Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General What games to play other than BG3 only?

I didn't play PoE1 at launch but I heard it was really hard. Even after all the patches and expansions PoE1 is for the most part a tougher game.

PoE2 over corrected on couple things, and difficulty was one of them. On release it was ridiculously easy, but it got better with patches. If you read reviews the game being too easy was a common critique.

Unlike PoE1, PoE2 didn't get an expansion but 3 DLCs - so some items, yes, but no extra power or levels. They are more like 3 mid-late game challenges/dungeons to test your party against (something that base game lacked). If anything thing by not picking up expansions you will actually miss the most demanding content in the game, aside from megaboses and beraths challenges (optional modifiers for later playthroughs). Some said that they made DLCs too hard, though personally I disagree but the DLCs do have some difficulty spikes.

It would be shame to skip DLCs - they are the best content both games have to offer, due to tighter focus.

As I said in another thread, I feel 2023 is going to be a good year for some great RPGs. I am looking forward to all the RPGs currently in the works from my major RPG studios:
Bethesda's Starfield
Obsidian's Avowed
inXile's Project Cobalt (expected to be a steampunk game)
Bioware's Dragon Age: Dreadwolf (may not release in 2023)
CDPR's new Witcher series (definitely not in 2023)

And on the indie side:
TA's next campaign DLC for Solasta
Owlcat's next three DLCs for P:WotR
Event Horizon's Dark Envoy
Tiny Trinket Games' Zoria: Age of Shattering
Early Morning Studio's Vendir: Plague of Lies

Edit: Oh, and also at least more details on the *other* three D&D video games currently being made by Hidden Path, Invoke, and OtherSide.

Cancelled...cough...

Well what can I say? I want early retirement. It is funny I was in work interview. They asked me what are you plans to do after 5 years? Truth would have been say... I do not work anymore early retirement.

When I do not work anymore then I have more time to play games. In addition while wealthy early retirement is stone hard challenge easier said then done even for me.

I did buy all DLC of Solasta though and I have already bought BG3. Truly there are so insanely much games that interest me so I think it is impossible I play through them all here from the video example:

From the OP youtube video:
8:30 Diablo 4 IV supports multiplayer with my brother.
12:58 Baldur's Gate 3 supports multiplayer with my brother.
11:24 Starfield maybe will check full review when released. Well maybe. Single player only.
21:03 The Awakener Arisen maybe will check full review when released. Single player only but very good graphics and like the style/art graphics.
24:46 Atlas Fallen maybe will check full review when released. Supports multiplayer with my brother. Well maybe.
25:56 Zoria Age of Shattering single player only. Maybe control 4-5 characters turn base combat fantasy. Well maybe.
27:57 Warhammer 40k Rogue Trader maybe single player only. Turn based combat Warhammer 40k World. Well maybe.
33:25 Avatar Frontier of Pandora based on the world with Avatar movies. Supports multiplayer with my brother.
44:45 Avowed by makers and same world as Pillars of Eternity games... Single player only,. Maybe and unknown if 2023 release. Well though graphics here is very different from PoE games perhaps like more like Witcher 3 controlling one person yourself.
59:48 Wyrdsong Unreal 5 excellent graphics. Multiplayer unknown and likely not 2023 release date... maybe.
56:37 Wonder Woman maybe if there will come full nudity mod. Wonder Woman the first movie liked it very much while second was quite average movie. Wonder woman was played by one woman that has represented a country in beauty contest for Worlds most beautiful woman. Single player only.

VtM:Bloodlines 2? Single play only.
Only maybe I do not trust they did axed the best makers of the game and I do not know it is very good game waiting for full release reviews.
Witcher next one? I am pretty sure it will not be released during year 2023 and I guess single play only. Maybe it is not that is not good game... it is more like see the long list how in hell would I have time to play all these games? Do you know those who make youtube videos about gaming? I bet most of them do not play through all games they make reviews about they would not have time for that seriously. Well and at least for now I am still working full time.

