grove is and are planning to destroy it any day now. Aradin led them to it.

2. They Druids are doing a ritual to seal off the Grove, and what ritual would realistically take more than a few days?

3. Gith were seen on the Risen Road. Are they just gonna wait there for you to show up? Lae'zel would probably not let you dawdle because she is anxious to be cleansed by her down people.

4. Wyll REALLY wants to get revenge on Spike.

5. Gale has his other ticking time bomb condition.

6. Astarion wants desperately to remain free, so he really wants to find a way to control the parasites.

7. Shadowheart has her own Share quest she desperately wants to complete.

8. Oh, and yeah, you have a TADPOLE in your brain and even after they tell you it is dormant MANY people tell you that you could still start turning any day.

Story-wise, the game as 100% time sensitive. Over and over again they tell you that it is, but then the DM is like, "Nah nah. Don't worry about it. Long rest a lot so you can get all the cutscenes and character development. I know I said through all the gamr elements that you really have now time at all to do anything, but you do. Everything will wait for you until you eventually get to it."

But see, that's why I was proposing that they make it time sensitive in a way that isn't Game Over. The time sensitive solution I'm offering isn't a penalty to players but more like taking different pathways to the same basic conclusion depending on how much you use Long Rest.

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Rather than a traditional "time limit", if long rests could only happen on a few set locations, and certain cutscenes and story developments were to happen after key quests, the "time limit feel" would still be present without having an actual time limit. This probably also means that character progression has to occur outside of camping too, but why the heck wouldn't it?

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Originally Posted by andreasrylander
Rather than a traditional "time limit", if long rests could only happen on a few set locations, and certain cutscenes and story developments were to happen after key quests, the "time limit feel" would still be present without having an actual time limit. This probably also means that character progression has to occur outside of camping too, but why the heck wouldn't it?

What is the logical sense of limiting rest to specific locations in a situation where you have fast travel available with points at every step.

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Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Originally Posted by andreasrylander
Rather than a traditional "time limit", if long rests could only happen on a few set locations, and certain cutscenes and story developments were to happen after key quests, the "time limit feel" would still be present without having an actual time limit. This probably also means that character progression has to occur outside of camping too, but why the heck wouldn't it?

What is the logical sense of limiting rest to specific locations in a situation where you have fast travel available with points at every step.

You could also limit fast travel to also be in set locations to make this suggestion work, like how BG1 made it that you had to leave the Map at the edge to fast travel.

Personally I don't think Timelimits would work for BG3, for them to work for me it has to be a core part of the experience, like in say Deadrising, but with BG3 I feel like it would feel almost tacked on and stifling. But I suggest it as an options that it would work for cause a lot of people want it.

Last edited by CJMPinger; 27/04/21 02:25 PM.
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Originally Posted by CJMPinger
Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Originally Posted by andreasrylander
Rather than a traditional "time limit", if long rests could only happen on a few set locations, and certain cutscenes and story developments were to happen after key quests, the "time limit feel" would still be present without having an actual time limit. This probably also means that character progression has to occur outside of camping too, but why the heck wouldn't it?

What is the logical sense of limiting rest to specific locations in a situation where you have fast travel available with points at every step.

You could also limit fast travel to also be in set locations to make this suggestion work, like how BG1 made it that you had to leave the Map at the edge to fast travel.

Personally I don't think Timelimits would work for BG3, for them to work for me it has to be a core part of the experience, like in say Deadrising, but with BG3 I feel like it would feel almost tacked on and stifling. But I suggest it as an options that it would work for cause a lot of people want it.

Only if you limit fast travel to the current fast travel points it still won't matter because they are close enough to each other that you will lose max 1 minute more.
This method of restriction will not change anything.
At most, the game will get a little more annoying the moment you have to step back after each underdark fight.
For this to make any sense, 2/3 of all runes would have to be removed, which unfortunately would aggravate another problem, namely backtracking on empty maps.

Of course you also have to redesign a large part of the fights

Last edited by Rhobar121; 27/04/21 02:43 PM.
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Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Originally Posted by CJMPinger
Originally Posted by Rhobar121
Originally Posted by andreasrylander
Rather than a traditional "time limit", if long rests could only happen on a few set locations, and certain cutscenes and story developments were to happen after key quests, the "time limit feel" would still be present without having an actual time limit. This probably also means that character progression has to occur outside of camping too, but why the heck wouldn't it?

What is the logical sense of limiting rest to specific locations in a situation where you have fast travel available with points at every step.

