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Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Anuh] #655983
03/10/19 01:09 PM
03/10/19 01:09 PM
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Artagel Offline
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Wtf?

Originally Posted by Anuh
It seems that this "raging debate" turned into regular bickering. It will be good to hear someone from developers team so this thread at least will have meaningful ending.

The only meaningful ending will come when Larian finally shows the gameplay footage they were supposed to have shown this summer, and either a ton of pre-orders get cancelled, or a forum full of fanboys crash their own message board.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Brent2410] #655985
03/10/19 05:51 PM
03/10/19 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Brent2410

I literally timed it... And didn't include any time that you weren't in control of your characters. Sorry objective fact isn't legit enough for you. If this doesn't showcase the fanboy gatekeeping, then nothing does. Thanks for proving my point while trying to argue against it though.

Edit: I was even generous enough to include the time you spent attacking something longer than you needed to during time stop into the "active combat" time...

I don't know what you included in your timing, but even if you include all the time for setting up traps and inventory management, what I'd call "preparation" is only roughly 3 minutes. But then how else do you use trap spells/skills? And inventory management is disallowed too? You don't have to manage inventory and don't have to move characters around in TB, right? So yeah, you'll have to excuse me if I don't trust your "literally timed it".

You wanted a video on that fight in real time. I gave you that. Then you started to nit-pick at completely irrelevant factors. You started acting like "not playing on Insane" is a problem. The original argument was about the systems, wasn't it? RTWP vs. TB. And somehow playing on the intended difficulty is suddenly a problem now? If you don't already know, the system revolves around Core Rules. And you "lol"d when I said it wasn't tedious for me. I used all spells as they are supposed to be used. If this is tedious for you, fair enough. But you don't get to decide if it is tedious for me or anyone else. If this is tedious for you, then the game's not for you. Looks to me like you were just trying a bit too hard there to "win" the argument based on irrelevant factors. Well, nice try.

Most importantly, any "preparation" I did was *outside of combat*. Meaning the preparation that you laughed at has nothing to do with whether the system is RTWP or TB, which is the original issue that started all this. So you're clearly just making fun of the attempt in order to try to "stay relevant", as if your arguments still have some meaning or validity. Unless you're trying to tell me that in a TB game "out-of-combat preparations" doesn't exist, at all. Now this is just plain stupid.

In the end, what this whole video challenge drama shows is that you know almost nothing about how this game is supposed to be played. After all, you simply can't know much about a game whose core mechanics you dislike. There's nothing wrong with not knowing much about a game. It's just that I find it laughable when someone talks all sorts of bs while pretending the opposite, and then acts like a complete loser when the argument starts getting serious. Simple as that. There's nothing wrong with disliking the game, either. You'll have to accept the fact that there are plenty of others who can enjoy exactly the same thing that bores you. You can keep "lol"ing if that makes you feel more secure or if that's the best you can do to undermine someone else's argument.

So are you out of here yet?

Last edited by Try2Handing; 03/10/19 10:10 PM.

"We make our choices and take what comes and the rest is void."
Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Try2Handing] #655986
03/10/19 06:04 PM
03/10/19 06:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Sordak
Im mereley observing a trend that people with very few posts make accounts to specifically post in this thread, having opinions very simmilar to other accounts with very few posts that specifically post in this thread.

That is something you can't prove, isn't it? There's nothing unusual about new members coming in sharing similar opinion. This topic is pinned, after all. And there are only really a few opinions: either you're for TB, or you're for RTWP, or neither. So naturally there will be many who share the same opinions...

Last edited by Try2Handing; 03/10/19 06:12 PM. Reason: I'm just going to double-post

"We make our choices and take what comes and the rest is void."
Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656003
04/10/19 03:22 AM
04/10/19 03:22 AM
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Knock it off with the accusations of forum members being sock-puppets and asserting what other people's opinions are, please. Discuss the pros and cons of the subject, and the speculation if you must, but be civil.


J'aime le fromage.
Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Artagel] #656008
04/10/19 12:05 PM
04/10/19 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Artagel
Lot of possible pre-orders just floating in the air...

Originally Posted by Artagel
...when Larian finally shows the gameplay...

You absolutely right. I wonder, what is wrong with putting few lines of text on the BG3's site? "It will D&D5, it will be in 2.5D/3D, it will be same/different combat, it will be great". I mean, why keep suspense on this? By all means hide the scenario details, just tell us, what are you making - submarine or a plane.

