Originally Posted by Isaac Springsong
Originally Posted by robertthebard
I only have one problem with the premise: I was w/out internet for several hours today, and spent that time playing D: OS 2. While it's not Apples to Oranges, it's not the same either, more like crab apples to green apples.

1. Maybe it's Skyrim? Basically the same color pallete.
2. Yep, that's the same.
3. EA, although I'm not sure that will change, but if they want you to meet these comps for EA, there's really not a better way to do it. Then there's the whole thing you go on to point out later with the boat/ship similarities? Over how many thousands of miles do you expect the wreckage to be strewn, considering we teleported in, and then crashed? I didn't see anyone bailing off when we do see the ship in the opening cutscene, did I miss something?
4. Too many games to list for this, including a ton of MMOs.
5. Were you perhaps expecting to loot BiS gear for you and all your comps before level 5?
6. this, and 11, 12 and 13 are the same thing? Maybe I was playing Tomb Raider recently, and noticing all those empty bottles, and gas cans, and empty cans to make grenades out of...
7. At least "realistic", depending on the environment.
8. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but Backstab was in the original BG. It is also in most iterations of DnD games, and other games with thieves. NWN has Assassinate, and it can even be used with a ranged weapon.
9. Yep, that needs to be fixed, I love my rogues, and I want them to be rogues.
10. Oblivion, and Skyrim say hello, off the top of my head. With the added bonus of BG 2. Sorry, this isn't a Divinity Trope, it predates Larian. Still, kinda tropey, but it is what it is.
11-13 covered above.
14. Again, Oblivion and Skyrim say hello.

I'd go on, but frankly, I can imagine that the list will continue in this fashion, where there's 2 in 14 items that I can say, yeah, that's probably based on what they've been successful with. With the rest being a definition of trope before Larian ever opened their doors. Going on a spree of "well, that was in this game, and that game" doesn't do anyone any good when there are a lot of other games we can point to that have the same things, and some of them are far older than D: OS 2.


I feel like you might have a misconception of my intention.

This isn't a list of things that are 'only' from DoS. They are factors that make the game 'feel' like DoS, rather than a Baldur's Gate. Apologies if that was a confusion.

#3. BG 1 started you off in Candlekeep, a well known location and nary a shipwreck or prison in site. BG 2 *did* start you off in a prison, of sorts, but you didn't wake up on a beach, you weren't throw overboard. You started in a literally massive city. Compare the start of BG 3 to BG1/2, and then comparing BG 3 to the start of DoS 1/2.

BG 1/2 - You start as a prisoner in BG 2.....

DoS 1/2 - All of the things I listed.

That's why it's on the list.

#4. BG 1/2 had very few 'useless' items. There were some for flavor, but otherwise that was it. The world was filled with non-relevant items, but they were background art, non-interactable. The fleshed out the world without being cumbersome. DoS 1/2 on the other hand, chocked full of them to the point where it is literally a meme. Are some MMOs filled with useless items? Yes, but people don't seem to be comparing BG 3 to any MMOs out there, they are comparing it almost exclusively to the BG series and DoS.

#5. Nope, in fact you may noticed I listed the overabundance of certain magic items as a similarity with DoS rather than BG 1/2. Might want to read the full list. This is in reference to the absurd number of containers that contain....nothing. Not useless items as in #4, literally nothing. BG series *kind* of had that *occasionally* with the bookshelves, but more often than not those bookshelves at least had thick lore books to read in them (albeit most just copies).

#6 This one may have suffered due to my efforts at condensing list/just taking from other posters. If it continues to be viewed unfavorably happy to remove.

#7. Nope, please see -> https://forums.larian.com/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=719930. It follows neither the rules of 5e nor is it good for game balance, but more importantly the perspective of "King of the Hill" style gameplay being a clear import from DoS is pretty common in the forums and Discord server.

#8. Yes, sort of. But as you may or may not know, BG 1 & 2 didn't use 5e rules. It used 2e rules. It also didn't operate as Advantage for every single class but more as a class feature for certain Rogues. Compare that to DoS where any character could access it with minimal effort.

#10. Please see response to #3.

#14. Please see my introduction to this post, I don't care if other games have done it. BG did not do it and DoS absolutely did it. To the point where they literally reused the same DoS resources including the sound effects and certain icons in BG 3.




No worries mate, I was just pointing out that if someone had never played DOS 2, they may have a completely different take, because some of the tropey stuff is tropey for a reason.

In regard to 5: The question stands. There were lootable items in BG, BG 2, IWD, IWD 2, NWN, NWN 2 and on and on, that were there for the express purpose of being sold to a vendor. Useless for anything else.

7. Yeah, so is "it's exactly the same as Divinity". I have the experience from just this morning because my catalog of games I can play offline is small, to say "Nope, it's not exactly the same". I also have some real world experience to know that shooting from high ground does give one an advantage. I may have even addressed that in that thread, but perhaps not. However, even with archery, if you're shooting deer, you can get a clearer shot from a blind in a tree than trying to shoot through underbrush to hit it. Nothing to do with range, or damage rolls, just a purely factual representation of what it's actually like.

Regarding 8, see where I agreed with you about the rogues. Yes, I did know, I have a lot of experience with both BG and BG 2.

10: Yeah, as I said, it's a trope for a reason. Pointing at all the tropes to say "see, DOS 3" doesn't carry a lot of weight, especially if they were tropes before DOS 2 ever came out.

Wasn't 14 about food? Did you know you could be a master chef in Aion, about 10 years before Divinity? This is what I'm talking about. Someone reading this that's never played DOS 2 is going to be more like "what are they going on about, that was in Oblivion, or Aion, or (insert other games they may have played that had cooking)".

Last edited by robertthebard; 28/10/20 08:31 PM.