You could also limit fast travel to also be in set locations to make this suggestion work, like how BG1 made it that you had to leave the Map at the edge to fast travel.

Personally I don't think Timelimits would work for BG3, for them to work for me it has to be a core part of the experience, like in say Deadrising, but with BG3 I feel like it would feel almost tacked on and stifling. But I suggest it as an options that it would work for cause a lot of people want it.

Only if you limit fast travel to the current fast travel points it still won't matter because they are close enough to each other that you will lose max 1 minute more.
This method of restriction will not change anything.
At most, the game will get a little more annoying the moment you have to step back after each underdark fight.
For this to make any sense, 2/3 of all runes would have to be removed, which unfortunately would aggravate another problem, namely backtracking on empty maps.

Of course you also have to redesign a large part of the fights


Well, that's the THING though. If it's too freaking annoying to travel back to a camp spot, people wont do it all the damn time, and instead will actually start planning for a few fights ahead rather than spamming the long rest button after every single encounter. However, you could also make it so that you always HAVE to find NEW camp sites, the old ones perish once you have used them once or maybe twice. =)

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Let me propose the following:

No time sensitivity from the moment you start the game until you reach the grove. (Again, though, unchain dialogues so that they are in order so that you don't miss any whenever you Long Rest. Otherwise, you are encouraged to Long Rest a lot in the beginning just to get cutscenes.) Everything is as it is currently. Then, you reach the grove and learn that Aradin led the goblins to the grove and now the goblins know where it is and are going to attack it within a few days because they now know where the grove is that they've been wanting to destroy. You also learn about the ritual, and you know the druids are going to kick everyone out in a matter of days. Once you talk to Wyll and Zorru, you now also have 2 more sensitive events. Lae'zel will want to hurry to the Gith on Risen Road and Wyll will want to hurry to kill the gobbo leaders.

So you have the following time sensitive events:

1. Goblins will attack in 14 days (14 long rests or 2 weeks). You have 14 whole days to make your way to kill the gobbo leaders.
2. Druids will kick out the Tieflings in 3 days.
3. Lae'zel will get antsy and pressure you if you don't get to Risen Road to the Gith, and she'll start bugging you if you don't get there within 3 days.
4. Wyll will get antsy about going to kill the gobbos, and he'll bug you in 2 days.

You use 2 long rests. When you wake up, Wyll bugs you about going after the gobbo leaders. "If we don't hurry, the Druids are going to complete that ritual and kick everyone out." But then, at the end of the cutscene, Arabella's parents come up to you begging for your help. "You were able to get close to Kahga earlier. Our daughter stole the druid's idol and disrupted the ritual. Please go and talk to Kahga and intervene. We beg you! She's being judged by a bunch of druids who hate us." You go deal with the situation or not. It doesn't matter. The point is that after you make your choice, someone in your party points out that the ritual has now been reset. That means you'll have at least another 3 days to stop the ritual.

You use another long rest. The next morning, Lae'zel nags you about going to her creche. "I'm not going to wait around all day. The tadpoles may be dormant, but they could begin at any time to turn us into mind flayers. Does this NOT concern you? If they are not acting normal, then we cannot rely on them slowly turning us into ghaik either. That means that once they start to turn us, we may have less than a week to be cured before it is too late. We NEED to be cleansed. Now!" Ignore her or not. Your choice.

You've not spent 3 days since you reached the grove. The druids are still performing the ritual, Wyll has bugged you to get moving and so has Lae'zel. You can still go about and explore the map all you want. There are not time limits or consequences so far. All that's happened is you've been warned. So the time sensitive events now are:

1. Goblins will attack in 11 days. You have 11 more days to make your way to kill the gobbo leaders.
2. Druids will kick out the Tieflings in 2 more days.
3. Lae'zel will get antsy and pressure you if you don't get to Risen Road to the Gith, and she'll start bugging you if you don't get there within the next 3 days.
4. Wyll will get antsy about going to kill the gobbos, and he'll bug you in 2 more days. He is worried so much about the druids kicking out the Tieflings, and he knows that if you don't do something in 2 days the Tieflings will be doomed.

You use 2 more long rests. Wyll urges you again to kill the gobbos or do something to stop the ritual. "Screw it!" He says. Then he walks over to Astarion and the two talk in low tones. Both leave. Cutscene ends when they return. "We bought us more time," Wyll says. "I offered Astarion a chance to suck my blood from my arm if he'd slip in and steal the idol again. He shot it with a bow from hiding and we bolted. It was enough to mess up the ritual again. Druids are pissed, but who cares. We have 3 more days now." Astarion grins wickedly. "It was a win-win for me, Darling. I got to suck his blood AND piss of those wretched tree huggers."

