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Ok, so I haven't done a suggestion in awhile, but here goes.

Hit Points, HP, are a measurement of how hard a person is hit and how many hits they can take. So, whenever a person is hit normally, it is a minor hit. Depending on how many HP is taken off, that tells how hard the hit was.

A Critical Hit is a solid blow, usually to a more vital or weakened location. Still, you may roll low and not take off many HP. This, simulating that the attack didn't land hard. You may have hit someone in the head, for example, but it might have still grazed them.

0 HP means an attack finally landed with a lethal blow. So, until your HP hits 0, all wounds are not major. They are glancing blows and so forth that the character has endured.

This said, one thing that has always bugged me in Video Game RPGs is that EVERY hit looks like a character has just been hit hard, as if they endured an open gaping wound in their side or something.

Let's make BG3 different. If it is a normal hit, only a very little blood splatter each time. If it is a Critical Hit, a bit more blood splatter but not too much. Only IF the character is reduced to 0 HP should we see massive blood splatter, and if a Critical Hit reduced someone to 0 HP, let's see a cutscene where the character is really hammering the opponent, like in Skyrim. Arrow to the face, decapitation, run through the chest or stomach, etc.

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I wouldn't mind seeing blood being more uh dynamic as a thing added in the later stages. Could make it a graphical option where blood is based on percentage of health lost with an attack and how low the target is. While leaving that people who want no blood or ridiculous amounts of blood can have em as options?

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PnP we play that when someone reaches <half HP they are "bloodied," indicating they're starting to take noticeable damage (since we don't typically tell players the monster's exact HP). Prior to that they're essentially expending stamina & getting more exhausted. Maybe their armor is getting beaten up. Larian could do something like this, having blood pools only form then (and maybe on a crit).

If Larian includes an option to hide enemy HP, then this would be very useful for that setting.

Last edited by mrfuji3; 10/06/21 11:54 PM.
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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
PnP we play that when someone reaches <half HP they are "bloodied," indicating they're starting to take noticeable damage (since we don't typically tell players the monster's exact HP). Prior to that they're essentially expending stamina & getting more exhausted. Maybe their armor is getting beaten up. Larian could do something like this, having blood pools only form then (and maybe on a crit).

If Larian includes an option to hide enemy HP, then this would be very useful for that setting.

4e actually codified the Bloodied Status into its rules, where Creatures and even Player Characters would have things that would proc based on if bloodied or not. One of my favorite spells ended up being Summon Marilith who had an attack that hit three times and would do extra damage if the target was bloodied but also would hurt me as the summoner more through the intrinsic nature if I was bloodied.

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Originally Posted by CJMPinger
4e actually codified the Bloodied Status into its rules, where Creatures and even Player Characters would have things that would proc based on if bloodied or not. One of my favorite spells ended up being Summon Marilith who had an attack that hit three times and would do extra damage if the target was bloodied but also would hurt me as the summoner more through the intrinsic nature if I was bloodied.
Ooh I like that.

The more I hear about 4e the more I wish I played D&D when it was released. 5e is great and all, but the combat system can feel a bit...lacking at times. And the ~one positive thing the internet says about 4e is its combat focus.

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This can be pretty good addition.

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Since @Tuco (i hope taging is working on this forum) told us in one topics that he is actively Boxing (if i remember corectly), his insight could be waluable here. O_o

But i kinda cant help the feeling, that this sentence is wrong:
Originally Posted by GM4Him
So, until your HP hits 0, all wounds are not major.
I mean...
If you have 50% of remaining HP, you are technically half beaten to death ... have you even seen anyone who could be described with such words? :-/
Its not pretty sight. :-/

I mean ... it might not seem much, if you get hit by dagger for 2dmg ... but when you get 20th hit by dagger for 2dmg ... and you have 48HP in total ... you are practicaly almost dead ... it dont make much sence to me that you would have only scratches, since it all was "just minor vounds" laugh
And then sudently, when the last 2dmg hit will hit you, and you finaly fall dead to the ground ... all the blood that was for some reason remaining in your body should split out at once? laugh

I would be all in for reducing blood splatter ...
Right now, it seems like our characters have ben created by Quentin Tarrantino, wich means having around 20 liters of blood, since 3meters wide splatter dont even slow them down, or bother them in any way. laugh

I would be all in for action like finishing moves ...
Decapitate enemies was my favourite in Skyrim ... yet i allways rather look for Dragon Age: Origins, for cool finishing. :3

But honestly, i would not tie any injuries, or blood splatter to HP, or DMG ... since you only trade one nonsence to another. smile


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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Let me put it like this. If HP = Wounds, why can you recover full HP with a single long rest?

