Larian Studios Forums Baldur's Gate III Baldur's Gate III - General Why play evil?

I agree with most of what you say, but I disagree that 'real' evil doesn't exist in the real world. You can be so far down in hate, jealousy, power hunger, desire, lust etc. that you'll commit evil acts fully knowing they are evil with little or no shame. To me that is evil. But to be a bit philosophical: Evil is not a force of nature, but rather an abstraction made up by man to emphasize all the qualities and actions we don't like in our society, and in ourselves and others. In fantasy you can be born evil, not so in real life imo. The devil was invented by man, to scare off people from commiting acts of evil.

Regarding whether it should be boring to play good (or evil for that matter): That is of course a matter of perspective, but in my views it is nonsense and simplification. Being human (or another being of similar intelligence) is always interesting because of the many layers and thought constructs of the human mind. It doesn't really matter if you are good or evil, there will always be dilemmas, contradiction in thoughts, emotions and relationships etc that make up individual complexity. Even socalled 'simple minds' are not so simple upon scrutiny. Let a person fall in love for instance, and all of his/her beliefs may shake or shatter. Good people become evil, and evil people become good. Excuse me for saying, but to say that being good or being evil is boring is a bit primitive and narrow minded, at least if you are taking it beyond your own preferences and playstyle. Not trying to offend anyone, although I probably will.

Btw, love your inputs, maybe we can all learn something, and broaden our perspectives on people, life and the world in general, at least a little bit.

I think we largely agree -- I do agree that there is something we could call modern evil which comes in a bloodless, soulless, bureaucratic form. I mean that sort of evil never becomes a force in the world that can be effected by, say, a dispel evil spell. Where in DnD if you are selfish enough for long enough the gods will notice your soul will change - you might even wander into the mists of Ravenloft. . .

But yes, you are correct, "evil" is crude form of analysis 95 percent of the time. But I can think of two important exceptions . . .

I'm waiting to hear from others before I try a Dark Urge play - I want to be like BG2 where you felt the urges but resisted them but it should like you cannot stop yourself from killing squirrels and that doesn't sound any fun.

Choise... I know how and what i like to do, and really look forward to as some say a more traditional "heroine" like run... But im also very curious and look forward to seeing and reading about how other people choose to play... It might not be my way of playing but im still thrilled by the seemingly so many ways to run BG3... See it like streamers, there is games i dont like to play for lack of choise, be it narrow pick of lead role, etc, and then i myself cant enjoy playing, but i might enjoy watching just seeing the plot and story unfold... i done this alot watching Cohh playing as a example...

I like playing neutral evil chars in rpgs, as long as it makes some kinda sense for the system and the world (loved f.e. Tyranny and my BG2 party included Korgan, Viconia, Edwina etc.).

I'm a goody two shoes harmonizer in RL, hobbies should offer some variation to your job. Evil rpg-playthroughs do qualify for that imo

I don't play evil because in most of the games the evil path it's stupid, irrational and meaningless. Usually doing evil actions you deprive yourself of good part of game content and in return you gain nothing but lulz.

It worried me that Swen said the reason to play evil was to lure of power, that can work, but if it's just getting new boss fighting moves, that's not a great roleplaying lure to me. Without a compelling justification for a character to do 'evil' acts its poor writing. When they talk about how the EA segment of the game has been reworked I hope it's our onboarding for the goblin route. That's been a complaint since day one it seems. That said, I imagine the inner monologues for all the origin characters might be doing a lot of the hard work there too.

Fantasy, like Science-Fiction, and all fiction on some level, is about experiencing logical and moral conundrums, and play acting how different choices and worldviews turn out. If the conundrum is a choice between power for power's sake, and achieving the same thing without it, it'll be as compelling as any of the evil choices in the previous games, which is to say not very.

Releasing the beast to play out great acts of senseless violence is another perfectly fine outlet games give us, most of the people I know who play Grand Theft Auto use it solely for that purpsoe, but it's hardly something to hang a interesting narrative on...looking at you Dark Urge. Thankfully it seems there's more going on there than just a narrative 'in' to murder every NPC you come across.

Im affraid you are corect ...
From gameplay in shadowlands we have seen in last PFH, narrator clearly states that if our character will join Harpers and attack Drider, they "blow their cover" ...

So it seems like Goblin route was decerased to meere infiltration.

Shame our character cant be genuinely interested in joining the cult, isnt it?

It's multiple layers of power. For one there is the personal power as your character will get insanely powerful gear, powers, etc. but it's not just that. It's also the story aspect of it that at the end you character will be in a position of power like becoming ruler of the forgotten realms and probably absorbing the power of several gods and so on. So there is a lot there...and it will all be very VERY good...the best kind of good...in fact you could even say you're playing a good aligned playthrough when you think about it.

I don't see anything remotely interesting about playing evil, unless you want to start out as evil and play an redemption story arc.
It's fine that the game gives us the choice to be evil, but it's not a choice for me. I prefer being a good guy and going full murder hobo on evil creatures like goblins

I simply have to ask: Level cap at 12 and ruler of the forgotten realms, how do these 2 match? Something smells odd. The level system in d&d is there so you can EARN your power through many, many hours of gameplay. I hope it is not a deus ex machina kind of ending.

I'm generally fine with being evil can lead to more power, like power positions in society and things like that, but there still has to be balance so that playing good vs evil is not just a question of how cool you want your character to be in terms of stats, skills and equipment. You don't need rational reasons in order to be evil, you can just want to fulfill your immediate needs and drives. But maybe Larian wants to tempt us into evil roleplay by offering rewards? I guess that's the conditions playing computer games, you can only play out the story that's made for you and by the rules made by the developers. In BG3 we still get option though it would seem, I just hope those are options I like

I mean in the balance of things this game will offer by far more agency than any other game ever has...over 175 hours of cutscenes to account for all sorts of choice combinations and consequences. So in terms of game limitations...no other videogame has ever offered more choice and likely won't again for a long time unless Larian outdo themselves with the next game.