You long rest again. Lae'zel approaches you that night at camp. "Do you WANT to turn into a Mind Flayer? I'm pretty sure you do. We STILL have not gone to my creche to be cleansed. I'm not sure you're taking this seriously. I will give you 3 more days. If you don't get to the spot Zorru put on the map, I will leave and go there myself."

You now have the following time sensitive events:

1. Goblins will attack in 8 days. You have 8 more days to make your way to kill the gobbo leaders.
2. Druids will kick out the Tieflings in 3 more days.
3. Lae'zel will get antsy and leave the party if you don't get to Risen Road to the Gith, and she's only giving you 3 more days.
4. Wyll will get antsy about going to kill the gobbos, and he'll bug you in 3 more days.

3 more long rests later, you suffer your first consequences for taking over a week to do any of your primary quests in the game. So it's been, just to be clear, 9 days since you arrived at the grove, and you have 5 days left before the gobbos attack it. You don't really know this, mind you, unless you've played it a lot, but ultimately that is what you have left. So after 9 days, Lae'zel finally gets fed up because you still haven't prioritized what she wants you to prioritize since you first met her on the Nautiloid, and Wyll is also fed up because you have not done anything to save the Tieflings. So both Lae'zel and Wyll leave the party unless that very day you agree to do their quests. The crap has hit the fan. Once you long rest again, if Kahga is not dethroned or dead or Halsin has not been returned, the game is not over. No. You can still keep going. The only thing that happens is the Grove is sealed off. The Tieflings are kicked out.

So, to recap on day 9:

1. Wyll leaves the party IF by this point you haven't killed the gobbo leaders and brought Halsin back, OR if you haven't dethroned Kahga. If you do either of these things, Wyll remains in the group. As long as the Tieflings are safe in the Grove, he will remain with you. So, time sensitive event isn't game over. Shoot! Larian could even make it so that once you actually do start up the quest to take out the gobbo leaders, you bump into Wyll again somewhere near their base and he can rejoin. It doesn't have to be a permanent time limit penalty situation. Just something that makes sense from a story perspective that kinda urges players to move their butts because Wyll isn't going to just follow the main character around for 3 weeks while the goblins plot to kill his beloved Tieflings.

2. Lae'zel will leave the party. She's naturally tired of waiting because she wants desperately to be cleansed of her arch-enemies' taint. You have ignored her for over a week. Naturally, she's going to want to go. That said, again, it doesn't have to be a permanent thing. When you actually do get around to heading to Risen Road, you could meet up with her again. "My people tried to kill me," she explains. "They weren't going to cleanse me. They were going to kill me!" Then, the Gith, who have been searching for her to complete the task, find you and ambush you while you are talking to her. You took a long time, so it isn't game over or a permanent penalty. It is just a different path to the same conclusion; a path that makes sense from a timing perspective.

3. The druids kick the Tieflings out. Now, instead of them being in the Grove, the Tieflings are gathered all outside the main entrance. They don't know where to go or what to do because the goblins and gnolls and Gith are still out there. Again, not a permanent ending or penalty. Maybe Larian could have them take up residence at the Old Ruins where the Dank Crypt is for the time being, or they all gather at your camp because they have nowhere else to go. You would still have a merchant to buy and sell things with, etc. The ONLY thing that has changed is that they are no longer in the Grove, and the Grove is now no longer accessible to you...or is it! You found several secret ways into it. Maybe the ritual did not cover all the secret entrances. Maybe once Halsin is rescued, you can return into the grove and still save the druids within and with Halsin's help undo the rite of thorns. So again, it could only be a temporary penalty or situation.

4. Gobbos will still attack in 5 more days. Now, however, if the grove is sealed off and the Tieflings are outside, they will attack the Tieflings in a more vulnerable location.

Now let's say you are REALLY dragging your feet to get to the gobbo leaders. You use up those last 5 days. Still not a permanent ending. Nope. You awaken at your camp and are summoned to help save the Tieflings. Either you do so or you don't. Your choice, just as if you were playing the evil path. You have a big, challenging fight against the gobbo army wherever the Tieflings have taken up residence, and/or you abandon them and go about your business. Your choice. Even this doesn't have to be an end game permanent time sensitive thing. You long rest again and learn that somehow the Tieflings won, with or without you. Maybe some of the druids who didn't agree with Kahga went with them and helped turn the tide of battle, and the gobbos underestimated them. Whatever. The point is that SOMETHING happened because you took a long time. The world is moving forward and is active and things happen and aren't just waiting around for you.

