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Two English reviews of the German version #374083
04/08/09 11:21 AM
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JonasKyratzes Offline OP
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Hi,

My wife and I wrote a couple of reviews of the German version.

http://verenakyratzes.wordpress.com/2009/08/02/divinity-ii-ego-draconis/

http://www.jonas-kyratzes.net/?p=668

Hope this is interesting to someone.


Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #374094
04/08/09 11:33 AM
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despite not being "official reviews", i'm always interested in the general publics opinion

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: katar] #374106
04/08/09 11:59 AM
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 Quote:
"Not the kind from Japan, with half-naked twelve year old girls called Simon as protagonists."


LOL!


Tweeting @forktong
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: ForkTong] #374161
04/08/09 01:40 PM
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Seems to go in-line with most of the german reviews so far. A good game, with some flaws that prevent him from being a super-mega-hit.

Hope that larian can make some patches before the international release with some sound changes on the games' flaws.

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Adomingues] #374255
04/08/09 04:23 PM
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 Originally Posted By: Adomingues
Seems to go in-line with most of the german reviews so far. A good game, with some flaws that prevent him from being a super-mega-hit.

Hope that larian can make some patches before the international release with some sound changes on the games' flaws.


Yes, though I think that the flaws that we focus on are not actually the same as with some of the magazines (haven't read all the reviews, so I can't say). And we'd both give the game a considerably higher rating, if we were into that sort of thinking.


Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #374264
04/08/09 04:41 PM
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Both are well written and informative reviews. Thank you.

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: ironcreed] #374295
04/08/09 04:59 PM
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From all the reviews I've read, it seems like combat is the only real tarnish this game has. A few nit-pick here and there about various things, but not enough to make a sizable complaint about it.

I'm hoping that combat can be improved upon before we get the English version. Though I'm not sure if that is logically possible now.

BTW: it wasn't combat in Divinity: Sword of Lies that made me love the game so much, though combat in it was fun, except for some bosses that were too over powered (spider in bottom of Aleroth Dungeon). I'm still planning on buying Divinity 2 when it comes to the states.

Last edited by LightningLockey; 04/08/09 05:02 PM.

Every time there I run into trouble on the road, there is always a dwarf at the bottom of it. Don't they know how to drive above ground?
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: LightningLockey] #374305
04/08/09 05:15 PM
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 Originally Posted By: LightningLockey
From all the reviews I've read, it seems like combat is the only real tarnish this game has. A few nit-pick here and there about various things, but not enough to make a sizable complaint about it.

I'm hoping that combat can be improved upon before we get the English version. Though I'm not sure if that is logically possible now.

BTW: it wasn't combat in Divinity: Sword of Lies that made me love the game so much, though combat in it was fun, except for some bosses that were too over powered (spider in bottom of Aleroth Dungeon). I'm still planning on buying Divinity 2 when it comes to the states.



Indeed, targeting and combat mostly. A simple "tab targeting" would suffice to make it better imho, eh eh eh....


About the 2 reviews on the topic at hand, thanks for them, very refreshing to not having to understand google translator trying to read the german reviews ;\)

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Adomingues] #383124
05/09/09 12:15 PM
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A small update from us: we finished the game, and my wife has written about her reaction to the ending and some overall flaws:

http://verenakyratzes.wordpress.com/2009...ive-review-but/

(We do still like the game, though.)

I'm going to write a considerably longer article from a game designer's perspective one of these days, going into more analytical detail on what I thought didn't work and how it could (theoretically) be fixed. But that may well not be of interest to most of you, and my wife's article is both funnier and more to the point, so if you enjoyed the first one go ahead and read this.

Last edited by JonasKyratzes; 05/09/09 12:17 PM.

Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #383148
05/09/09 02:34 PM
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Adomingues Offline
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 Originally Posted By: JonasKyratzes
A small update from us: we finished the game, and my wife has written about her reaction to the ending and some overall flaws:

http://verenakyratzes.wordpress.com/2009...ive-review-but/

(We do still like the game, though.)

I'm going to write a considerably longer article from a game designer's perspective one of these days, going into more analytical detail on what I thought didn't work and how it could (theoretically) be fixed. But that may well not be of interest to most of you, and my wife's article is both funnier and more to the point, so if you enjoyed the first one go ahead and read this.


Dont know if you are aware (you probably are), but larian is releasing a major patch soon (tm), would be nice if you write something afterwards, if the patch corrects some of the things you dont find as good in the game.


Thanks again for the time invested in the reviews!

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Adomingues] #383158
05/09/09 04:02 PM
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 Originally Posted By: Adomingues

Dont know if you are aware (you probably are), but larian is releasing a major patch soon (tm), would be nice if you write something afterwards, if the patch corrects some of the things you dont find as good in the game.


Thanks again for the time invested in the reviews!


We shall have a look when it comes out and provide an opinion. But really - the game is still quite good, and I think the anger or disappointment we felt was due to the fact that we were actually immersed. The gameplay criticisms are important because, well, they're valid, but that doesn't mean that the game is not worth buying.