I remembering what had happen with "Torchlight". When developers making the second part, they told - it will "...serving as an intermediate step toward long before planned MMO". Imagine, what would happen if they waited till the last moment and said: aaaaaand it will be free-to-play MMO. And reaction of those, who awaited usual single player - What, why, how? Second "Second DotA"? Another Red shirt guy moment.

That talk about burning chair in the interview with Mr. Vincke make me worried. What it will be - funny cutscene during dialogue or a "combo move button" on the spell bar in Turn-based battle? Say, on 27th turn "rage bar" is charged and you can apply this move. NWN2-MoB-style bar. But where do you take this chair, if your character standing in the opposite corner? If in RTwP you will run to it, your enemy will just move away. Your party leader, his enemy and this chair must be pretty close. They must be prepositioned when battle begins. This situation more likely indicates turn-based style.

And then Mr. Mearls said: "...coming to life in the authentic way in Baldur's Gate 3." And i don't know what to await now.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: vometia] #656024
05/10/19 12:24 AM
05/10/19 12:24 AM
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Originally Posted by vometia
Knock it off with the accusations of forum members being sock-puppets and asserting what other people's opinions are, please. Discuss the pros and cons of the subject, and the speculation if you must, but be civil.

Wanted to ask you if the latest update to Greedfall had much effect.

I keep hearing from ppl that it's a hell of a lot of fun.

Last edited by Artagel; 05/10/19 12:26 AM.
Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Anuh] #656025
05/10/19 12:34 AM
05/10/19 12:34 AM
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Artagel Offline
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Originally Posted by Anuh
You absolutely right. I wonder, what is wrong with putting few lines of text on the BG3's site? "It will D&D5, it will be in 2.5D/3D, it will be same/different combat, it will be great". I mean, why keep suspense on this? By all means hide the scenario details, just tell us, what are you making - submarine or a plane.

I remembering what had happen with "Torchlight". When developers making the second part, they told - it will "...serving as an intermediate step toward long before planned MMO". Imagine, what would happen if they waited till the last moment and said: aaaaaand it will be free-to-play MMO. And reaction of those, who awaited usual single player - What, why, how? Second "Second DotA"? Another Red shirt guy moment.

That talk about burning chair in the interview with Mr. Vincke make me worried. What it will be - funny cutscene during dialogue or a "combo move button" on the spell bar in Turn-based battle? Say, on 27th turn "rage bar" is charged and you can apply this move. NWN2-MoB-style bar. But where do you take this chair, if your character standing in the opposite corner? If in RTwP you will run to it, your enemy will just move away. Your party leader, his enemy and this chair must be pretty close. They must be prepositioned when battle begins. This situation more likely indicates turn-based style.

And then Mr. Mearls said: "...coming to life in the authentic way in Baldur's Gate 3." And i don't know what to await now.

I was not here obviously for the DOS 2 release, but I'm sure there were more updates and info prior to release than this.

You're the 2nd or 3rd person to say these things he's said in interviews "indicates it will be TB", but I re-listen and it just sounds like the kinds of things you can only do in a tabletop setting and it's more then likely an example of some D&D situation Mearls told him about one time and he's just repeating it there. For what reason, I don't know.

Honestly, I would just like to know the time frame. Is it being released in 2019? Is it 2 years away? Why the tease? Do they just enjoy this thread and want it to go on and on?

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Artagel] #656028
05/10/19 03:59 AM
05/10/19 03:59 AM
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vometia Offline

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Originally Posted by Artagel
Wanted to ask you if the latest update to Greedfall had much effect.

I keep hearing from ppl that it's a hell of a lot of fun.

Not sure, I'd already done two fairly complete play-throughs by the time it came out and I'm not quite ready for a third! It's mostly bug-fixes, I think, and though there were some reported howlers my personal experience is that it was remarkably bug-free game for something with some fairly complex and interwoven quests. It apparently addresses one of the biggest gripes I had at the outset which was terrible motion sickness, but after a day or two I habituated to it (sometimes I do, sometimes I don't), partly in conjunction with increasing the FoV to the widest-but-one setting and reducing the mouse sensitivity from about halfway to a quarter. And sprinting everywhere, since endurance isn't a worry.