I've played many RPGs. I kind of liked the system in the old Star Wars RPG where they had Vitality Points and Wound Points. A character, like Darth Vader, could have 150 Vitality Points but only like 20 Wound points. The way it worked, if someone did a Critical Hit, it came off their Wound Points, symbolizing a major hit. If it came off Vitality, it just wore the person down with minor cuts and scrapes. Vitality healed naturally in hours. Wounds healed 1 per day.

That's not how this system works, though. If you can heal ALL HP by sleeping 8 hours, that means you didn't suffer any real wounds. Only if you have lost all HP and are reduced to 0 have you suffered a major injury that is now life threatening. So HP isn't representing how much you've been sliced up or beat up. Not really. I mean, who could heal from cuts or bruises overnight? The only thing that makes any real sense is that HP represents something more like Fatigue/ Stamina, not actual, real wounds.

I also like Fantasy Flights Legend of the 5 Rings Wound system. You have Fatigue. Each time you are hit, you suffer fatigue damage, indicating that you had to expend a lot of energy to actually avoid getting wounded. If you run out of Fatigue Points, then you will suffer a Critical Strike, which is a wounding. You can also roll a Critical Strike as well. Then, when you suffer a Critical Strike, there is a separate roll to see how severe the wound which will then apply penalties to tour character based on the severity. Again, Fatigue heals quickly, but wounds take days.

So my point is that if in a video game like BG3 you can heal HP that quickly, HP = Fatigue/ Stamina, not actual wounds. Sure, might also imply minor cuts and scrapes, for the most part, but nothing that hinders your character like a gash in the side or leg or something like that. ONLY if you are at HP 0, have you truly been ACTUALLY wounded. That is why you are dying at 0 HP. The enemy's weapon finally connected more seriously, and now you're in trouble.

That's what Im saying here. How many blood gushing wounds can an actual person receive and stay standing? How many blood gushing wounds can heal overnight? So shouldn't the blood splatter be minimal for small HP loss and much bigger when HP =0?

I like CJMPinger's suggestion of blood splatter amount is based on percentage HP loss. Makes sense. If the character has 20 HP, and a single hit takes off 15 HP, that character should see some blood flying. However, if same character receives a Critical Hit and only loses like 5 HP, it should not really have much blood splatter. Even though you hit the guy in the head, it wasn't very hard.

Last edited by GM4Him; 11/06/21 08:36 AM.
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Originally Posted by RagnarokCzD
Originally Posted by GM4Him
So, until your HP hits 0, all wounds are not major.
I mean...
If you have 50% of remaining HP, you are technically half beaten to death ... have you even seen anyone who could be described with such words? :-/
Its not pretty sight. :-/

a PC with one HP can fight just as long and hit just as hard as a PC with 200 HP with no loss in performance as long as they don't drop to zero HP so your idea of 50% HP = half dead does not match up at all. Instead GM4Him's view more accurately represents the status of the PC.

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Exactly my point. smile
None of it would make sence, since that is simply not how reality works. laugh
You will allways find some other problem ...

If you see HP as amount of wounds you can stand ... you have the problems you described.
If you see HP as some kind of vitality ... your wounds problems are solved, but it stop make sence once you start thinking about surprise attacks, poisons, traps or spells ...

That is why HP is not wounds, aswell as its not any pointer of amount of energy you can spend before you will be actualy hit and therefore wounded ...
Its simply exactly what tooltip sais, it presents amount of damage we can recedive before we die. laugh
And yes, it means that Baldur's Gate is existing in some crazy universe where your oponent can hit you with 2H axe directly to your unprotected head and you are still completely fine. laugh Or you can be hit with boulder that is thrice as heavy as you are, and still simply stand up dust your coat and walk away. laugh
It might seem mad to us, but this is simply how it works. laugh

Last edited by RagnarokCzD; 11/06/21 09:33 AM.

I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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There is an inherent conflict in trying to create an "immersive" wrapping around a heavily abstracted system. That's is, more or less, why I always felt that making games like Baldur's Gate more detailed is taking a way a lot of flexibility that a more abstracted and vague presentation can deliver.

As to suggestion itself:

I don't mind death cams (as long as I can turn them off as they get old very quickly) and differenciating between miss, heavily resistant hit, natural hit, critical hit could be nice, as long as they are all equally snappy. I definitely wouldn't want to see our attack be influenced by how much HP enemy has - graphical representation should first and foremost communicate mechanics - changing our attack animation (not talking about kill-cutscene-cam) based on enemy HP sounds unintuitive - might communicate less successful hits, while it is actually not happening.

I did always like in Wizardy8 how enemies get more and more bloodied as they loose their HP. Nice touch but it's less useful for a game with a top-down view.