I still prefer Divinity's fighting system to Oblivion's by a mile. Oblivion felt very cool at first, but once it gets to the point where every enemy takes a trillion hits to die... gragh!


Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #383161
05/09/09 04:35 PM
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I always felt Oblivion was very crappy in terms of combat. It was like a weaker version of Mount&Blade with less options. Morrowind's combat system was absolutely horrible, and Bethesda promised a much better one... but they changed details and kept the biggest problems it had.

Certainly nothing like, for instance, Gothic II.

I'm hoping for something to come out that is like a mixture of Prince of Persia: Sands of Time and Gothic II.

That would be an awesome combat system. The moves of prince of persia, both arms separately controlled, coupled with the style upgrades of Gothic II. *licks lips*

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: swordscythe] #383266
06/09/09 10:17 AM
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 Originally Posted By: swordscythe
I always felt Oblivion was very crappy in terms of combat. It was like a weaker version of Mount&Blade with less options. Morrowind's combat system was absolutely horrible, and Bethesda promised a much better one... but they changed details and kept the biggest problems it had.

Certainly nothing like, for instance, Gothic II.

I'm hoping for something to come out that is like a mixture of Prince of Persia: Sands of Time and Gothic II.

That would be an awesome combat system. The moves of prince of persia, both arms separately controlled, coupled with the style upgrades of Gothic II. *licks lips*


Ah, Gothic II... possibly the best RPG I have ever played. And a great combat system, too - frustrating at first, but so wonderful once you get the hang of it.

One of the most enjoyable combat systems I've ever experienced, by the way, was in Dark Messiah of Might and Magic, which is an incredibly underrated game. The combat there was so visceral, so physical... and often absolutely hilarious. There's nothing like being able to kick your enemies into some spikes, or down a cliff, while giggling maniacally. That game also had a great stealth system. If you're willing to put in the time to get used to the controls, it's totally worth playing.


Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #385165
13/09/09 01:53 PM
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 Quote:
Because, you see, Ygerna wants to be resurrected. Damian wants Ygerna resurrected, although he doesn’t know he does.

Warning, Spoiler:
What a b***it. From the start of the game - that was the whole Damian's plot. He acted like he doesn't (pretty obvious, because resurrecting means death for Damian since he inverted the Sould Forge spell; this, actually, a lie spread by Damian itself, I believe) because he wanted to make Dragon Knight (protagonist) and Zandalor do the job (the Damian itself wasn't the dragon descendant so he wasn't able to do some things) for him. As we can see in the end-cutscene he is not surprised (not even a little) that Ygrena has awoke, because he waited for it since his plan succeeded.
How in the hell these "reviewers" come to such incorrect conclusion - hard to imagine for me.


Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Kein] #385262
13/09/09 09:28 PM
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Could people please not talk about the end of the game in a forum where most people have not even played it yet?????


Any plot or quest specific information / discussion should be confined to the Help/Tips/Tricks forum.

Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Kein] #385709
15/09/09 11:47 PM
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 Originally Posted By: Kein

Warning, Spoiler:
What a b***it. From the start of the game - that was the whole Damian's plot. He acted like he doesn't (pretty obvious, because resurrecting means death for Damian since he inverted the Sould Forge spell; this, actually, a lie spread by Damian itself, I believe) because he wanted to make Dragon Knight (protagonist) and Zandalor do the job (the Damian itself wasn't the dragon descendant so he wasn't able to do some things) for him. As we can see in the end-cutscene he is not surprised (not even a little) that Ygrena has awoke, because he waited for it since his plan succeeded.
How in the hell these "reviewers" come to such incorrect conclusion - hard to imagine for me.


Warning, Spoiler:
I'm sorry, did you play the game before you went and started offending people you don't know on the internet? And did you play the same version of the game that we did, in a language you are capable of understanding? The game's dialogue EXPLICITLY STATES that he did not know anything and that he is surprised. In fact, the dialogue IN THE CUTSCENE YOU MENTION explicitly states it. This is not a matter of interpretation or of missing clues that point to the real plot - the text of the game specifically describes what has happened, and Damian's role in these events.



Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #386153
19/09/09 07:49 AM
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Warning, Spoiler:

 Quote:
I'm sorry, did you play the game before you went and started offending people you don't know on the internet?

If you have found an offending part in my words - congratulation, because I didn't put a piece in that. But oh well.., I'm sorry, really, if I did offend you.
 Quote:
and that he is surprised.

Yes, he was surprised that it wasn't he who resurrected her, that's all. Yes, he didn't know that the main goal of Zandalor and protagonist is to resurrect Ygerna, not to destroy her soul, but... read below ->
 Quote:
The game's dialogue EXPLICITLY STATES that he did not know anything

What he didn't know? He didn't know that he wants to resurrect Ygerna? He didn't know that he asked the "old lizard" (as he calls the Patriarch) to open Hall of Echoes for him? What else he didn't know, tell me.

