Originally Posted by ash elemental
Originally Posted by GM4Him
Good is law and order abided by in conjunction with love, compassion, mercy and forgiveness.

Without law, anything goes, and it is survival of the fittest. Savage brutes can get away with whatever they want without fear, but those who are weaker must fear constantly.
That is a common misconception. Altruism, empathy, cooperation, all this is not limited to humans and is observed among animals without the need for human laws. That is because "the fittest" doesn't mean the strongest and nature isn't a shooter game.

-I find this line of thinking very interesting. What makes people think that animals don't have their own laws that they live by?

There are laws that govern everything that exists. Down to the smallest particle, there are laws that dictate how things behave. If there was no law, we wouldn't be able to exist. Just as one example, what would any of us do without the law of gravity?

We're not just talking human law here. Certainly not. Human law is more often than not quite fallible. But some laws are natural, are they not?

For example, does a person need to be told that lying is wrong? Does a person need to be told that murdering small children is wrong? If a 5-year-old murdered another 5-year-old, would anyone even question whether or not that was good? No. Anyone who would think that a five-year-old killing another 5-year-old is good, we would think that person had something wrong with them. Nobody needs to tell anyone that murdering a 5-year-old is bad. Instinctively, there is a law within our nature that tells us that that scenario is just wrong.

Likewise, animals have their own natural laws. They are not the same as ours. Wolves have no remorse for killing anyone or anything because there is no law within them that says it's wrong. Likewise, it goes against the natural law of a wolf to not travel in a pack. Pack mentality exists because there are natural laws that dictate to wolves how they should behave. Without those laws, we would not see wolves organize into packs.

Therefore, some animals exhibit similar moral laws to humans simply because the laws that they live by by nature dictate to them that that is how they should behave. Unfortunately, humans don't seem to necessarily like to behave by the nature within them that tells them what is good. Because of our pride and selfishness, we tend to create our own laws that we think are superior to good moral laws so that we can elevate ourselves above one another and manipulate and control one another.

This is why humans are the cruelest species on the planet. Many of us ignore what nature would tell us is good. We do what we want, when we want, and where we want, and we don't like other people to tell us what is good or bad. We want to decide that all for ourselves. We want to be our own rulers and not have other people tell us how to live, including the very nature within ourselves. Pride elevates us to a place where we desire to be our own masters instead of letting any laws dictate that for us.

The human race therefore is actually one of the most chaotic races, if not the most chaotic race, in the world. This is why we have so many terrible, brutal Wars. No other race on Earth devastates the world like we do. Could it be because we are so chaotic?

How does this relate to the topic? Moral lines need to be drawn somewhere. My question is, where do we draw the line? When do we step into the realm of something being too messed up? There is a reason why most video games don't have children in it. The reason is that by nature we humans don't typically like to butcher children of any race.

So, has bg3 crossed the line? Should they just remove the ability to kill any children from the game so players don't have to have that moral dilemma? Should they make it so that you can kill all the children? What is too far? What comes after this? Shall we allow players to be able to beat up, abuse, and torture children? I mean, after all, if some smart butt kid taunts my evil drow sorcerer, wouldn't he retaliate by kidnapping them and dragging them into some sort of dark place and then torturing and killing them? If I'm playing my role correctly, wouldn't that be what he would do? Is that really something they should build into the game just because my evil drow would do that?

Last edited by GM4Him; 15/02/22 02:17 PM.