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Think of HP like movies. There's a fight scene between John Wick and 5 guys. Every time they hit JW, it is not a major blow. He might even be fighting them with an axe, but he doesn't actually connect each time with the blade when he's fighting enemies. Only the LAST time he hits is it really a solid blow with the blade leaving the enemy dying or dead.

That is HP. You hit with a greataxe but only with the butt end or the shaft to the face or gut. You might hit the armor, but it doesn't penetrate deep enough to really leave a serious wound. You suffer bruising and some cuts and scrapes. Then, when you hit zero, the attack lands a solid, serious blow.

Even then, the save vs. death rolls simulate how bad the last blow was. If you stabilize, it still wasnt a ramming the sword through the stomach or decapitation. It was a gash and you were bleeding out. If you fail 3 times, then it was a more serious wound. Then, if the excess damage taken is more than you max HP, THAT is a decapitation or other insta-kill.

This is kinda how all RPGS are supposed to be. You aren't supposed to see fountains of blood and gore with each hit. You should see minimal blood or no blood with low HP damage and mild amounts with higher HP damage. Only if 0 HP is reached would you see lots of blood.

That's why I said, it is a small pet peeve of mine that video games are so bloody all the time. Its like blood bathes the battlefield with each hit, but then the heroes are all better in moments. TOTALLY not the way it meant to be in just about any true RPG.

And yes, it's fantasy, but again, the entire RPG concept is that it should simulate some form of reality. You heal miraculously because of spells and potions, not by sleeping and suddenly being totally uninjured. The 5e rules clearly indicate that HP is not gashes and serious stabs. HP is how many minor blows you can take before that blade or hammer strikes that blow that takes you down.

Last edited by GM4Him; 12/06/21 03:46 AM.
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Originally Posted by GM4Him
You hit with a greataxe but only with the butt end or the shaft to the face or gut.
And here is where it stops making sence. smile


I liked original spellcasting system more ... frown

Anyway ... i cast Eldritch Blast!
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If you say so.

So, you think it makes sense that every time you hit with a greataxe and deal 5+ damage that the character slashed the opponent with their blade? How many times can a person be hit by the blade of any axe and have it not affect their performance? How many people can recover fully from any kind of major cut within 8-12 hours of rest? A person with 50 HP can be hit by a greataxe LOTS of times and recover fully with long rest.

So, the only thing that makes sense is that the enemy wasn't hitting with the blade spot on every time. That's not how combat works. They grazed you, smacked you, jabbed you, but didnt actually gut you until the very end.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
If you say so.

So, you think it makes sense that every time you hit with a greataxe and deal 5+ damage that the character slashed the opponent with their blade? How many times can a person be hit by the blade of any axe and have it not affect their performance? How many people can recover fully from any kind of major cut within 8-12 hours of rest? A person with 50 HP can be hit by a greataxe LOTS of times and recover fully with long rest.

So, the only thing that makes sense is that the enemy wasn't hitting with the blade spot on every time. That's not how combat works. They grazed you, smacked you, jabbed you, but didnt actually gut you until the very end.

You know this isn't real life right? That it doesn't reflect real effect of being struck with a sword or axe or arrow? If it was based on real life, one hit by either in the chest, you would be dead. This really seems like your trying too hard to reach your conclusion. BTW, if you hit someone in the skull with the butt end of a great axe, you have a high probability of crushing their skull, or opening up a wound, that YES head wounds bleed 10x worse than other wounds.

If it REALLY bothers you don't worry, I am sure they will have a toggle to turn blood off, or the modders will have mods for no blood to gallons.

Last edited by Pandemonica; 12/06/21 02:10 PM.
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WHAT?!!! LIAR! BLASPHEMER! How dare you say it isn't real life! BG3 is an Isekai anime where individuals from the real world reincarnate in that world. If they die the game, you die in real life.

Come on. This is ridiculous. Why say things like that?

The point of an RPG is you are meant to take on the role of your character. It is meant to simulate real life so you can feel more immersed in the fantasy world. The only bots that are not realistic are the elements of fantasy which are limited by their own established rules; like magic.

You aren't supposed to play an RPG and have people getting hacked to pieces by swords and axes and then have them heal without magic by getting a full nights sleep. Healing naturally from serious wounds is supposed to take days of bedrest, etc.

And yes, of course it's a game. I dont ACTUALLY care that much. It was just a suggestion after I considered how the blood splatter in most video games including BG3 is ridiculously unreal. It is especially so if you can heal naturally overnight.

So again, only realistic explanation which goes along with true RPGing anyway, is that it isn't blood gushing wounds. It is minor bashes and cuts and scrapes that wear the characters doen.

But if they do nothing, whatever. Again, just a suggestion.

Last edited by GM4Him; 12/06/21 04:35 PM.

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