Well while I like Vampire movies and TV series not so eager for that game VtM:Bloodlines 2 will check full review before any decision regarding that.

I found more info and Avowed (BG3, Solasta and Diablo IV are not anymore only singleplayer games not comparing to multiplayer games)
Avowed might become NUMBER 1 single player only game for me perhaps in future when full release:


Well and even newer video info and some rumors (not 100% verified):

Avowed:
+ Unreal 5 elite effects and graphics and engine to run big battles.
+ Creatures will be based on Pillars of Eternity lore, but will make also new editions.
+ Over 100 people are currently working on it currently (more exist in company, but they work with other games).
+ Next GEN AI systems.
+ Big focus on World reactivity (means destroyable environment etc. I guess). lightning (graphics and dark work fire gives realistic lightning).
+ There will be real time weather system (this is super great currently BG3 or Solasta has no such thing).
+ Character creation is supposed to be very advanced and detailed (and reminds of Dungeons and Dragons).
+ You will be able to list help of companions (NPC none player characters).
+ Dynamic presentation of dialogue. Well not sure what exactly this means.
+ "moths" support is planned I do not have a clue what that is perhaps they mean game controllers joystick and such makes sense it will come out on newest best XBOX as well as PC.
+ BLA BLA lore spoilers.
+ Obsidian wants to make you able to kill anyone in the game so if you wanna fuck the main story and do whatever you want I guess you can but...
+ Of story I can reveal so much there is an uprising tyranny... so you can "try" ignore it but eventually I guess you will be affected.
+ On the other hand you can become part of tyranny movement and support it I guess kind of anti hero.
- The only big downside is that it is likely to be released year 2024-2025 and not during year 2023 according to newest video info above. Unknown release date.
Neutral ok since it works only newest XBOX and PC system requirements for max graphics is not going to be low I would assume. I do not have a clue about this, but perhaps BG3 system requirements or more.
Neutral instead of Pillars of Eternity or BG3 view this game might be first person view compare to Witcher 3... also to Skyrim has been compared but this world is not Skyrim it is based on Pillars of Eternity world. How this would work with NPC companions do not know perhaps AI can control them or you can control them I do not know.Well or could they have more then one interface view I do not know.

Ideally, Avowed is going to be to Skyrim what New Vegas was to Fallout 3: Simply a better (RP) game, quests included. (The origins of Avowed can be traced back to Faergus Urquhart voicing his desire to do a Skyrim-like game in the world of Eora years ago). https://www.pcgamer.com/obsidian-ceo-id-love-to-turn-eternity-into-more-like-a-skyrim-product/

However, a number of key people that worked at Obsidian back then for the open world of NV aren't there anymore so it's not guaranteed. What I've seen of The Outer Worlds is in parts pretty shallow in comparison too (there's literally quests where all you do is following a marker like a hundred yards, finished -- and the game isn't even open world as such). Elden Ring has shown and proven that you don't need quests that sort of solve themselves like that, and it's one of my biggest bugbears in games.

Still curious about more info. And: Pentiment (made by a much smaller team) more recent made for an interesting narrative experience. I'd like to see a proper conclusion to the main PoE series too one day though. I guess if that ever comes to pass, it won't be quite as "experimental" as Deadfire though. I thought the naval theme, including the ship exploration, made for a nice change of pace compared to your average "BG clone". However, apparently, that did not sit well with everybody. And due to the (for them) disappointing commercial reception to Deadfire at launch, if PoE3 ever comes to pass, they will likely by default revert to a less "risky" setting again.

If I understand combat will take some Skyrim elements (but still be different more like DnD world). Well and saying it is like Skyrim no thanks. Unfortunately I did buy Skyrim and the only good thing with that game for me was some community made full nudity mod that made all women n...