I agree to the following statement:
good = you value the well being of others over your own
evil = you value your own profit above the needs of others

So instead of only having 2 options (good and evil) I would split the good/evil scale into 5 categories:

- strongly evil: You do evil things because you like it. You do whatever you want and you do not care about others. This does not mean you kill everyone. You do whatever has the greatest benefit for you and you can get away with it. You don´t kill a poor villager when the guards are standing right next to him (nothing gained, too much trouble). You don´t kill or anger someone when you need their help to achieve your goals (this can wait until after they stopped being useful). Often it is better to manipulate others to do what you want then to kill them. Even a complete sociopath needs a little bit of self control when he wants to achieve his/her goals. Killing everything just because you can will get you killed fast for no benefit.

- mildly evil: You do what benefits yourself most and you can get away with. You have no problem doing good things as long as you profit from it yourself. You avoid doing evil things unless you profit from doing so. When you do something evil you try to hide it from others.

- neutral: You help others except when doing it would cost you too much. So you will work to help others but you will absolutely not sacriface something importent from yourself to help others (not giving money or items to others just because they need it and definitely not sacrificing parts of yourself or your own life for others). You try to maximize your own profit without doing things that are considered evil.

- mildly good: You want to help others and you want to avoid doing evil things but everything needs limits. You will not put your life in danger for others and you will not do tons of work for free just because it may help others a bit. (example: You will not run into a burning building to save somebodies pet but you may give them some money so they can stay in a hotel now that their house is destroyed.)

- strongly good: You will help others and even put your life in danger for them just because you thing that this is the right thing to do. You actively fight evil forces even if they did not do something bad to you and even if you do not profit from doing so yourself. But even goodness needs limits. You don´t chase a goblin around the world just because he stole an apple.

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In that sense I may play a neutral char. I will generally follow a good path, but being deceptive or maximizing your own profit is totally OK as long as I do not do something evil towards good or neutral people.

My fovourite evil char:

Power doesn't simply come from class or character levels. Joffrey Baratheon was a level 3 dipshit. He was also the First of his Name, King of the Andals and the Rorynar and the First Men and Protector of the Realm. Palpatine was a level 30 Lord of the Sith or somesuch, yes - but he gained power through scheming and politics.

I think that the Dead 3 perfectly exemplify the various types of common evil in the Forgotten Realms. You have Bane the Tyrant with Lawful Evil, represented via Gortash who wants to rule and dominate. Myrkul the Necromancer with Neutral Evil, represented via Etheric, who uses any and all means to achieve his ambitions. Finally we have Bhaal the Assassin with Chaotic Evil, represented via Orin whose sole motivation is killing people.

Short answer? Why not, I'll be playing good and evil.

Longer answer: I really like helping all people I can in games, makes Paladins and such the perfect classes for me. BUT every once in a while, it's nice to play someone fundamentally different to my IRL self in a game. Renegade Sheppard, Swarm that Walks in Pathfinder WotR or maybe a murder hobo Dark Urge in BG3

Honestly in this game where if you go full evil you get access to a lot of different places and quests and such it's just much more interesting. I want to go there. I already know what the good camp wants...on no, we're in trouble, go find the bandits there, go save the kitten from the tree over there, help us set defenses, blah blah blah. Nah I want to go hang out in the evil camp...like when Kethrick says you have total power over the goblins that was fun...a lot of fun. I want to see a lot more of that. And being in an evil camp there are different dinamics at play...you get to play with a lot more subterfuge and deception...how far can I take that? If I defeat Kethric after establishing myself as a person of power and authority can I take control of the place? An entirely different way of gathering allies maybe...rather than running petty errands for the "good guys" so I can call on troops from a village or whatever, can I get myself some evil armies instead through subterfuge and cloak and dagger tactics? I'll take that over running petty errands all day every day.

No? All we know about the cult is they are trying to gain power, are willing to kill kids and want to kill us. There's at least one of those goals we shouldn't be into. Our goal makes more sense as a subversion, getting to the point you can take over the cult then bend it your will.

I don't like playing evil in videogames, because it is often the mhuahaha kind of evil and I like it more subtle approaches. I do play evil characters in pen&paper groups sometimes, but generally I prefer playing good or neutral.
I have a Sabbat character, a Tzimisce, whom I very much like, and he is not a nice guy. And in one Call of Cthulhu campaign I play a serial killer with a code (a bit like Lecter or Dexter) - he is fun too.

In BG3 playing evil is a bit trickier. I could try to play a Durge and still side with the tieflings, because I really don't see myself ever siding with the cult of the Absolute and Minthara.

You're not making a commitment to the cult of the absolute by helping Minthara, it just creates a real chance to infiltrate the cult and once you get there you can talk to NPCs do quests there, etc. How you play it from there is up to you and what's possible remains to be seen but it is a far more interesting approach than running whatever errands the other camp want to give you. It allows you to sabotage them from the inside or try to pit them against each other. Or who knows...I think it might even be possible to take over the place in some capacity. I definitely want to see just how much I can establish myself there before I fight Kethric and see if a power play opens up or not.

I don't like the storyline with helping Mintahra and frankly I don't like Minthara or the goblins at all, on the other hand, I love a lot of the tieflings and some druids, so easy pick for me. I don't do stuff, I don't like.