And then, on top of it all, AFTER you finally do rescue Halsin, you can go and do whatever quests you want at that point to wrap up the first act. Once Halsin is saved, you visit Risen Road and fight the Gith, or whatever, you can, if you haven't already, then visit the hag, the Tyrites, the spider lair, etc. and do every last quest in the game and explore every last area of the starter map you want because after the time sensitive events are done nothing is necessarily driving you to move to the next part: the Underdark. The only thing, at that point, that would drive you is the tadpole, and as many have pointed out, they haven't started to do anything yet to the characters. So one could logically then take their time, trusting that they don't have to necessarily hurry as much...

...until the next set of timed events perhaps...

Either way. That is what I'm suggesting. It isn't time limits like the game is going to be over or there is going to be some major game crushing things that happen if you don't do things within a certain amount of time. It is more of a logical timing of events so that the world is not static but fluid and alive. It doesn't have to be the exact timing I've outlined. This is just an example of what I'm talking about. They could set the times as 1 day, 4 days, 6 days, 15 days, 20 days, or whatever. That's not the point. The point is that in x number of days something happens. In x number more days something else happens, and so on so that different paths are taken depending on how you are playing, offering different choices and so on and making it so that Long Rests MEAN something and so do potions and short rests and so forth. Again, if I can Long Rest however much I want, then potions, food, short rests, etc. mean absolutely nothing in this game. You might as well sell them like you do 99% of the items you pick up because it won't matter to keep them around except maybe just a few for emergency in combat healing purposes. The rest of the 15+ potions you get, just sell them. They're meaningless because after every battle you can just Long Rest and get all spells and health back anyway. And forget Short Rest altogether. What's the point if you can Long Rest however much you want. Short rest doesn't give you back full spell slots and health, and you can do Long Rests just about everywhere. So Short Rests are totally pointless.

However, if I know that I have 3 days or something before something is going to happen, I am going to utilize my potions and food and short rests a WHOLE lot more. That makes them meaningful and worth something to keep around. THAT is the whole point in even having them in a game like this. They are meant to be used so that you WON'T use Long rests too much. You completely nullify their value altogether if you have absolutely nothing happen when you use too many Long Rests.

Last edited by GM4Him; 27/04/21 04:28 PM.
Joined: Jan 2021
journeyman
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journeyman
Joined: Jan 2021
Besides the obvious issues with interactions and resting that are specific to BG3 (and need to be fixed), the problem with time limits is that how long is "reasonable" to do a task is completely subjective.

I actually don't like camping frequently (and missed a ton of interactions on my first playthrough because of it), but I do like to explore every tiny corner of the game world, obsessively organize my inventory, and mess around seeing how the game reacts to things that have nothing to do with the story, so I always take longer than the estimated time for quests. For me that's fun, and that's how I enjoy the game. As a player, I am curious; I like sightseeing and experimenting (even though my character wouldn't be doing that). I manage timelines and urgent tasks enough at work every day that I don't want to have to do it when I'm playing in a story-rich world.

I understand that some don't like the false sense of urgency in games, and I find it highly overused as well. However, perhaps the solution is not to create real urgency, but to adjust the story so that it's not overplaying how urgent everything is. If everything is urgent, then nothing is urgent. For example, in the druid grove they could be preparing for the ritual instead of having already started it. So there is still an ethical dilemna, but it's not as seemingly time-sensitive. If you do nothing, there will still be consequences, but less urgently. I'm sure that could be managed for many of the other story elements as well.

That said, I wouldn't have a problem if timed quests were an option that could be turned on or off. If someone else chooses to turn it on because that's what they find fun, as long as I don't have to, it doesn't affect me.

Joined: Feb 2021
veteran
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But my suggestion allows players to explore every nook and cranny. After you save Halsin, or whatever, if you still have quests to do then you can do them before moving in.

Again, my whole point is long resting heals completely. So of they don't do something about allowing players the ability to long rest after every battle, potions and short rests are meaningless. Just take oit short rests altogether, and you only need maybe a few potions at most. Forget food altogether too.

Time sensitive events dont need to be so absolute and drive players to chuck side quests. They can be used as a tool to make the game more enjoyable and repayable.

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