They certainly have more then one game and one game could be SCIFI but Avowed is going to fantasy not SCIFI. It could perhaps have early versions of very early versions of firearms (it is not going to be FPS game,,,,very long load time for firearms would guess), but I would assume they are rare and there exist DnD like magic.

Skyrim is a complete sandbox game. In a way I think you could go on mayhem rampage and ignore main quests in Avowed but I would assume very different gameplay you will have much clearer what to do and more would I say campaign like (compare to BG3).

I do not like full open world games like Skyrim. Witcher 3 is not exactly like Skyrim but I expect Avowed to be much less sandbox if you choose to foilow the story though of course you can do do sidequests and explore world at same time. Finally it is Pillars of Eternity lore and has nothing to do with Skyrim lore.

If full review would describe Avowed as complete sandbox game and unsure what to do etc no clear quests simply explore and venture forth. then I will save my money and never buy that game enough said. Oh and Elders Scrolls 6 whenver that game is going to come out do not care and will never buy it enough said. I did buy Skyrim when I got it for 10 euro (a discount offer) ,but even that was to much for that game.

Now I am not saying Skyrim combat moves are bad... I am talking about the complete Sandbox type of game.

If you liked New Vegas, you probably should be fine in terms of "sandboxing". The inspiration for doing Avowed was Skyrim though. And as it came from Obsidian upper management, the reason is naturally: $$$.

I played through Skyrim once, but it's as wide as an ocean and as deep as a puddle. I completely lucked out too. There's no restriction on character progression anyway (the same character can max out everything at once), but I focused exclusively on ranged weapons (bows) and sneaking. This made combat even pretty tactical at points (still remember making a huge ass spider in a dungeon vulnerable to fire via some special bows, shooting it, luring it into a firetrap nearby -- bliss). Both magic as well as melee aren't even close. But at least the world is pretty, GOAT.

Additionally, the puzzles they put into the game are little kids' stuff really (why bother then?) -- the dungeons are built in a way that all ways lead to exit , and generally, it's a game that plays itself via tons of (non-optional) markers, one of my biggest pet peeves with Witcher also (atop of the barely existent character progression systems and you watching a completely passive Netflix expeirence like 70% of the playing time). The few remaing AAA companies on their never ending quest to ever expand audiences (naturally) increasingly develop RPGs for people who previously didn't actually much like RPGs and got nowhere near even games such as Kotor or Morrowind. Which is why Witcher plays very similar to every open world action blockbuster out there, why there's such a huge audience overlap -- and why Fallout more recent had been turned into a shooter with every character stat pretty much only influencing combat anymore and a dialogue system that didn't tasked you with the burden of reading in between shooting).

That's fine and there's nothing at all wrong with that. Westwood tried the same thing with their Lands Of Lore series back then already (but failed due to a multitude of reasons). But: At least unlike 10+ years ago, there's alternatives again after like 70% of the industry had collapsed around the 2000s. And just like "New Vegas" was a glimmer of hope in 2010ish, every once in a while there's still a "Kingdom Come Deliverance" too in the bigger budget space. Maybe Avowed will be one such too.

Well I have not played any Fallout: New Vegas games not even first or any of them. I have said that Fallout: New Vegas or that generally FPS games are bad. Usually not my taste, but if talking about simple idea for shooter games it think Halo games nailed it for XBOX and some of them also for PC. Well and then I could like some old retro shooter perhaps but generally not my main taste though I like to be sometimes Ranger like shoot in MMO:s nothing wrong with that.

Rarely I do play shooters, but I can like PvP in MMO: and even you shoot with bow.

I did play Elder Scrolls 4 Oblivion and did not like it.
I did play Elder Scrolls 5 Skyrim and did not like it, but got it for 10 euro discount price for PC.
I will never buy Elders Scrolls 6 enough I do not believe they are good games for me.
I did like more or less Witcher 2 and 3 and that they also have nude women graphics though I would not say Witcher games are my best games, but good enough.(I have never played Witcher 1).