If the Bioware itch needs scratching I would strongly recommend it. IMHO its strengths are the fairly interesting personal quests and well-written characters. Setting is a mixed bag: beautiful and hand-made rather than auto-generated, though the over-use of a brown filter and Dragon Age style re-use of interiors detracts a little; plus it's not truly open-world, again like DA, though some of the regions are quite large.

Voice acting is excellent; subtitles are mixed, seemingly having some (well, most) done by a proper translator and a few being sometimes a bit Zero Wing.

Most of the "this is awesome but..." is the result of them being a tiny studio, which other people are varyingly forgiving about, the detractors pointing out that having a AAA price tag it should be a AAA quality game. I'd say overall it is, my main feeling being that it's a little short compared to what I'm used to at around 35 hours if you do everything. Then again, that's twice as much as you tend to get from a typical shooter.

So if you want more Bioware-style gameplay I'd definitely recommend it, but it's very different from the Original Sins. And not having played the BG series I'm not sure where that fits in: from what I've gleaned, somewhere in the middle.

It also has its share of meme-friendly arrow-to-the-knee style lines, and I'm going to be forever stuck with the mental image of a grinning Kurt bursting into the room in the middle of the romance scene yelling, "stand aside, things are about to get dicey!"

Last edited by vometia; 05/10/19 01:19 PM. Reason: I can't type. Again.

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Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656031
05/10/19 09:36 AM
05/10/19 09:36 AM
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Where is this game available for pre-order? I can't find it.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: 0Muttley0] #656032
05/10/19 12:02 PM
05/10/19 12:02 PM
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Originally Posted by 0Muttley0
Where is this game available for pre-order? I can't find it.


Nowhere, Larian started preorders yet.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656040
05/10/19 03:47 PM
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It amazes me folks are still argueing over RTwP vs TB still, what is left to be said until Larian starts releasing details on BG 3.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Hawke] #656053
06/10/19 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Hawke
Originally Posted by 0Muttley0
Where is this game available for pre-order? I can't find it.


Nowhere, Larian started preorders yet.


I thought so. No idea why people are claiming that people are going to be cancelling their pre-orders in that case.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: 0Muttley0] #656055
06/10/19 03:40 PM
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Originally Posted by 0Muttley0
I thought so. No idea why people are claiming that people are going to be cancelling their pre-orders in that case.

It's a statement of intent. Once it's available for pre-order, they'll pre-order it so they can cancel it. It's what I would do if I was sufficiently outraged about whatever was outraging me at the time.


J'aime le fromage.
Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656271
17/10/19 10:29 AM
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There are a lot of good turn based adaptations like ToEE and Pool of Radiance 2 : Ruins of myth drannor and a lot of good real time with pause adaptations like NWN1/2, BG1/2, etc. What i never saw is a "lets ignore the rules" adaptation who managed to be good.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656362
23/10/19 12:30 AM
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So, this might be a moot argument because it turns out we can have both. Not sure how it was pulled off but Pathfinder: Kingmaker its RTWP and a pretty good one. I downloaded a turn-based mod and it worked nearly flawlessly. Just like you'd expect a turn based to work. As long as Larian implements mechanics in a similar way to that game we should be able to have both.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656367
23/10/19 08:24 AM
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which kind of assumes that well have a standard system, im fairly sure the comabt system will be seperate to both of these and the way the rules are altered wont make those two systems an option.

at this point id be willing to bet money on it

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Sordak] #656369
23/10/19 09:11 AM
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Swen said that they have already decided on a combat system and that it only has one.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: Hawke] #656374
23/10/19 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Hawke
Swen said that they have already decided on a combat system and that it only has one.

Yeah and this has been repeated like a million times on every forum out there and including in this forum and people still keep bring up their fantasy of having both. I don't get it.

My only hope is that their TB system will be moddable such that someone will make a decent RTwP mod for the game.

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: kanisatha] #656459
31/10/19 07:47 PM
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I hope it's strictly RTwP only because I'd like to organize the way I fight with picking whichever character I want to order around first then proceed from there. Every turned based game that part is automatic which I strongly dislike. RTwP lets me organize my long range fighters and spell casters first then I can send in the close ranger fighters etc. Just makes more sense to me. Gives me more of a sense of being able to control my party better. But that may just be me...

Re: ragin debate: active pause vs turn per turn [Re: fireflame] #656480
02/11/19 06:05 PM
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This thread has been drained to the marrow, but it still keep going like some unkillable form of undead zombie.

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