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Re: Could be a good original idea #326691
02/12/07 04:11 AM
02/12/07 04:11 AM
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Raze Offline

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The game needs to "remember" the mana regeneration rate for the different walkpoints the player passes through.

The game would have to change music and environmental sounds (etc) when changing areas anyway, so changing regeneration rate should not be too hard, as long as it is constant within each major area. If there are going to be variations (a cursed building with a lower regeneration than the surrounding forest, or an oasis with higher rate than the desert) perhaps those areas could be designed as a mini-level.

Whether you would want to vary the regeneration rate (effecting specific character builds much more than others) or if this feature would be the best use of resources during development are other matters entirely.


Unless it's limited to only certain key areas, I think it's better laid off to rest.

It would probably be limited to key areas anyway. You could get really detailed and have the recovery rate differ if (for example) your character was walking on a stone pathway rather than the nearby grass, but practically only larger difference would be noticed by most people. Even then, potions could be the main source of mana (at least during battles, and depending on price / availability), with people not paying a lot of attention to their mana levels while walking around exploring.

This could be an interesting difference between classes or races, but in that case you would have to make sure there were areas that each character type would find easier or harder, or there would need to be a party, so individual strengths and weaknesses could be balanced. This could more easily be applied to opponents (ie provoke a magical swamp monster into leaving the water and it could be much easier to defeat), though it wouldn't necessarily be the best way to differentiate them or modify their behaviour.

Re: Could be a good original idea #326692
02/12/07 04:28 PM
02/12/07 04:28 PM
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Quote:

The game needs to "remember" the mana regeneration rate for the different walkpoints the player passes through.

The game would have to change music and environmental sounds (etc) when changing areas anyway, so changing regeneration rate should not be too hard, as long as it is constant within each major area. If there are going to be variations (a cursed building with a lower regeneration than the surrounding forest, or an oasis with higher rate than the desert) perhaps those areas could be designed as a mini-level.




Oh, that's true. But that's a lot of extra programming, isn't it? After all, aren't there a lot of places in a 3d gameworld?

Quote:


Whether you would want to vary the regeneration rate (effecting specific character builds much more than others) or if this feature would be the best use of resources during development are other matters entirely.


Again, sounds like even more programming especially when you want to take into account the various character builds, classes, skills, etc. Geez...

Yeah, I was actually thinking more along the development resources. Unless this feature is part of a larger system which affects spells and other abilities, it does seem kinda unwarranted. But it could be a very special feature that's given to the player as a reward.

Or a temporary special feature like a mana booster: you click on a device and it'll reward with both vitality and mana regen speed-up. Or this could even be a skill that you can learn.


Quote:


Unless it's limited to only certain key areas, I think it's better laid off to rest.

It would probably be limited to key areas anyway. You could get really detailed and have the recovery rate differ if (for example) your character was walking on a stone pathway rather than the nearby grass, but practically only larger difference would be noticed by most people. Even then, potions could be the main source of mana (at least during battles, and depending on price / availability), with people not paying a lot of attention to their mana levels while walking around exploring.



Whoa... that sounds really detailed! But is it really necessary? It sounds like overkill, a trademark of some games where they spend so much $$$ on developing some "super-powerful system" but the plot is barely there or the rest of the game is just plain boring. I guess it's up to Larian to balance it out so the system is detailed yet doesn't collapse under all that intricate complexity.

I'd prefer having just potions or some skills that would help speed up mana-regen, that's all. And oh, while we're on the topic of regeneration, I wonder IF Larian could also have some basic vitality regeneration as well. I recall that vitality regen was also a skill under Survivors but perhaps, all characters could have a basic stat for this.

Quote:



This could be an interesting difference between classes or races, but in that case you would have to make sure there were areas that each character type would find easier or harder, or there would need to be a party, so individual strengths and weaknesses could be balanced. This could more easily be applied to opponents (ie provoke a magical swamp monster into leaving the water and it could be much easier to defeat), though it wouldn't necessarily be the best way to differentiate them or modify their behaviour.




Hmmm... I agree that could sound interesting. Although it sounds kinda complicated to me, if Larian manages to implement that, good luck! ^_^

Though I'd prefer Larian program abilities or skills which would have similar results but which could be applied to different situations and which would have many purposes.

Speaking of stuff to put in DD 2, I just thought of a mana-sucking trap which drains the opponent's mana and stores it so that you can use it: viola! Your insta-mana factory!

Re: Could be a good original idea #326693
02/12/07 11:54 PM
02/12/07 11:54 PM
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But that's a lot of extra programming, isn't it? After all, aren't there a lot of places in a 3d gameworld?

Just changing the regeneration rate would not depend on the number of regions. Once you have a variable in place to modify the base regeneration, it would just be a question of changing that variable at each transition.

However, balancing the game for mage characters with a variable regeneration rate would be much more work.

Also, conceptually this idea works well for nature based magic (wind, lightning, etc) but the spell system would have to be designed from the start with this in mind. Any magic that isn't manipulating natural forces (teleportation, summoning) at least implies that the mana required isn't necessarily coming from natural sources.


Yeah, I was actually thinking more along the development resources. Unless this feature is part of a larger system which affects spells and other abilities, it does seem kinda unwarranted.

Agreed. It is a good idea (balancing issues aside) and feasible, but not very practical.


Or a temporary special feature like a mana booster: you click on a device and it'll reward with both vitality and mana regen speed-up. Or this could even be a skill that you can learn.

In Beyond Divinity, regeneration was a secondary stat, which determined your health recovery rate and, to a lesser extent, your mana recovery rate (intelligence was the primary factor for that).

There could be temporary or permanent regeneration modifiers, but if we are going to evolve away from the original idea, I think other stats might be more appropriate and have less potential balancing issues. In DD, after I picked up the Halberd of the Rock in the cursed abbey, I assumed the lack of stamina regeneration was part of the abbey's curse, rather than the halberd. A lack of stamina could hurt melee character more than mages or archers in open areas, and vise versa in confined spaces, but I don't think this would be a big balancing problem. A swamp could be covered with a poisonous mist; mages might be more vulnerable to poison than high hit point warriors, but would presumably have healing or shield spells to compensate.
Similar large scale area effects could be good features in DD2, assuming they were designed well.

I vaguely remember an old console game (Ultima?) where certain areas were blocked off with 4 different types of traps. Some spots you could get to if your characters had enough hit points and you you made sure you took the shortest route, but with others you had to reach a certain shrine (or something) to get a protective ward (brand or maybe tattoo, IIRC) so you would no longer take damage from that type of trap.
Unlike that game I would not want this to be used as an artificial way to direct the player along a path, but it could make exploring more interesting, or allow certain areas to be easier or harder depending on your previous actions (help an innocent lizardman accused of a crime and the merchants in that town might double their prices for you, but on reaching the swamp town, you might be shown the herb to counter the poisonous mist).


Whoa... that sounds really detailed! But is it really necessary? It sounds like overkill

There are games where your walking speed or the sounds of your footsteps vary based on the surface you are on. My point was that something similar could be done for mana regeneration, but that it would not be very noticeable, and so not worth the effort.

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