Avowed will not be modern shooter like Fallout Las Vegas games with modern shoot weapons.
Firearms and even perhaps cannons. but I would expect it to be like early 1600 or earlier time line in technology and it will have DnD like Magic and classes and characters.

There is example New World MMO that might give an indication of what kind of game is Avowed or even earlier then that technology.
I have nothing against if people play modern FPS games with modern weapons however Avowed will not feel like a modern FPS game so please give that idea a rest though you could shoot with bow, crossbow and perhaps a rifle/pistol with very long loading time.
Well and then like DnD like magic perhaps I cast Hold Person or Charm person or sleep on your Ranger that is going to shoot and he/she will freeze and tadaa there goes your idea of shooter FPS only games in Avowed that is not going to happen.
Well though I doubt Avowed will have any kind of PvP or multiplayer, but an AI controlled enemy could do cast spells.

Actually there is an upcoming MMO with Unreal 5 engine and Dungeons Dragons license that has high budget and is made in USA to my understanding. Reason I do not want to talk about it because it is so far in future example 2025-2027 release date unknown.

Well and oh yes I have been MMO player as well and like PvP in MMOS! Ashes of Creation MMO, but that might be to much PvP for my taste (not only voluntary PvP full PvP world !) and huge battles like 500 vs 500 players with Unreal 5 graphics that is groundbreaking record! Unfortunately that means Ashes of Creation MMO will also have skyhigh system requirements at least for biggest PvP battles.
Well though I like the developers of Ashes of Creation MMO and they have me respect. Perhaps I would try it, but not now in Alpha because it is like so expensive it cost like 500 euro to get access to Alpha.

The release date delay for Avowed is unfortunate but well worth it. Reportedly it is because Obsidian completely rebooted the game by abandoning co-op play and making the game entirely single-player.

Yes takes time because new graphics also Unreal 5 game.

It is only Ashes of Creation despite being MMO that have come really far (that I know for sure) of making the game in Unreal 5 engine. I am NOT sure Ashes of Creation MMO will be released in 2023. That said I am sure like 99,99% sure that Alpha 2 will come out in 2023 and that is great since ALPHA 2 should have all systems in (though some bug fixes and polishing in Beta).



The developers that I like:


Now Ashes of Creation MMO is not for those players do not like PvP.

Now perhaps I will try New World MMO.. please do not suggest Final Fantasy XIV to me tried it did not like it enough said. Well and certainly not interested generally in Asian MMOS. I have played example WOW MMO and Neverwinter MMO and liked them, but eventually got bored on them.


Now of what I disagree with that list? I would Rank Neverwinter MMO as B tier. It is pay to win, but you can for free access content and I did earn the fastest mount with lots of time playing and saving ingame money as totally free player.

Well and Elder Scrolls Online. They still have the fairly outdated ugly characters not super graphics in my book so since do not like Elder Scrolls game rate it B tier. Well and Elder Scrolls 4 and 5 lore and story have never ever succeed to capture me or their world.

Guild Wars 2 would be B tier for me it does not even have Direct X 11 graphics and no endgame to talk about worth mentioning that I find interesting. Lost Ark MMO? B tier to me. He rates Final Fantasy XIV as B tier? Well can agree with that but not interested to play it again.

Ashes of Creation MMO is not in that list not yet released. Well and the upcoming Dungeons Dragons MMO with Unreal 5 engine is so far in future so I am sure Ashes of Creation MMO will be released clearly long time before that even if full release would be towards end of 2024 for Ashes of Creation MMO.

I have played WOW MMO back in the days when it felt more hardcore slow levelup so probably agree with WOW classic S tier and WOW MMO A tier, but got so bored on WOW MMO so more interested perhaps to try New World MMO.

I was wrong. Ashes of Creation MMO is not going to be first MMO with Unreal 5 graphics full release.
Found out New World MMO does not have classes so not so interested to try it.

