Originally Posted by Bossk_Hogg
They're actually good in this game. I'm referring to tabletop with the janky ass dual wield rules, pet rules, etc.

Are they really? If you looked beyond martial classes in particular being buffed excessively by tactical positioning (height/flanking), you might have realized Rangers aren't specifically good. Martial classes are generally strong (as are casters by unlimited resting).

FAVORED ENEMY.

* Bounty Hunter: Theives Cant never will work/Restrain ability not working. Likely meant to provide a slight bonus to the Ensnaring Strike (a pretty weak concentration spell that conflicts with Hunter's Mark). Investigation skill is ok IF your ranger is your party's lead/face, otherwise useless. Good/unique thematically.

* Keeper of the Veil: Protection from Good/Evil conflicts with Hunter's Mark and with the main role of Rangers (damage). The spell is largely made useless by height advantage. Arcana skill is ok IF your ranger is your party's lead/face, otherwise useless. Thematically too identical with Sanctified Stalker.

* Mage Breaker: Useless True Strike cantrip. Advantage does not stack and is virtually guaranteed by flanking/height. Conflicts with Hunter's Mark. Arcana skill is ok IF your ranger is your party's lead/face, otherwise useless. Thematically good/unique. Only one who sounds like it fits a "favored enemy" (perhaps feature would have been more aptly called "path".

* Ranger Knight: The clearly best and only "correct" choice. Getting proficiency in heavy armor is MUCH better than near useless (or worse) cantrips. Restricted to a Strength-build (rangers appeal thematically by far more to ranged combat), but choice made even better by how powerful/overpowered Jump and Shove (both reliant on str) is in the game. History skill is ok IF your ranger is your party's lead/face, otherwise useless. Thematically neutral, unique - but counter to what is the common perception of what a ranger is. Balance issue: Too powerful relative to the other choices and this limits real choices for many.

* Sanctified Stalker: Sacred Flame cantrip is WORSE than useless, one of the main reasons Shadowheart sucked so badly and much worse on a martial class. Religion is ok IF your ranger is your party's lead/face, otherwise useless. Thematically BAD, what does the flashy Sacred Flame and book knowledge have thematically with stalking/stealth? Nothing. Besides being much too similar to Keeper of the Veil.


NATURAL EXPLORER.

* Beast Tamer: Find Familiar. Mostly flavor. Micromanagement heavy for very little use. Weak to useless depending upon party.

* Urban Tracker: Open locks. Pretty decent, a four member party needs alternatives to having a dedicated rogue. The "correct" choice given it is the only that provides party composition versatility. Still mostly meh.

* Wasteland Wanderer: Cold: Setting dependent. Likely pretty rare. Ranged rangers much less targeted and will see little use.

* Wasteland Wanderer: Fire: Setting dependent. Fire is uncommon. More common if enemy AI get improved to use weapon dipping or a more immersive equivalent. Ranged rangers much less targeted and will see little use.

* Wasteland Wanderer: Poison: Setting dependent. Uncommon to rare. Ranged rangers much less targeted and will see little use.


Let's compare with the Revised Ranger/Unearthed Arcana (that likely is on the strong side):

Favored Enemy: +2 dmg vs. enemy type of choice: Beast, fey, humanoid, monstrosities, or undead. Some largely flavor abilities.
Natural Explorer: Ignore difficult terrain, advantage on initiative rolls, advantage on attacks vs. enemies that haven't acted yet. Added flavor abilities.

My main observations:

1. Larian's homebrew is, outside the tactical positioning advantage on attack rolls that ALL classes benefit from (martial most of course), not a needed buff to Rangers in general. It's merely a BG3 adaptation of the universally reviled PHB Ranger.
2. There's an ENORMOUS discrepancy between what WotC considers appropriate buffs and what Larian did.
3. Larian's homebrew is needlessly specific and complex. Larian removes PHB "trap choices" and goes out of their way to introduces their own trap choices. Critical miss by design team! Consider Larian's Hunter Ranger. Favored Enemies: 5 choices. Natural Explorer: 5 choices. Hunter subclass: 3 choices. Unlucky 13 choices by level 3 (then add all the normal choices for Rangers). These are all avenues where especially players without metaknowledge is very likely to regret their choices without having any recourse.

Suggestions:

1. Use (weakened form) of Revised Ranger/WotC's unofficial material. Considerably more elegant and generalized changes than Larian's needlessly complex and mostly useless homebrew.
2. Address a very common complaint, virtually guaranteed and over-incentivized flanking/height bonuses that causes a HOST of balancing issues that in turn will require loads of needless and unpopular homebrew. Reduce to a small flat bonus would be enough to incentivize tactical positioning (which is clever design).

Last edited by Seraphael; 01/03/21 07:42 PM.