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Originally Posted by andreasrylander
Would love for the reaction system to be similar to Solasta.... along with just about everything else they did regarding rule implementations and such. <3

EDIT:
Here is the thing about a prompter asking if you want to take a reaction, and if so; what that reaction will be:
It *WONT* make things feel "slow" or stop the pace of the battle. Why not? Because it's on an enemy turn. It will just feel great because even though the enemy is doing things on their turn, suddenly stuff pauses and YOU get a say in the development of the enemy actions! It gives the player agency and control, and that wont feel like "the battle is slowing down" or anything like that, cause these things happen outside your turn.

I *TRULY* wish they implement something like that.
+1000

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Absolutely not a good idea. The way reactions are implemented in Solasta is quite bad, a very cumbersome and low effort translation of what a reaction is meant to be. I could not play the Paladin or Monk because I got so annoyed to be interrupted every single time. I still enjoyed that game but it is not a good example of an effective use of reactions in a video game.

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@mbpopolano24

I dont really blame you for not reading all 33 pages of this. laugh
But as far as i know (and feel free to corect me, if im wrong) people most often demand "optional" reactions like Solasta ... meaning if you want it automatic, its your choice. wink


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I'm also amused by the fact that they object... and then cite specifically two things which are *Not* reactions as their reasoning...

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Just my 5 cents... I played Solasta a lot recently with a team of reaction-reliant classes (Paladin, Monk, Bard and a Wizard) just to see how i feel about their implementation of reactions and pop-ups.

I have to say i did not feel that the pop-ups are slowing down the game at all (I did feel the animations are really slow though compared to BG3 and that is massively slowing down combat for me), however they added a lot of tactical thinking to my playthrough which felt really good. I really liked their implementation overall, as others said it was also nice to be able to do things on the enemy's turn (it spiced up the generic my turn, their turn gameplay loop) - so im looking forward how BG3 will try to top or match this level.

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Agreed Mat22 - just replayed Valley DLC with monk, and have played all the classes you noted (barring Bard). Popups are not elegant, but they give me the precise control and reactivity I need and that is important for my tactical enjoyment. That said, I do understand that some people simply don't like them and don't want to have to make these decisions with any regularity. I really think (as has been suggsted many times) the simplest approach would be to keep the system they have for those who don't mind, and to introduce popups option for those who do, perhaps with some additional configurability. From an implementation stand point, popups appear uncomplicated. But everything depends on the backend and how they have implemented when events fire - but the fact that they can support events out of turn order already in their existing reactions scheme means that it must be there? Things like smite are different, not being reactions, but for bog standard reactions, I don't quite see why it is problematic to expose more nuanced control. We'll have to see what they have done though - they are working on some alternative. [I have forgotten or not read all the pages of this thread, so maybe their is some technological limitation people have mentioned that means popups can't be implemented - dislike is not a technological limitation ;-) ]

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For the reaction system, it seems to me, that

1) Having a passive reaction system like we have now is unpopular, because it is too inflexible. IE you can not choose to only block attacks with the shield spell from strong enemies. The goblin attacks you, you cast shield, your reaction is gone, and the Minotaur attacks. This can be solved with some homebrew (like cutting word now) but that creates its own problems

2) Having an active reaction system like Solasta will slow down the game quite a lot. After EVERY attack of a Paladin, the game will ask you if you want to smite, bards have reaction for attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks, basically after EVERY dice roll in the game if you play with a bard, you will have to click away a pop up menu. This allows a high degree of flexibility, but slows down combat and is annoying

My solution:
Bring back slight real time with pause elements (might even make some BG1/2 purists happy). One key (lets say the space bar) is assigned as the "reaction" key.
During any animation, if you click the button, the game stops and a pop up menu with all possible reactions comes up. That means you will not have to select no for smites after every attack, but can choose yourself when you want it, without loosing flexibility as described in 1)

You could then also assign automatic reactions as they are now, with a toggle, if you want to. So if shield is toggled on, every time my wizard is hit, they cast the shield spell.
If shield is not toggled on, if I am attacked, nothing happens, unless I press space during the animation, and then select the shield spell as my reaction (if more than one reactions are available, for example a bards cutting word etc)

This keeps the advantages of both systems, and allows for flexible reactions without homebrew, as they are in the PHB, without making this a pure tactic simulator with hour long combats thanks to pop up menus every three seconds.