What game then? Throne of Liberty MMO aka Lineage 3 MMO.
What are the differences between Throne of Liberty and Ashes of Creation MMO in a nutshell?

Ashes of Creation MMO:
+ Record breaking PvP 500 vs 500 players MMO.
+ Lots of PvP modes focus is heavily on PvP.
+ Raids and good PvE content.
+ Mounts many types.
+ Weather systems and effect that are super good.
+ Housing.
+ Crafting.
+ Unreal 5 engine graphics and performance.
+ Personally I like the developers. They are in USA ( I do not care if USA or Europe but Western system money)
+ not pay to win.
+ Huge world.
+ Many classes and races.
Neutral: FUll PvP world.
Neutral: Action combat with some tab targeting perhaps. I am not expert on this have not bought Alpha
access for 500 euro and played myself on top of that they have made changes. However when Alpah 2
is released in year 2023 then I am sure we can get more info.
Neutral: I believe personally (I am no expert and have no inside information) that full release is 2024
that said some youtuber said he guess that this Ashes of Creation MMO is released in year 2025 or 2026.
- Well the biggest PvP fights with 500 vs 500 players will have very high system requirements.
- Monthly subfee if you are not willing to pay this is not for you.
- Early Access cost 500 euro not 60 euro like BG3. That said at full release the game cost more reasonable.
- not voluntary PvP
Conclusion if you do not like PvP and endgame content like Raids and Dungeons then I think Ashes of Creation MMO is not for you but if you like PvP and have good enough hardware in computer this MMO can be a paradise for you.

I am not expert on many details like housing or crafting exist? in Throne of Liberty aka Lineage 3 so will not mention them.
Throne of Liberty aka Lineage 3 MMO.
+ Unreal 5 graphics and it absolutely looks good.
+ Most likely full release in year 2023. The first MMO with Unreal 5 graphics.
+ They have pretty big fights also though not record breaking huge fights as Ashes of Creation MMO.
+ Seamless not instanced.
+ Voluntary PvP but how it works it is let in before hand when a specific zone is allowed PvP
if you remain and stay in the area where PvP begins you can be killed then it set that you have allowed
PvP. Personally I think this sounds ok.
+ Dungeons have many floors there is no loading screen between them
and you can buff players on different floor or give damage to another floor it is not linear.
+ You can like a Druid change to some animals for movement this instead of mounts.
+ Many classes and races.
+ Hmm I believe I could see some sexy females in this game.
+ Immersion World like WOW no loading screens.
+ I would say Lineage 2 was a success back in the days these are the same developer. I do admit
that I have never played any Lineage game though I have played example Asian Genshin Impact MMO
and Final Fantasy XIV MMO.
Neutral: I would guess it has houses and crafting.
Neutral: Dungeons/Raids are not instanced if I understood correctly.
Neutral: Made in South Korea.
- No mounts.
- Pay to win.
- No classes I dislike this!
- Aggressively Pay to win elements. In addition you buy the game buying is not a problem to buy but pay to win can be annoying.
On the other hand I played as free player Neverwinter MMO that also have buy to win elements
however how exactly Throne of Liberty MMO will be remains to be seen.

The way these MMO handle huge fights is different. Throne of Liberty aka Lineage 3 automatically reduces graphics in huge fights so it is not maximum graphics in huge fights in that game.

Ashes of Creation MMO tries to do the impossible make it look excellent graphics despite record breaking 500 vs 500 players PvP and in that mix can even PvE elements affect the battle if I understood there is a big Dragon in that area. That said for now I have not seen any battle in Alpha 1 that has had 500 vs 500 players, but pretty huge fights (and that Dragon in that area) they are optimizing the code. Remains to be seen how they can fix this 500 vs 500 players.