Here is the original quotes from the end scene with Divine One:
No, Dragon Knight, Ygrena's life is Damian's invincibility as I learned from my accursed son himself. They have been questing for the same outcome from within the Hall of Echoes and from without.
and
Ygrena was the first to triumph.
"...AS I LEARNED FROM MY ACCURSED SON HIMSELF..."
"...YGRENA WAS THE FIRST..."
(But ofc, you're still saying he didn't know about that too - fine, you won, lol)

So, as you said: "This is not a matter of interpretation or of missing clues that point to the real plot - the text of the game specifically describes what has happened, and Damian's role in these events."
^^- Completely correct, re-read your own words :P


Last edited by Kein; 19/09/09 07:51 AM. Reason: spoiler tags >_<
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Kein] #386224
19/09/09 07:39 PM
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Warning, Spoiler:
In what way does anything you just posted contradict what we said, or somehow prove correct your criticsm of our reviews? The question was not whether Damian would like to resurrect Ygerna or not. Of course he would - but he failed at it, and she didn't. And he didn't know that she was acting through the player character.

You wrote:
 Quote:
because he wanted to make Dragon Knight (protagonist) and Zandalor do the job (the Damian itself wasn't the dragon descendant so he wasn't able to do some things) for him.

But before you wrote:
 Quote:
Yes, he didn't know that the main goal of Zandalor and protagonist is to resurrect Ygerna, not to destroy her soul


So what exactly is going on here? Because the game pretty explicitly states that both Ygerna and Damian were trying to achieve the same thing, but Damian failed where Ygerna didn't. Because he had no idea what she was doing. He wasn't using Zandalor and the player character, because he didn't know they were being used by his girlfriend. That's why he is surprised at the end of the game.

 Quote:
As we can see in the end-cutscene he is not surprised (not even a little) that Ygrena has awoke, because he waited for it since his plan succeeded.

And yet again... yes he is surprised, because it quite specifically wasn't his plan, it was hers, and they couldn't communicate. He had no idea what was going on.

So what's your point? I'm starting to think that you've simply stumbled over the simple fact that when my wife wrote that "Ygerna wants to be resurrected. Damian wants Ygerna resurrected, although he doesn’t know he does." she was simply being sarcastic about Damian's ineptness and the fact that he doesn't realize what the player character's actions would actually cause.


Last edited by JonasKyratzes; 19/09/09 07:41 PM.

Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: JonasKyratzes] #386228
19/09/09 08:07 PM
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Warning, Spoiler:

 Quote:
my wife wrote that "Ygerna wants to be resurrected. Damian wants Ygerna resurrected, although he doesn’t know he does." she was simply being sarcastic about Damian's ineptness and the fact that he doesn't realize what the player character's actions would actually cause.

Nice explanation but what in the hell does it changes if it's a sarcasm? Some kinda like an excuse for such words or what?
Seriously, the statement like "Damian wants Ygerna resurrected, although he doesn’t know he does." made me lol. He does, he want and it is pretty clear, the game plot (via dialogs/books/cutscenes) DIRECTLY says that. I failed to see a reason for a sarcasm here, actually, there is NONE at all.

If you're going to criticize a game plot you'd better to understand it. Otherwise, if you dislike it or don't get it - doesn't mean the plot is bad (but yeah, D2 plot line is no so good tbh).

Just better to think uber9k times before to call your opinion a review :P


Re: Two English reviews of the German version [Re: Kein] #386233
19/09/09 09:07 PM
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Warning, Spoiler:
 Quote:
Nice explanation but what in the hell does it changes if it's a sarcasm? Some kinda like an excuse for such words or what?

Do you understand the meaning of sarcasm?

 Quote:
Seriously, the statement like "Damian wants Ygerna resurrected, although he doesn’t know he does." made me lol. He does, he want and it is pretty clear, the game plot (via dialogs/books/cutscenes) DIRECTLY says that. I failed to see a reason for a sarcasm here, actually, there is NONE at all.

And again, do you understand the concept of sarcasm? The review did not say that he does not want to resurrect Ygerna. It simply made sarcastic reference to Damian's lack of understanding as to what is actually going on.

 Quote:
If you're going to criticize a game plot you'd better to understand it. Otherwise, if you dislike it or don't get it - doesn't mean the plot is bad (but yeah, D2 plot line is no so good tbh).

If you're going to criticize a review you'd better understand it. Otherwise, if you don't like it or don't get it, that doesn't mean the review is bad, only that your language or comprehension skills are lacking.

 Quote:
Just better to think uber9k times before to call your opinion a review :P

 Quote:
review
–noun
1. a critical article or report, as in a periodical, on a book, play, recital, or the like; critique; evaluation.

A detailed critique or evaluation (thus, the writer's opinion) is by definition a review. Stop trying to offend us by saying that what we wrote does not constitute a review; that is simply absurd. If you find the phrasing of one sarcastic remark to be unfortunate, fine, but that is no reason to belittle the reasoned opinion of others. We played the game carefully and paid attention to plot and dialogue; these texts represent our evaluation of the game and its story.


Last edited by JonasKyratzes; 19/09/09 09:07 PM.

Jonas Kyratzes - writer, game designer, filmmaker, person with cat
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