Tl;dr:
- introduce a reaction key
- individual reactions can be toggled on, if shield is toggled on, every time my wizard is attacked, they cast shield
- individual reactions can be toggled of, then, only if I press the reaction key during the appropriate animation a pop up menu appears and I can select what I want to do
- keeps the flexibility of the Solasta system without sacrificing the simplicity of the current BG3 reaction system

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We've been over this often...

This:
Originally Posted by Qoray
Having an active reaction system like Solasta will slow down the game quite a lot.

Is demonstrably false, and has been demonstrated and shown to be so multiple times. This is a fiction. It's not true or accurate.

This:
Quote
without making this a pure tactic simulator with hour long combats thanks to pop up menus every three seconds.

Is ridiculous hyperbole that only serves to make your other comments look dishonest and disingenuous.

=

Everything else has already been suggested and chewed over in the course of this thread, multiple times.

A system that can be set up in your options to prompt the player when reactions are available, and can be set to always take certain ones, or to never take other ones, or to remain as hands-off as it is now if that's what is wanted, seems to be generally agreed to be the best way to satisfy everyone's wants and needs, which is what we should be aiming to do.

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No real time elements in the turn-based section of a turn-based game, thanks.

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Originally Posted by mrfuji3
No real time elements in the turn-based section of a turn-based game, thanks.

+1

After much discussion on this thread about RT elements, it just wouldn't work, imo. The camera is in no way equipped to handle that, AND it would make laggy computers super hard to manage reactions.

Imagine it. Enemy mage casts Fireball. Lag. Camera is still on the other side of the battlefield. Wait. He's what? Tries to hit RT Reaction button. Too late. By the time you even discovered he was casting Fireball, it was too late for you to use Counterspell. Now, half your party's dead.

Yeah. No thanks. I'll take Solasta popups any day over that. They really aren't that bad, and if Larian improved the Solasta concept, popups could be VERY smooth and unobtrusive.

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Originally Posted by GM4Him
Originally Posted by mrfuji3
No real time elements in the turn-based section of a turn-based game, thanks.

+1

After much discussion on this thread about RT elements, it just wouldn't work, imo. The camera is in no way equipped to handle that, AND it would make laggy computers super hard to manage reactions.

Imagine it. Enemy mage casts Fireball. Lag. Camera is still on the other side of the battlefield. Wait. He's what? Tries to hit RT Reaction button. Too late. By the time you even discovered he was casting Fireball, it was too late for you to use Counterspell. Now, half your party's dead.

Yeah. No thanks. I'll take Solasta popups any day over that. They really aren't that bad, and if Larian improved the Solasta concept, popups could be VERY smooth and unobtrusive.
I mean, we got past dial up era. I can play complex FPS with 128 players with not a hint of lag so I don't buy this argument for a game as slow as BG3.

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Funnily enough, it's Larian's camera AI and game engine itself that causes the problem that GM4Him mentions, rather than actual game lag... When a new turn starts, the camera is Often slow to respond, and the creature it is switching to is often already moving, acting or otherwise taking their turn well before the camera has even focused on them - this is especially true of archers and other ranged-focused creatures. I cannot count the number of times I've ended my turn, only to have the camera essentially freak out as it tries to zip over to a goblin, who has already fired an arrow while the camera is in transit, and it barely or cannot even reach them before it's attempting to yank away in a different[/]i direction to show what they hit, but doesn't get there [i]either because it's yanking back to where they are now shoving something else - and the camera doesn't even manage to steady its focus at all until the goblin is more or less finished with their turn. This happens on the regular, and is something they've struggled to address through several attempts to improve their camera control.

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