Sexy females in Lineage 3 MMO? I believe this woman can be a model from Lineage 2 MMO. Please do not look in spoiler (do not click for Goblins) if you do not want to see such content:
Well and the above content was around when Lineage 2 MMO was hot popular. Lineage 2 was released 2003 in South Korea and I guess arrived to USA and Europe slightly later. That content above is from year 2007.

Feargus’ mention of Eora Skyrim comes from before Deadfire’s release. We really have no idea into what the project evolved into, or what Feargus meant when using “Skyrim” in the pitch. Yes, he could have literally meant Skyrim but with Eora flavour. But it might have been as simple as “First Person RPG”.

The closest we got to some reliable information is Windows Central preview and that is an old preview of an old vertical slice, and according to Jason Schrier it went through some reboots and change of directors.

Well and what the fuck is this trend all new MMO must have action combat and then eve worse trend that no classes?! New World MMO does not have classes. Lineage 3 despite Lineage 2 did have classes will have no classes! Boring! Instead you pick up weapon? I do not care do not want some classless system!

Thank god Ashes of Creation MMO do have classes and that the far future in year 2025-2027 perhaps upcoming DnD game will have classes.

New Vegas took over Fallout 3's engine (NV is a spin-off created by Obsidian). Naturally, it has the same core gameplay loop in terms of combat in particular. Playing it in real-time, it is indeed shooter-ish (so was System Shock 2 back in the day already). You can of course turn on VATS, which is something else.

Still, watch this and say again this would be simply a shooter. This is way more nuanced and in-depth than pretty much anything in the AAA space since forever.

Unfortunately, it's also expensive to develop (not every single quest in NV is quite like that) and takes a lot of testing so... as said, New Vegas was my glimmer of hope back then.

Ok however Avowed will not be modern shooter like Fallout Las Vegas. Please stop saying that Avowed will be SCIFI or modern FPS thank you.

Of course there are other games that are FPS games.

Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 2 may be cancelled (for now) but the reason anybody cares about that one is that "Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 1" was a magnificent game. It was also an absolute buggy mess on release, but with community patches its one of the best RPG available, even though it is 20 years old.

I'm not a big fan of vampires in general, but I still think that Bloodlines 1 is a top tier RPG, and it is definitely worth playing, even though the graphics are dated.

It also feels more like a modern game than Baldur's Gate 1 and 2, so if you are worried that the 20 year time gap will be a problem, you probably should give it a try anyway. The game manages to be much greater than the sum of its parts (common for the Troika games in general) and it provides an amazing sense of immersion.

Baldur's Gate 3 is the game I play the most. But when I get burnt from it, I'll play one of these other games:

Old World
Distant Worlds 2
Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous
Interstellar Space Genesis
Galactic Civilization 4 (currently playing)
Solasta
Civilization 6

I agree have not played Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 1 but there are so many fans I know it was very good game even excellent depending on taste. Which is odd considering I have seen Tv series like True Blood, The Vampire Diaries, The Strain that are all more or less about Vampires. Well and movies like Fright Night I like them both the old one from 80ies and the more modern version and I have seen all Underworld movies. Of course many other good movies and Tv series about Vampires exist, but I wanted to mention at least something.

My biggest fear is that they are going to do with Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 2 what they did with Lord of the Rings TV series completely ruining it then it would not even be a 7/10 game. Perhaps I am being paranoid? That said a lead person who was behind Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 1 was fired is a red flag indeed since it is said he was like a spirit of what the first game would be. At least on Tv series and movies front there is reason to be paranoid now rumors exist they are going to ruin Witcher TV series.

As I see The Witcher 4 PC game production CD Project is in Poland and I am pretty sure it will not be ruined they have completely different culture in Poland (Well though Poland is good NATO ally so do not worry USA). I also expect same amount of nudity roughly in The Witcher 4 as in The Witcher 3.

I hope they do not cancel the game Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines 2 or even worse completely ruin it like they did the Tv series LOTR.